Justin Upton is a huge disappointment!

[BC867]

Upton's ground out to second to bring in Kelly Johnson was very encouraging. Hit the ball on the ground to the opposite field with a man on 3rd -- excellent productive out and just good at-bat. Very encouraging.

I am rooting for Gibby and Justin to make it happen. if Upton is turning the corner, it will be fun to watch.

 

[CardEd]

Game winning walk off hit for J-Up tonight

 

[Gaddabout]

Game winning walk off hit for J-Up tonight

That was as much of a show of his strength as the ball he hit into Friday's. Broken bat bloop 150 feet down the right field line -- you have to be pretty strong to muscle a ball like that when you've been sawed off with a good slider.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Game winning walk off hit for J-Up tonight

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[AZ Native]

Upton's ground out to second to bring in Kelly Johnson was very encouraging. Hit the ball on the ground to the opposite field with a man on 3rd -- excellent productive out and just good at-bat. Very encouraging.

I agree with that. Basic fundamental baseball. Good at bat by Upton. Even better when he got the bat on the ball for the winning hit. Happy to see it.

 

[devilalum]

Awesome!

 

[dogpoo32]

Nice comeback. I was fully expecting them to lose a few in a row after that streak, but they found a way. Nice at bat for Upton.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Everyone knows fans in Arizona are not the most informed group of people.

That has (perhaps) a little truth to it but not enough to justify using it in this situation. I think we recognize hustle and effort as well as fans anywhere. That comment might still hold up when you're talking about the nuances of how to behave as a crowd in support of your team but it's less true today (by far) than when that comment first circulated more than a decade ago. Keep in mind, many of those same fans started out attending games elsewhere and they didn't just become idiots when they showed up in Arizona.

Steve

 

[azsportsfan01]

That has (perhaps) a little truth to it but not enough to justify using it in this situation. I think we recognize hustle and effort as well as fans anywhere. That comment might still hold up when you're talking about the nuances of how to behave as a crowd in support of your team but it's less true today (by far) than when that comment first circulated more than a decade ago. Keep in mind, many of those same fans started out attending games elsewhere and they didn't just become idiots when they showed up in Arizona.

Steve

The reason people say it is the fact that Arizona is still a young baseball town. Yes we have had spring training and minor league ball for a while but those are not the same. People have come here from other parts of the country that were baseball fans but there is also a large number of new baseball fans who have no idea how to act and what to watch for during a game. Now that the D-Backs have been here for more than a decade it isn't as bad as it used to be but nowhere near many of the other baseball cities across the country.

 

[Gaddabout]

There are great baseball towns like St. Louis, where people still keep scorecards and every nuance is noticed. They pack the house, they cheer en masse at things only hardcore baseball fans notice, and generally provide a positive experience for the baseball players of both teams. They're always engaged in the game itself and not just the exciting plays. When a pitcher is over 100 pitches but guts himself out of a 7th-inning jam, they will ALWAYS give a standing ovation because they're all aware of what's going on.

That takes 100 years to develop a culture like that, and I think it's fair to say D-Backs fans have a long way to go before they get there -- because we've only been at it for a little more than a decade. Not a fair comparison. I broil at the notion we're BAD fans. The 20K loyal who show up to every game are generally good. It's the next 20K who are going out of curiosity and lack game knowledge or are just there to drink beer and look at the green grass -- and they only show up when the team is good.

 

[azsportsfan01]

There are great baseball towns like St. Louis, where people still keep scorecards and every nuance is noticed. They pack the house, they cheer en masse at things only hardcore baseball fans notice, and generally provide a positive experience for the baseball players of both teams. They're always engaged in the game itself and not just the exciting plays. When a pitcher is over 100 pitches but guts himself out of a 7th-inning jam, they will ALWAYS give a standing ovation because they're all aware of what's going on.

That takes 100 years to develop a culture like that, and I think it's fair to say D-Backs fans have a long way to go before they get there -- because we've only been at it for a little more than a decade. Not a fair comparison. I broil at the notion we're BAD fans. The 20K loyal who show up to every game are generally good. It's the next 20K who are going out of curiosity and lack game knowledge or are just there to drink beer and look at the green grass -- and they only show up when the team is good.

And that is the reason I said we are not a very informed fan base, not bad fans. When we have a packed house Arizona rivals any place in atmosphere and noise.

 

[187]

At the end of the day he is still 23 years old and you can't sit here and write him off for the rest of his career when he is 4 years away from hitting the beginning of his prime. Crazy talk. He is a streaky player, like a lot of young guys, but the numbers are there. He is on pace for around 33/100/100 with 30 steals. His average is low right now but he's getting pretty damn unlucky on his babip (batting avg on balls in play). His babip is currently .287 and his career average is .338 and it was .354 and .360 the past two years. His line drive rate is right around where it normally is, so his average should rise assuming his babip levels out which it should.

 

[Bert]

And that is the reason I said we are not a very informed fan base, not bad fans. When we have a packed house Arizona rivals any place in atmosphere and noise.

I have to agree with this statement. AZ doesn't get really up for a team unless they are winning. That's true in most places but the fans of AZ can certainly take pride in the fact that when they do show up for the teams, we bring the noise.

 

[Catfish]

THIS: Justin Upton WAS a huge disappointment.

 

[sundevil04]

23 years old on pace for a 30/30 season....disappointment???

 

[Diamondback Jay]

At the end of the day he is still 23 years old and you can't sit here and write him off for the rest of his career when he is 4 years away from hitting the beginning of his prime. Crazy talk. He is a streaky player, like a lot of young guys, but the numbers are there. He is on pace for around 33/100/100 with 30 steals. His average is low right now but he's getting pretty damn unlucky on his babip (batting avg on balls in play). His babip is currently .287 and his career average is .338 and it was .354 and .360 the past two years. His line drive rate is right around where it normally is, so his average should rise assuming his babip levels out which it should.

He's hitting .272 for his career, with 71 homers, 238 RBI and 52 stolen bases on top of what you mentioned.. I don't know what the hell people are expecting for a kid at 23 years old. He's done very well for himself.

 

[Catfish]

He's hitting .272 for his career, with 71 homers, 238 RBI and 52 stolen bases on top of what you mentioned.. I don't know what the hell people are expecting for a kid at 23 years old. He's done very well for himself.

Yes, that is correct, BUT he was hitting .130 for most of April and part of May. The worst part about it was that he seemed totally disconnected from the team, and was all about swinging for the fences. I was on him heavily then, and I will say that he has turned that around remarkably.

As much as I was on him then, I acknowledge that he is no longer playing like that. I love that he has apparently grasped his role on this team, and has bought into, (everything being about the team), and not an individual. He has broken out in a big way, (you can't hardly get bigger than a 5 hit game). To his credit, he has become a valued asset to this organization, and has taken his team-mates as family. That is a huge change from how he WAS playing, and should be recognized for turning his play, (and his effort), around. At one point during last night's game, he was batting 12 for his last 21 at bats. Boys and girls, that is a .571 clip, and he is simply putting the ball in play, and letting the HR's come where they may. Keep up the good work young man.

 

[82CardsGrad]

He's hitting .272 for his career, with 71 homers, 238 RBI and 52 stolen bases on top of what you mentioned.. I don't know what the hell people are expecting for a kid at 23 years old. He's done very well for himself.

'09 was his high watermark thus far, batting .300 with 26 HR's and 86 RBI's. He dropped off significantly last season and for most of this season, was even worse than he was in 2010. I won't even mention his defensive issues along with an apparent attitude issue.

Upton, for better or worse, comes with huge expectations. While many times placing that level of expectation on someone is wrong, it's not here. He's got all-world talent. And he's shown no signs of even coming close to maximizing that talent. Yes, he's only 23 - he'll be 24 in 2 months or so. However, he seems to not be progressing/getting better. After 3 1/2 seasons in the bigs, it's right to expect to see progression from a guy with this type of talent/skills.
Averaging 20 HR's, hitting .270 with 69 RBI's per season is simply NOT equal to his talent level... not even close. Therefore, he's been a disappointment.

 

[Catfish]

'09 was his high watermark thus far, batting .300 with 26 HR's and 86 RBI's. He dropped off significantly last season and for most of this season, was even worse than he was in 2010. I won't even mention his defensive issues along with an apparent attitude issue.

Upton, for better or worse, comes with huge expectations. While many times placing that level of expectation on someone is wrong, it's not here. He's got all-world talent. And he's shown no signs of even coming close to maximizing that talent. Yes, he's only 23 - he'll be 24 in 2 months or so. However, he seems to not be progressing/getting better. After 3 1/2 seasons in the bigs, it's right to expect to see progression from a guy with this type of talent/skills.
Averaging 20 HR's, hitting .270 with 69 RBI's per season is simply NOT equal to his talent level... not even close. Therefore, he's been a disappointment.

While I can understand how you feel about his progress, he has NEVER before shown the attitude that he has the past two weeks or so. It is clear that Gibby has been working with him on this, and while it is not yet clear that he has totally bought into the program, he HAS made a huge step in that direction. His demeanor, (on and off the field), recently has been impeccable. His effort, on the field has been exactly what Gibby spoke of some weeks back, of getting Upton to simply put the bat on the ball, and let the HR's fall where they may. He has done just that, and is suddenly a real team-mate with the others. Recall how he was taken down an paddled by is team-mates after his walk-off game winning single the other night.

While I won't say his attitude for much of this season was bad, it did leave much to be desired as there was a definite disconnect with his fellow players for quite a while. That seems to be gone now, and he is doing those little things that make a huge difference, and now seems to be having fun playing ball with his team-mates. He may have been merely trying too hard to put up the big numbers so that he could be an All-Star Starter, or there may have been some other reason for his poor play earlier this year. Right now, however, he has made a really big step in the right direction, and he should be accorded all the praise that he deserves for doing so. This is a first right step toward allowing all that unused talent to come forward and dazzle the baseball world. Every journey begins with a first step, and he seems to have made a good one. If he continues on this plane, he can carry this team far.

 

[82CardsGrad]

While I can understand how you feel about his progress, he has NEVER before shown the attitude that he has the past two weeks or so. It is clear that Gibby has been working with him on this, and while it is not yet clear that he has totally bought into the program, he HAS made a huge step in that direction. His demeanor, (on and off the field), recently has been impeccable. His effort, on the field has been exactly what Gibby spoke of some weeks back, of getting Upton to simply put the bat on the ball, and let the HR's fall where they may. He has done just that, and is suddenly a real team-mate with the others. Recall how he was taken down an paddled by is team-mates after his walk-off game winning single the other night.

While I won't say his attitude for much of this season was bad, it did leave much to be desired as there was a definite disconnect with his fellow players for quite a while. That seems to be gone now, and he is doing those little things that make a huge difference, and now seems to be having fun playing ball with his team-mates. He may have been merely trying too hard to put up the big numbers so that he could be an All-Star Starter, or there may have been some other reason for his poor play earlier this year. Right now, however, he has made a really big step in the right direction, and he should be accorded all the praise that he deserves for doing so. This is a first right step toward allowing all that unused talent to come forward and dazzle the baseball world. Every journey begins with a first step, and he seems to have made a good one. If he continues on this plane, he can carry this team far.

Won't argue with any of that... he has indeed been on a very nice hot streak. And, oh by the way, his attitude seems to have improved. Funny how those two go hand in hand.
I look at a guy like Derek Jeter, who, while very talented, doesn't have half the god-given tools that Upton possesses. Yet, only thru incredible work and dedication did Jeter become an alltime great. There is no reason for Upton not to be great. It all boils down to what is happening between his ears. Hopefully, Gibby and the rest of the staff have found a way to unlock the potential and keep Upton in a good place mentally. I won't believe it however, until I see it... and a brief streak proves nothing to me. Most MLB players find a hot streak once or twice a season. Show me improvement over a season... over multiple & consecutive seasons... then I'm a believer.

 

[Catfish]

Won't argue with any of that... he has indeed been on a very nice hot streak. And, oh by the way, his attitude seems to have improved. Funny how those two go hand in hand.
I look at a guy like Derek Jeter, who, while very talented, doesn't have half the god-given tools that Upton possesses. Yet, only thru incredible work and dedication did Jeter become an alltime great. There is no reason for Upton not to be great. It all boils down to what is happening between his ears. Hopefully, Gibby and the rest of the staff have found a way to unlock the potential and keep Upton in a good place mentally. I won't believe it however, until I see it... and a brief streak proves nothing to me. Most MLB players find a hot streak once or twice a season. Show me improvement over a season... over multiple & consecutive seasons... then I'm a believer.

Agreed, its only been a couple of weeks now. For now, I am happy just to see him begin to fit in with this bunch. They are fun to watch, and I hope they start filling the stadium up with supporters. Getting to be a lot of kids at the games since school is out and that is great. This could be a really good team to grow up with.

 

[Diamondback Jay]

Issue is though, he's 23.. We're talking a guy who had a very short shelf life in the minors. Let's remember, most 23 year olds are just coming up to the majors for their first run..

Is he a complete product? Not even close.. At 23, I wouldn't expect him to be and he's got some work to do. But I'd say calling him a "huge disappointment" is majorly inaccurate.

 

[BC867]

Issue is though, he's 23.. We're talking a guy who had a very short shelf life in the minors. Let's remember, most 23 year olds are just coming up to the majors for their first run..

Is he a complete product? Not even close.. At 23, I wouldn't expect him to be and he's got some work to do. But I'd say calling him a "huge disappointment" is majorly inaccurate.

I'm thinking it might be said that Upton has had too many disappointments in the role the D'backs front office foisted upon him prematurely.

The problem has been management -- UptoWn, indeed. But the solution rests with Justin and Gibby. Hopefully, the most recent results will grow.

 

[Catfish]

Issue is though, he's 23.. We're talking a guy who had a very short shelf life in the minors. Let's remember, most 23 year olds are just coming up to the majors for their first run..

Is he a complete product? Not even close.. At 23, I wouldn't expect him to be and he's got some work to do. But I'd say calling him a "huge disappointment" is majorly inaccurate.

That is the sad part. A 23 year old may not yet have developed enough to be a complete product, BUT,(a 23 year old should be developed enough to TRY to work to improve to be a complete product). What had everybody up in arms with Upton was the fact that he seemed content to coast along at the pace he had achieved when he came into Major League Baseball. He was not working to improve from game to game, or from year to year. Nearly all 23 year olds know that you have to work to gain skills and to keep them. Upton was merely content to have achieved the bigs until just very recently. That was what was maddening to many.

 

[AzStevenCal]

That is the sad part. A 23 year old may not yet have developed enough to be a complete product, BUT,(a 23 year old should be developed enough to TRY to work to improve to be a complete product). What had everybody up in arms with Upton was the fact that he seemed content to coast along at the pace he had achieved when he came into Major League Baseball. He was not working to improve from game to game, or from year to year. Nearly all 23 year olds know that you have to work to gain skills and to keep them. Upton was merely content to have achieved the bigs until just very recently. That was what was maddening to many.

Good post.

Steve