Key Phrase in Urban's Latest Propaganda Piece

[kerouac9]

If any perform well, the Cardinals will look into extending them during the season. Regardless, as Keim reshapes the roster into his vision, he has some room to work.

Even Coach Bruce Arians sees the potential of having so many players in their free-agent-to-be years.

I've been saying for a while that Arians has little control over the makeup of this roster and the personnel moves being made by the front office. As much as the propaganda arm is a reflection of the operations within Hardy Drive, this seems to be the case.

Don't get to used to Bruce Arians and his Kangol hats; I don't expect him to be around long with the "weapons" he's being given by the front office. It won't be his fault.

Let's say that the team's offense improves slightly in 2013 and declines slightly on defense. We end up with the same record against a tough schedule. 5-11.

Next year we get a quarterback, but he struggles as rookies tend to do, especially against a strong division. 6-10.

Arians goes on the hot seat in 2015, the winter of the Cards will have 5 important pending free agents, including Patrick Peterson.

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/2015/arizona-cardinals/

 

[Finito]

I've been saying for a while that Arians has little control over the makeup of this roster and the personnel moves being made by the front office. As much as the propaganda arm is a reflection of the operations within Hardy Drive, this seems to be the case.

Don't get to used to Bruce Arians and his Kangol hats; I don't expect him to be around long with the "weapons" he's being given by the front office. It won't be his fault.

Let's say that the team's offense improves slightly in 2013 and declines slightly on defense. We end up with the same record against a tough schedule. 5-11.

Next year we get a quarterback, but he struggles as rookies tend to do, especially against a strong division. 6-10.

Arians goes on the hot seat in 2015, the winter of the Cards will have 5 important pending free agents, including Patrick Peterson.

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/2015/arizona-cardinals/

You just seem like the type of dude that's gonna complain at every turn.

 

[kerouac9]

You just seem like the type of dude that's gonna complain at every turn.

You've been registered with the board for 8 years. Are you just learning now that I take a "prove-it" attitude with the team?

Thanks for the football-driven comment, though. Some really intriguing stuff to chew on.

 

[Finito]

You've been registered with the board for 8 years. Are you just learning now that I take a "prove-it" attitude with the team?

Thanks for the football-driven comment, though. Some really intriguing stuff to chew on.

I've tried to talk to you and its just like you ignore logic. See the Kerry Rhodes talk. Bitching and complaining left and right it's like dude he turned down an extension and made it known when his contact was up he wanted to go.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong idk

 

[kerouac9]

Imma do this Cardiac-style.

I've tried to talk to you and its just like you ignore logic. See the Kerry Rhodes talk. Bitching and complaining left and right it's like dude he turned down an extension This is a fact and made it known when his contact was up he wanted to goThis is an opinion.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong idk

I don't dispute the fact that Rhodes wanted to play another year and test free agency in 2014. Whether that means "he had to go" is an opinion that is in dispute.

Especially when you look at a quote from the very piece cited in my original post, which you apparently don't want to talk about (and I didn't link to because I'm dumb--it's here--http://www.azcardinals.com/news-and-events/article-2/Churning-The-Roster/ea4a5f18-0812-4b53-a49c-d76035413f77):

It hasn’t hurt that six of the Cards’ new free agents signed one-year contracts, largely because they were hoping for bigger money in free agency and want a chance to test the market again next season.

...

“Some of the guys are looking to prove it and get paid, which tells me they will be playing their tails off,” Arians said. “To me, it’s the best 11 for first-and-10, the best 11 for nickel, dime, I don’t care how long they signed for or how they got here. First-round pick or all-pro, they have to show it on the grass.”

There's no disputing that not factoring cost into the equation, Kerry Rhodes is a better player than Yeremiah Bell. I'd prefer to have a more talented player working his tail off in a contract year than a less talented player doing the same.

But that's just me--an Arizona Cardinals fan who wants to watch competitive football in 2013 while maintaining cost flexibility for 2014.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I've tried to talk to you and its just like you ignore logic. See the Kerry Rhodes talk. Bitching and complaining left and right it's like dude he turned down an extension and made it known when his contact was up he wanted to go.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong idk

Ignoring logic?

Let me guess, this "logic" is your opinion on something, and he is ignorant for not agreeing with it.

Need a step ladder to get off that horse?

 

[THESMEL]

Well I thought we was going to stand pat this year- to get out of salary cab jail that Whiz and Graves put us in- We cut a lot of talent - and the entire 2ndary that made our 28th run defense a top 5 defense!

But PP, Dwash and CC are the new defensive core with Dwill needing to step up.

So we didn't stand pat- Keim is so much closer to NFL mainstream than Gravers ever was- as proof look at the 1-100 FA Grades that ESPN produces now - that I've been scorched for doing for years now- We have increased or maintained our talent level grades by player and unit - while getting out of salary cap jail- We were over cap- it was not an option-

Now pull up your big girl panties and quit whining like a lil witch. compare the grades we lost to the grades we gained - then take a look at the grades of the division teams we face- I'm glad I have a 1-100 starting point on free agents - and draftees- but I still apply it to contracted players.

FA grade link
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/freeagency/index?year=2013&team=22

 

[Crimson Warrior]

You just seem like the type of dude that's gonna complain at every turn.

Pfffft.

The current version of k9 is drunk on kool aid compared to the 2002/2003 version. Trust me on that one Chief.

 

[Finito]

Imma do this Cardiac-style.



I don't dispute the fact that Rhodes wanted to play another year and test free agency in 2014. Whether that means "he had to go" is an opinion that is in dispute.

Especially when you look at a quote from the very piece cited in my original post, which you apparently don't want to talk about (and I didn't link to because I'm dumb--it's here--http://www.azcardinals.com/news-and-events/article-2/Churning-The-Roster/ea4a5f18-0812-4b53-a49c-d76035413f77):



There's no disputing that not factoring cost into the equation, Kerry Rhodes is a better player than Yeremiah Bell. I'd prefer to have a more talented player working his tail off in a contract year than a less talented player doing the same.

But that's just me--an Arizona Cardinals fan who wants to watch competitive football in 2013 while maintaining cost flexibility for 2014.

You know what your right. I didn't think of it that way. Sorry that's my fault. In all my years paying attention to sports when a guy turns down a contact extension and says yeah you know I'd really like to see what else is out there, that pretty much means they don't want to be there. Your either in or your out.

If I'm an owner and I'm already over paying you and on top of that I want to extend you, you look at me and tell me and tell me no. There is only one real way to take that. Is he really that much better than Bell? This is not Ed Reed here.

Jurecki was on the radio saying how Rhodes really screwed himself because the market that he thought was there isn't. I notice he's still unemployed, how much you wans bet he doesn't get the money or the years the cardinals were offering

And I really like Rhodes

 

[Finito]

Ignoring logic?

Let me guess, this "logic" is your opinion on something, and he is ignorant for not agreeing with it.

Need a step ladder to get off that horse?

No I'm good I think I'm going to stay up here

 

[JeffGollin]

Darren works for the Cardinals. A main part of his job is to get the news out about the Cardinals. I think he does this well. It stands to reason that he's not going to be critical of the people who pay him. But it's to his credit that IMO, he seldom if ever hands out heavy doses of Kool-Aid either.

I disagree with K-9's depiction of Darren's output as "propaganda pieces." It's inaccurate and it's unfair.

 

[Cards Czar]

I've tried to talk to you and its just like you ignore logic. See the Kerry Rhodes talk. Bitching and complaining left and right it's like dude he turned down an extension and made it known when his contact was up he wanted to go.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong idk

Finito, don't let him get to you. Remember its his propaganda to do what he does.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Pfffft.

The current version of k9 is drunk on kool aid compared to the 2002/2003 version. Trust me on that one Chief.

+1,000,000

Still not even sure its the same guy.

Could be the son of K9, or some apprentice type craziness.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

No I'm good I think I'm going to stay up here

Fair enough. At least its known where you stand.

Looking forward to you posting some really in depth some to spread that vast knowledge. I'll keep an eye out for it.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

You know what your right. I didn't think of it that way. Sorry that's my fault. In all my years paying attention to sports when a guy turns down a contact extension and says yeah you know I'd really like to see what else is out there, that pretty much means they don't want to be there. Your either in or your out.

If I'm an owner and I'm already over paying you and on top of that I want to extend you, you look at me and tell me and tell me no. There is only one real way to take that. Is he really that much better than Bell? This is not Ed Reed here.

Jurecki was on the radio saying how Rhodes really screwed himself because the market that he thought was there isn't. I notice he's still unemployed, how much you wans bet he doesn't get the money or the years the cardinals were offering

And I really like Rhodes

30 years old and doesn't want to wait around for a team to rebuild.

Say what you want, Rhodes is better then what we have combined on this roster at safety. The team would be better with him on the field, and he has consistently made plays for the Cardinals while he was here. It is a loss in talent.

Personally, I don't see the issue & don't really care he is gone. This team is built for an at best 7-9 right now. Rhodes isn't changing that. But, I don't see how the opinion is not justified for his value.

Right now with Johnson and Bell, we went from one of the best safety tandems in the NFL (and that defense last year justifies that,IMO) to one of the bottom teams in the NFL. Rashad Johnson showed some POTENTIAL in his role with the team. But it has been one good year, and his first year starting. Yeremiah Bell is 37 years old, and a backup. That is a hard sell.

Besides Darren Urban who said Rhodes wanted to leave? Just curious cause I didn't see it stated any where else.

Urban has written A LOT of things about players after they left and it has wreaked of justification for some player leaving. Boldin being a good example.

I don't have a problem with it 99% of the time, my exception is when he wrongly calls out his own fanbase, his frickin' bread & butter. Urban is what he is and he does a really good job, IMO but he is paid by the Cardinals to put out what THEY want to be put out on that website. Nothing wrong with that and for obvious reasons. I just personally take it with a grain of salt, to each his own.

 

[40yearfan]

I've been saying for a while that Arians has little control over the makeup of this roster and the personnel moves being made by the front office. As much as the propaganda arm is a reflection of the operations within Hardy Drive, this seems to be the case.

Don't get to used to Bruce Arians and his Kangol hats; I don't expect him to be around long with the "weapons" he's being given by the front office. It won't be his fault.

Let's say that the team's offense improves slightly in 2013 and declines slightly on defense. We end up with the same record against a tough schedule. 5-11.

Next year we get a quarterback, but he struggles as rookies tend to do, especially against a strong division. 6-10.

Arians goes on the hot seat in 2015, the winter of the Cards will have 5 important pending free agents, including Patrick Peterson.

http://www.spotrac.com/free-agents/nfl/2015/arizona-cardinals/

K9, are you saying the front office is doing all the hiring and Arians has no say about the FA's they have hired?

 

[Catfish]

K-9, I believe that you are hanging an awful lot on the phrase, (as Keim reshapes the roster into his vision). Taking that to mean that BA has little to say about the personnel he is being given seems to be without a whole lot of merit.

If indeed BA has no influence on incoming personnel, why do each of them seem to have personal connections to either BA or some member of his staff, (or both). BA seems to be totally happy with the acquisitions being made, and has gone to much length to talk about the individual attributes of each new hire as they came aboard.

That one little phrase seems likely to be more a loosely worded one to cover for the fact that these decisions are really a team effort. After all, much, much more has been written about these decisions being Cardinal's Decisions, and are not attributed to any one person. With all that has been disclosed about how this management group studied the lists of available players; then how they looked to their roster to determine who was causing cap problems; then they selected players to replace those cut with comparable players, (already known to the new staff). It would seem out of place to put all the decision making on Keim, simply because he is the one who pulls the trigger as GM of the management group.

I am not saying that Keim doesn't have a great deal of influence here, but to conclude that he is the one making all the selections without assistance from the scouting department AND the Coaching Staff seems to me to be a little far fetched. Also, to place so much credence to one small phrase, when we do not even know the exact context it was meant for, seems weak. The writer actually could be referring to the fact that Keim has room to work because he has made money available, as opposed to the fact that he alone makes all the decisions.

 

[kerouac9]

Darren works for the Cardinals. A main part of his job is to get the news out about the Cardinals. I think he does this well. It stands to reason that he's not going to be critical of the people who pay him. But it's to his credit that IMO, he seldom if ever hands out heavy doses of Kool-Aid either.

I disagree with K-9's depiction of Darren's output as "propaganda pieces." It's inaccurate and it's unfair.

Not all of the items are propaganda pieces, but lately they have. No one should confuse what Darren Urban does as "journalism." He used to do journalism, when he worked for the EVT. Now he writes PR pieces.

Where is the line between aggressive PR and propaganda?

K9, are you saying the front office is doing all the hiring and Arians has no say about the FA's they have hired?

Nope. What I'm saying is that the final authority on personnel matters is Steve Keim, not Bruce Arians, as is often asserted by people on the board. And I'm saying that the Kremlinology of this piece suggests strongly that Arians is largely in an advisory role, or even a spectator one.

It's pretty clear that this is Keim's team, and he's making it in his image. Because that's literally what Urban's piece says.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

It's pretty clear that this is Keim's team, and he's making it in his image. Because that's literally what Urban's piece says.

yep

 

[Finito]

30 years old and doesn't want to wait around for a team to rebuild.

Say what you want, Rhodes is better then what we have combined on this roster at safety. The team would be better with him on the field, and he has consistently made plays for the Cardinals while he was here. It is a loss in talent.

Personally, I don't see the issue & don't really care he is gone. This team is built for an at best 7-9 right now. Rhodes isn't changing that. But, I don't see how the opinion is not justified for his value.

Right now with Johnson and Bell, we went from one of the best safety tandems in the NFL (and that defense last year justifies that,IMO) to one of the bottom teams in the NFL. Rashad Johnson showed some POTENTIAL in his role with the team. But it has been one good year, and his first year starting. Yeremiah Bell is 37 years old, and a backup. That is a hard sell.

Besides Darren Urban who said Rhodes wanted to leave? Just curious cause I didn't see it stated any where else.

Urban has written A LOT of things about players after they left and it has wreaked of justification for some player leaving. Boldin being a good example.

I don't have a problem with it 99% of the time, my exception is when he wrongly calls out his own fanbase, his frickin' bread & butter. Urban is what he is and he does a really good job, IMO but he is paid by the Cardinals to put out what THEY want to be put out on that website. Nothing wrong with that and for obvious reasons. I just personally take it with a grain of salt, to each his own.

Nobody is saying we're better without Rhodes. who is saying that?

What do you mean who said he wanted to leave? He did, with his actions and Jurecki had stated numerous times that Rhodes said he wanted to test the free agent market. Do I hold it against him? No not at all. but don't tell me this move was made to be cheap cause that's not the case

My opinion your either 100 % committed or your not, you don't want to rebuild that's fine good luck to you, buy the reality of the situation is he really not that great. Hts not going to make or break this team

 

[Bodha]

Jury is still out on Keim, but I for one hated keeping him.



Everyone talks about how much the Cards have failed in picking up Olineman,picking quality talent in the 1st round (granted theyve been great picking in the 2nd round +), getting a QB, etc.

Keim was part of all that. The Cards failure sans Warner is just as much on Keim as it was on Graves.


Very nervous about this guy

 

[Finito]

Jury is still out on Keim, but I for one hated keeping him.



Everyone talks about how much the Cards have failed in picking up Olineman,picking quality talent in the 1st round (granted theyve been great picking in the 2nd round +), getting a QB, etc.

Keim was part of all that. The Cards failure sans Warner is just as much on Keim as it was on Graves.


Very nervous about this guy

I think the cardinals have drafted very well in the first round the last few years. Yes we could of had AP over Levi but pretty much every team call look at a certain draft and say we really screwed that one up

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think the cardinals have drafted very well in the first round the last few years. Yes we could of had AP over Levi but pretty much every team call look at a certain draft and say we really screwed that one up

really?

2005 - Rolle - not on the team.
2006 - Matt Leinart - not on the team, complete bust
2007 - Levi Brown - on the team, but in no way do I think you can call this a good pick at #5
2008 - DRC - not on the team, looked terrible his last year with us and with Philly... I'd call that a bad pick
2009 - Beanie - bust
2010 - Dan Williams - hasn't made much of an impact
2011 - Peterson - STUD
2012 - Floyd - jury's out.

So, in the last 8 years, we have only three 1st rounders still even on the team and two of those were drafted in the last two years. That doesn't speak to me as "drafted pretty well in the first round the last couple years." Unless you're just counting the last two years, but that seems like cherry picking to me.

 

[Finito]

really?

2005 - Rolle - not on the team.
2006 - Matt Leinart - not on the team, complete bust
2007 - Levi Brown - on the team, but in no way do I think you can call this a good pick at #5
2008 - DRC - not on the team, looked terrible his last year with us and with Philly... I'd call that a bad pick
2009 - Beanie - bust
2010 - Dan Williams - hasn't made much of an impact
2011 - Peterson - STUD
2012 - Floyd - jury's out.

So, in the last 8 years, we have only three 1st rounders still even on the team and two of those were drafted in the last two years. That doesn't speak to me as "drafted pretty well in the first round the last couple years." Unless you're just counting the last two years, but that seems like cherry picking to me.

I said " few" that's usually like 2-3 but ilk go with it

Rolle has had a very nice career in the NFL.

Leinart was a bust but hindsight is 20/20 that was the right pick to make at the time, you have to remember that.

Levi is not as bad as people make him out to be especially after seeing his replacement last year, yikes talking about Batiste, but still a solid pro

DRC turned into an all pro from a small school traded for the supposed quarterback of the future, didn't really work out but was still an all pro here. Note he didn't work oy in Philly but that whole team was a mess

Beanie was at the very back of the first round, his body just failed him. Bust buy because injury

Dan Williams another at the back of the first round. I actually really like Dan Williams and think he's a very solid player he quietly does his job

Peterson is Peterson

Like you said jury is still out on Floyd but I loved what I seen towards the end of the year

 

[Catfish]

really?

2005 - Rolle - not on the team.
2006 - Matt Leinart - not on the team, complete bust
2007 - Levi Brown - on the team, but in no way do I think you can call this a good pick at #5
2008 - DRC - not on the team, looked terrible his last year with us and with Philly... I'd call that a bad pick
2009 - Beanie - bust
2010 - Dan Williams - hasn't made much of an impact
2011 - Peterson - STUD
2012 - Floyd - jury's out.

So, in the last 8 years, we have only three 1st rounders still even on the team and two of those were drafted in the last two years. That doesn't speak to me as "drafted pretty well in the first round the last couple years." Unless you're just counting the last two years, but that seems like cherry picking to me.

What's your point. If you are laying all these on Keim's back you're wrong. He had little if any input on these hires. He only began to slowly have more influence in 2011, and finally in 2012 he was made a VP and you can see that he definitely influenced the drafting of OL who could pass protect at that time. We scored with Massie, Potter and Kelemete. Whiz was the final say on those prior hires not Keim.

I would agree that Keim now has a lot of power, but to say that these hires are his is far fetched, although if it came to a choice between two players that was pretty evenly split by the scouts and staff, he would almost certainly hold the final say. To simply say that he is handing BA all his players is simply a stretch.