This!
Kyler Murray Debate Thread
- Thread starter Chris_Sanders
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Yes. The team has many improvements to make to be a contender. But they can win with Kyler. Even with elite QB play, you're not guaranteed to even make the playoffs (as shown by Cincinnati)
I think Allar probably comes out this year as was reported. But that could change. Who do you like most of these guys?
It's hard to see a QB in the first couple rounds, but if they go that route, who would you want at 16 or 47? (assuming no trades)
Agreed! Not in the first couple of rounds.
No, that wasn't my idea at all and I clearly spelled it out.
My plan was to move Kyler while the market value is high and replace him with an equally mediocre QB for a year for far less money. Gaining both cap space and valuable draft picks, while being no worse at QB.
This is one of those stats that are misleading.
Lamar Jackson doesn't have elite receivers that are getting instantly open. But he has a YPA of 8.8, which is 1.7 yards more than Kyler. The reason he has vastly better separation is because he's giving his receivers time to get it. Kyler has a very high percentage of 1st read instant dump offs for 5-6 yards, which is no time for receivers to get away from their coverage.
That's not the only reason, there's a bunch of contributing factors.
Do we think Bo Nix, who has garbage at receiver, has guys better able to separate than Geno Smith, Jared Goff or Matt Stafford? Who all have much better receivers?
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Nobody. I hate this class with a vengeance. I think all 5 QB's that went top 12 last year would go before everyone this year.
Stout
Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Proof that we can even get into the playoffs consistently with Kyler, let alone even win a playoff game?
Stout
Hold onto the ball, Murray!
If Allar does come out, though, I trade Kyler and package that and maybe other picks to move back into the first to take him, if possible. It may not be.
DVontel
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lol Allar is most likely going top 3, if not top 1, if he comes out.
Stout
Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Your lol is earned. You're right, it's a pipe dream. Just let this Penn State homer dream a bit, eh?
Crimson Warrior
Dangerous Murray Zealot
Your lol is earned. You're right, it's a pipe dream. Just let this Penn State homer dream a bit, eh?
It’s a double edged sword man.
602 Native
Hall of Famer
LOL
Zay Flowers and Bateman are absolutely elite.
The difference is they play in a similar offense to ours. Its a RB & TE driven scheme which dictates their production.
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
What?
602 Native
Hall of Famer
He is a great number 2 and one of the best in the league. He isn't a 1 but would be on many teams.
Until something but probably nothing changes with Murray I’m going to avoid this thread.
It has clearly has defined right from left.
The horse is dead.
It has clearly has defined right from left.
The horse is dead.
Chopper0080
2021 - Prove It
There is no statistical argument to support this. He had a really good season this year. Prior to that, he was a non-factor.
EDIT: Bateman stats were buoyed by several long pass plays. He had two less receptions on the year than Michael Wilson.
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That's tanking, if it's Jimmy G you ARE tanking because you ARE worse at QB. He's not going to play even half a season. The Raiders gave him a big deal, at the time he needed foot surgery so the deal didn't kick in until he passed a physical after it. He then had 7 TD's 9 picks and was benched while struggling with recovery from the foot surgery, back issues, and a concussion. The Raiders waived him took a salary cap hit and the Rams signed him. I think he played in 1 game for the Rams.
He'll be a year older, to expect anything but another injury shortened season is just delusional.
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there is that Derrick Henry guy as well there.....
James Connor is good, but he isnt Derrick Henry. There is a reason an already good Lamar had the best season of his career
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this passes the eye test
better than avg protection, not good separation Plenty of independent analysts have noted the lack of separation by Cardinal receivers
dont know how much of that is scheme vs the actual WRs
602 Native
Hall of Famer
Now do TDs
Cardinals HC Jonathan Gannon says Kyler Murray isn't the problem
“He is a top-level franchise quarterback, and he’s played like that. He’s shown that,” Gannon said this week.
cardswire.usatoday.com
“He was in my office for a long time,” Gannon said of Murray. “He wants some plays back. So do I. We all do. You start looking around, you list the playoff teams and the quarterbacks of the playoff teams, I told him and I believe this: what is the common denominator of those quarterbacks in the playoffs right now? You could list all these different things. I said, ‘I’ll make it easy on you, it’s good teams.’ It’s what it is. Good quarterbacks are on good teams. We have to do everything that we can to support him and put a good team around him, then he has to play to his level consistently, which I know he can do.”
It sounds like Kyler has lost some faith in himself and Gannon needed to try and restore it.
