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[LVCARDFREAK]

Ronnie Mac....you idiot!!

Oh sorry my bad.....I thought you meant Coach Mac....

 

[Rats]

Oh sorry my bad.....I thought you meant Coach Mac....

I think it was pretty obvious we were talking about depth and the only two players I cited were KVB and Ronnie MAC....just another example of K9 twisting what we were talking about. to try and make others look foolish...but whatever. We won't be bringing Coach Mac back either as if that were even a part of this conversation.

 

[kerouac9]

Lunchpail players who are talented as well as try-hard, effort players:

Defense: Russell Davis, Robert Griffith, Chike Okeafor, Bertrand Berry, Orlando Huff, David Macklin, James Darling

Offense: Kurt Warner, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, Obfemi Ayanbedajeo, Alex Stepanovich, Oliver Ross.

Just because a guy isn't white or doesn't especially suck doesn't mean that they're not try-hard or can't lead. Davis, Macklin, Griffith, and Warner are absolute examples of players who's skill and effort exceed their talent levels. I'd even be tempted to add Anquan to that list, considering his measurables early in his career.

You may not like them. You may not know who they are because you don't watch NFL games that the Cardinals aren't involved with. But they fit your bill.

 

[40yearfan]

Lunchpail players who are talented as well as try-hard, effort players:

Defense: Russell Davis, Robert Griffith, Chike Okeafor, Bertrand Berry, Orlando Huff, David Macklin, James Darling

Offense: Kurt Warner, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, Obfemi Ayanbedajeo, Alex Stepanovich, Oliver Ross.

Just because a guy isn't white or doesn't especially suck doesn't mean that they're not try-hard or can't lead. Davis, Macklin, Griffith, and Warner are absolute examples of players who's skill and effort exceed their talent levels. I'd even be tempted to add Anquan to that list, considering his measurables early in his career.

You may not like them. You may not know who they are because you don't watch NFL games that the Cardinals aren't involved with. But they fit your bill.

What is it with you and race K9? How many times have I seen you bring this subject up when it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I'm starting to believe you have a little bigotry in you.

 

[Rats]

Lunchpail players who are talented as well as try-hard, effort players:

Defense: Russell Davis, Robert Griffith, Chike Okeafor, Bertrand Berry, Orlando Huff, David Macklin, James Darling

Offense: Kurt Warner, Anquan Boldin, Larry Fitzgerald, Obfemi Ayanbedajeo, Alex Stepanovich, Oliver Ross.

Just because a guy isn't white or doesn't especially suck doesn't mean that they're not try-hard or can't lead. Davis, Macklin, Griffith, and Warner are absolute examples of players who's skill and effort exceed their talent levels. I'd even be tempted to add Anquan to that list, considering his measurables early in his career.

You may not like them. You may not know who they are because you don't watch NFL games that the Cardinals aren't involved with. But they fit your bill.

The next time I see Russell Davis get in someones face for blowing an assignment will be the first. Or getting pumped up and showing emotion for that matter. You listed most of our starters and outside of Warner(in the past) and Darling most have showed very little enthusiasum that can get contagious in a huddle. They go about making plays or not making them with the same ho hum demeanor. The ones you didn't list are the ones I would look to...Wilson, Dockett Dansby....Shipp(if givin a chance)Boldin, and??? We do not have a Shannon Sharpe on this offense.

 

[kerouac9]

What is it with you and race K9? How many times have I seen you bring this subject up when it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I'm starting to believe you have a little bigotry in you.

Spare me, 40. Just because I'm apparently the only one who's willing to admit that KVB's massive and totally unearned popularity in the Valley might have something to do with him behing white doesn't mean I'm a bigot. It just means that I see things the way they are. There's nothing wrong with liking a guy more because he's white; it just is what it is.

If Rats could see through that, he'd note that there are seven players on the defense--at least--that play beyond their talent level every down and also produce in meaningful ways. This team doesn't need has beens like Ronald McKinnon or never weres like KVB sullying the roster.

 

[40yearfan]

Spare me, 40. Just because I'm apparently the only one who's willing to admit that KVB's massive and totally unearned popularity in the Valley might have something to do with him behing white doesn't mean I'm a bigot. It just means that I see things the way they are. There's nothing wrong with liking a guy more because he's white; it just is what it is.

If Rats could see through that, he'd note that there are seven players on the defense--at least--that play beyond their talent level every down and also produce in meaningful ways. This team doesn't need has beens like Ronald McKinnon or never weres like KVB sullying the roster.

K9, you are the only person I've ever seen apply what race a person is on this board. Did you ever think that maybe people like KVB because he's a nice guy? How about the Cards fans love affair with Boldin? or Dockett? or Dansby? All 3 of those guys have gotten a lot more love than KVB ever got.

 

[kerouac9]

The next time I see Russell Davis get in someones face for blowing an assignment will be the first. Or getting pumped up and showing emotion for that matter. You listed most of our starters and outside of Warner(in the past) and Darling most have showed very little enthusiasum that can get contagious in a huddle. They go about making plays or not making them with the same ho hum demeanor. The ones you didn't list are the ones I would look to...Wilson, Dockett Dansby....Shipp(if givin a chance)Boldin, and??? We do not have a Shannon Sharpe on this offense.

Then you're not paying attention. What's the point in getting excited and bouncing around when you're down by 21? It makes you look like a loser. On the other hand, Berry and Okeafor are vocal leaders on and off the field, and this defense thrives off the plays that Karlos Dansby makes, especially. If you didn't see that yesterday, you're blind.

Does this defense get down? Of course. They're young, and they got discouraged. But the solution for that isn't putting players into the starting lineup that blow, Rats. It's to get them experience and let them learn.

Goodness, if KVB got in my face after a blown play, I'd tell him, "Who the hell are you? What have you ever done, buddy?" And I'm sure Adrian Wilson would, as well. You can only lead if players respect you, and players only respect you if you're good.

Read the article on Ed Reed in SI's NFL Preview issue, and you'll see what I mean.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Then you're not paying attention. What's the point in getting excited and bouncing around when you're down by 21? It makes you look like a loser. On the other hand, Berry and Okeafor are vocal leaders on and off the field, and this defense thrives off the plays that Karlos Dansby makes, especially. If you didn't see that yesterday, you're blind.

Does this defense get down? Of course. They're young, and they got discouraged. But the solution for that isn't putting players into the starting lineup that blow, Rats. It's to get them experience and let them learn.

Goodness, if KVB got in my face after a blown play, I'd tell him, "Who the hell are you? What have you ever done, buddy?" And I'm sure Adrian Wilson would, as well. You can only lead if players respect you, and players only respect you if you're good.

Read the article on Ed Reed in SI's NFL Preview issue, and you'll see what I mean.

Some classic quotes....

In all seriousness, the last paragraph nails it. "You can only lead if players respect you, and players only respect you if you're good. "

 

[kerouac9]

K9, you are the only person I've ever seen apply what race a person is on this board. Did you ever think that maybe people like KVB because he's a nice guy? How about the Cards fans love affair with Boldin? or Dockett? or Dansby? All 3 of those guys have gotten a lot more love than KVB ever got.

Hey, I have no problem with fans liking players because they're good. That's the reason that I expect Cards fans love Boldin, Dockett, and Dansby. They make plays, they change games.

It's when players don't make plays, or change games, and I see 10,000 people wearing their jersey at Sun Devil Stadium that I start to wonder why. But I'm sure you're right and the love affair with KVB has everything to do with his 6 career NFL sacks and nothing to do with the fact that he's white.

 

[Rats]

Then you're not paying attention. What's the point in getting excited and bouncing around when you're down by 21? It makes you look like a loser. On the other hand, Berry and Okeafor are vocal leaders on and off the field, and this defense thrives off the plays that Karlos Dansby makes, especially. If you didn't see that yesterday, you're blind.

Does this defense get down? Of course. They're young, and they got discouraged. But the solution for that isn't putting players into the starting lineup that blow, Rats. It's to get them experience and let them learn.

Goodness, if KVB got in my face after a blown play, I'd tell him, "Who the hell are you? What have you ever done, buddy?" And I'm sure Adrian Wilson would, as well. You can only lead if players respect you, and players only respect you if you're good.

Read the article on Ed Reed in SI's NFL Preview issue, and you'll see what I mean.

Your preaching to the choir K9...I listed Dansby, Wilson and Dockett as the one that need to be looked to. They have talent and heart. You listed the others as though they had both. I would rather have KVB as a back up/depth guy than Ross K or some of the other dead weight and I sure as hell would take Ronnie Mac over Johnson as a seasoned vet. Your hatred of these guys and ones like them (Shipp) clouds what they bring to the table. Players do respect leadership. These guys have that whether you think it or not....I agree with Devil....you need to change your sig....it is lost on you.

 

[Sandan]

Rats is now taking a well earned break for rest and relaxation for the next 2 days

 

[jmr667]

Hey, I have no problem with fans liking players because they're good. That's the reason that I expect Cards fans love Boldin, Dockett, and Dansby. They make plays, they change games.

It's when players don't make plays, or change games, and I see 10,000 people wearing their jersey at Sun Devil Stadium that I start to wonder why. But I'm sure you're right and the love affair with KVB has everything to do with his 6 career NFL sacks and nothing to do with the fact that he's white.

So where do you think Marcel Shipp fits in all this? He's not white hasn't scored a TD in how long and folks around here love him....

 

[clif]

So where do you think Marcel Shipp fits in all this? He's not white hasn't scored a TD in how long and folks around here love him....

he's light skinned!



j/k... this race stuff is silly.

 

[40yearfan]

Hey, I have no problem with fans liking players because they're good. That's the reason that I expect Cards fans love Boldin, Dockett, and Dansby. They make plays, they change games.

It's when players don't make plays, or change games, and I see 10,000 people wearing their jersey at Sun Devil Stadium that I start to wonder why. But I'm sure you're right and the love affair with KVB has everything to do with his 6 career NFL sacks and nothing to do with the fact that he's white.

K9 with the attitude you exhibit and you lack of understanding as to what constitutes a hero in some people's eyes, I can see how you could arrive at that conclusion. Hopefully, once you get out into the real world, you will realize that all things don't fit into nice neat cubbyholes.

 

[Sandan]

K9, you are are getting to the thin ice area with this race stuff and the level of sarcasm.

It's a bad day folks, let's not make it worse attacking each other

 

[kerouac9]

So where do you think Marcel Shipp fits in all this? He's not white hasn't scored a TD in how long and folks around here love him....

RB's a glamour position, and as duckjake (I think) illustrated to me, Shipp has been the best RB that this town has seen in a long time. Doesn't mean he's good outside of town, but apparently AZ fans will latch on to all kinds of mediocrity.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Thanks for this thread Rats. I had totally forgotten how much toughness McKinnon and Vandensuck brought to the defense when they were getting blown out of the water on a weekly basis.

Seriously, if these guys were such great leaders as Rats insists they were, then how come we were so horrid on defense? You gotta question the leadership abilities of someone who "led" his team right down the crapper.

 

[kerouac9]

Thanks for this thread Rats. I had totally forgotten how much toughness McKinnon and Vandensuck brought to the defense when they were getting blown out of the water on a weekly basis.

Seriously, if these guys were such great leaders as Rats insists they were, then how come we were so horrid on defense? You gotta question the leadership abilities of someone who "led" his team right down the crapper.

That's wicked funny, but it's easy to take potshots at a guy who's just been banned.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I didn't realize he was banned. Just saw the first post and had to respond.

 

[kerouac9]

I didn't realize he was banned. Just saw the first post and had to respond.

 

[Duckjake]

Hey, I have no problem with fans liking players because they're good. That's the reason that I expect Cards fans love Boldin, Dockett, and Dansby. They make plays, they change games.

It's when players don't make plays, or change games, and I see 10,000 people wearing their jersey at Sun Devil Stadium that I start to wonder why. But I'm sure you're right and the love affair with KVB has everything to do with his 6 career NFL sacks and nothing to do with the fact that he's white.

Easy to explain. KVB's jersey was one of 4 given away by the Cardinals to 1000's of season ticket holders. None of the other 3 guys were still on the team last year. So thousands of Lassiter,Plummer,and Boston jerseys went to the carwash while KVB's still went to Cardinal Games.

 

[JeffGollin]

It Ain't Up to One Guy...

I agree totally that a missing ingrediant For the Cards on Sunday was toughness.

But adding a MacDawg or a KVB alone won't fix things. The lack of toughness was endemic throughout the entire roster and manifested itself in our losing virtually every one on one battle. It sure looks as though Coughlin told his players at halftime to go after their opposite man physically. And (maybe with the exception of Dansby) the Giants won those battles every time.

Each Cardinal offensive lineman failed to prevail on run plays. How about Oliver Ross on roller skates when Strahan bullrushed him right smack into Warner? And did you see the way our defensive guys dove for the bushes each time Brandon Jacobs got up a head of steam?

My biggest concern is that (for reasons either of necessity or philosophy) Dennis and Rod have decided to go to war with "touch football guys" (i.e. fast, smaller, athletic playmakers) who unfortunately didn't match up real well with "tackle football guys" (i.e. big uglies).

Maybe our guys - to a man - were physically overmatched against this one specific opposing team. Or maybe it was just a lack of "wanna." But you know that opposing coaches watching the tapes are going to put together game plans that challenge us physically until we can stop them.

The questions, therefore, facing the Cardinals next week and the ones that follow are: Are our players physically able to win at least their share of one on one battles? And, maybe more important - are they willing to do it?

Final point - Lack of mental toughness: Ask yourself how many times during game did our team suffer a letdown after a big play or penalty went against us.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Final point - Lack of mental toughness: Ask yourself how many times during game did our team suffer a letdown after a big play or penalty went against us.

I thought we were drafting guys from winning programs to combat this. Yet another reason why college football is worthless.

 

[earthsci]

I thought we were drafting guys from winning programs to combat this. Yet another reason why college football is worthless.

Then how do you judge who you will draft? Your rant on this is weird. The only way to judge who you will bring in as a rookie is their performance in college. Winning programs usually have better players. Sure, it doesn't always pan out, but neither does free agency (see Freddie Jones).