Lost - The Final Season (Spoilers)

[Cheesebeef]

I'm somewhat conflicted.

I really like the acting, writing and the story line is nothing if not original and thought-provoking, but.....................

If we are to believe in the multiverse conceit and all the ramifications and outcomes that are possible in an infinite series of possible outcomes, then where is the dramatic tension? If there are storylines where Sawyer and Juliet are together and living happily forever after, sitting right next to a world where they are both dead and also next to one where the dinosaurs were never killed off and Kate is a highly evolved velociraptor, well then why did we put all this effort into being concerned about them at all?

JTS

i'm in the same place here.

 

[Cheesebeef]

This is what's amazing to me. Most continuing dramas reach that point where the writers have to reinvent the show because the story line has run its course. Heroes had no idea where they were going after the first season. Lost writers either had a 5-6 season plan or they are masters of making it seem like they did.

this won't be a popular answer, but from everything I know, it's overwhelmingly more the latter.

 

[devilalum]

this won't be a popular answer, but from everything I know, it's overwhelmingly more the latter.

Works the same for me. I think I might be even more impressed if it was he latter.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Works the same for me. I think I might be even more impressed if it was he latter.

agreed. writing a show this interesting/infuriating in impressive no matter how it was written, but i'll end up thinking the whole thing was a relative joke if it wraps up with something better than the abortion that was Battlestar Galactica's ending... another show which was INCREDIBLE, with great performances, writing, mysteries, etc, only to end by dumping an incredible pile of crap on it's viewers.

 

[Chaplin]

Thinking back, it's actually kinda hard to find shows that ended really, really well.

I mean:
Battlestar Galactica - underwhelming
Buffy - the end of a very disappointing last 2 seasons, again underwhelming
Seinfeld - one of the worst ever
The X-Files - BIG disappointment

And that's not to mention the shows where the finale wasn't meant to be a series finale:
Deadwood
Carnivale
Firefly

I guess you'd have to go back to Cheers and M*A*S*H to find shows that had really good endings.

 

[Gaddabout]

OK Lostradamus, where's Shannon?

Obviously I can't answer every question -- we're not supposed to know -- but we were invited to make key inferences. Everything they show means something. There is no B-roll in this show, no throwaway line. When Rose tells Jack, "You can let go now," it was double-entendre -- she wasn't just talking about her hand. The whole plane scene with varied changed (and confusingly opposite) destinies were followed by a shot of the island under water. We can guess the island -- their original destiny -- changed things on the plane as they flew over it, or we can imagine all these free agents bouncing around in chaos changing destinies (while Jack is every so slightly aware of all the changes), or even both.

You don't have to solve the whole riddle to see probable directions one needs to go to get to the end. It's not like this is a show where writers forget details big or small.

 

[Jersey Girl]

So, where do things stand with Ben and Widmor? They haven't even touched on that. How many episodes are in this season?

I just can't see how they are going to tie up all these loose ends.

 

[devilalum]

Obviously I can't answer every question -- we're not supposed to know -- but we were invited to make key inferences. Everything they show means something. There is no B-roll in this show, no throwaway line. When Rose tells Jack, "You can let go now," it was double-entendre -- she wasn't just talking about her hand. The whole plane scene with varied changed (and confusingly opposite) destinies were followed by a shot of the island under water. We can guess the island -- their original destiny -- changed things on the plane as they flew over it, or we can imagine all these free agents bouncing around in chaos changing destinies (while Jack is every so slightly aware of all the changes), or even both.

You don't have to solve the whole riddle to see probable directions one needs to go to get to the end. It's not like this is a show where writers forget details big or small.

As it should have the first episode provided us with a lot more questions than answers. In the last episode of season 5 they showed Jacob hopping through time and doing things to change the destiny of the characters. Since the island now sunk in 1977 I'M guessing these visits never happened.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Thinking back, it's actually kinda hard to find shows that ended really, really well.

I mean:
Battlestar Galactica - underwhelming
Buffy - the end of a very disappointing last 2 seasons, again underwhelming
Seinfeld - one of the worst ever
The X-Files - BIG disappointment

And that's not to mention the shows where the finale wasn't meant to be a series finale:
Deadwood
Carnivale
Firefly

I guess you'd have to go back to Cheers and M*A*S*H to find shows that had really good endings.

yeah, Cheers just never ran out of steam and had a well written/funny ending that perfectly wrapped up the entire 2 decade run of the show.

Six Feet Under had an incredible end run as well.

Those are probably my favorite series finales. Never watched MASH.

 

[Gaddabout]

Battlestar Galactica - underwhelming
Buffy - the end of a very disappointing last 2 seasons, again underwhelming
Seinfeld - one of the worst ever
The X-Files - BIG disappointment

X-Files ending is proof that Cris Carter is an awful writer and the real geniuses of the show were the other writers -- James Wong and the Morgan brothers. Everything Carter wrote was half-mashed tortured mythology and he never had a clue how to end it -- and I'm not sure he really put much thought into it until Duchovny left. The show runner wasn't the one telling the good stories.

It's why I have much more faith in Lost. Abrams and Lindeloff are the story tellers. They've maintained a Lost 'bible' to keep track of the story. They did let it get off track at times between Seasons 3 through much of 5, but now the end is here and I think they're right back on point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

X-Files ending is proof that Cris Carter is an awful writer and the real geniuses of the show were the other writers -- James Wong and the Morgan brothers. Everything Carter wrote was half-mashed tortured mythology and he never had a clue how to end it -- and I'm not sure he really put much thought into it until Duchovny left. The show runner wasn't the one telling the good stories.

It's why I have much more faith in Lost. Abrams and Lindeloff are the story tellers. They've maintained a Lost 'bible' to keep track of the story. They did let it get off track at times between Seasons 3 through much of 5, but now the end is here and I think they're right back on point.

Gad, every show in TV maintains a painstakingly detailed bible (trust me, I just finished one) and Abrams has NOTHING to do with the show anymore and hasn't for years.

that being said, I expect them to go out on a better note than X-Files, Battlestar, etc., but I am a little leery of just how many questions they're going to flat out ignore.

 

[Chaplin]

We should compile a list of the questions still remaining:

1) Who are Adam and Eve (from season 1)?
2) Who or what is Christian Shepherd?
3) Is Richard a slave from the Black Rock?
4) What gives Richard the ability to never age?

That is just a tiny sampling...

If you think about it, a lot of questions have actually been answered, but it's the unanswered ones that stand out.

 

[Russ Smith]

We should compile a list of the questions still remaining:

1) Who are Adam and Eve (from season 1)?
2) Who or what is Christian Shepherd?
3) Is Richard a slave from the Black Rock?
4) What gives Richard the ability to never age?

That is just a tiny sampling...

If you think about it, a lot of questions have actually been answered, but it's the unanswered ones that stand out.

2 that jump to mind immediately what made Aaron special and what made Walt special and why did both story lines just disappear?

 

[Gaddabout]

Gad, every show in TV maintains a painstakingly detailed bible (trust me, I just finished one) and Abrams has NOTHING to do with the show anymore and hasn't for years.

that being said, I expect them to go out on a better note than X-Files, Battlestar, etc., but I am a little leery of just how many questions they're going to flat out ignore.

If Abrams is absentee it's pretty disingenuous of him to take credit for writing 110 episodes, including five this season. He also continues to conduct interviews as if he's deeply involved in the show. Don't doubt you, but he's certainly putting on a big act if he's not involved with the show.

I am certain there will be many unanswered questions because the show has never shown an obligation to explain the science or other reasons behind why things are. It's a character-driven show and it's more important to resolve those story lines. I'd be stunned, for example, if they went to any great lengths to explain what they island is, why it does what it does, or anything like that. The island is a convenient plot device and a metaphor. I don't think it's meant to be explained. It's purpose has always been pit characters against each other.

 

[Gaddabout]

If Abrams is absentee it's pretty disingenuous of him to take credit for writing 110 episodes, including five this season. He also continues to conduct interviews as if he's deeply involved in the show. Don't doubt you, but he's certainly putting on a big act if he's not involved with the show.

I am certain there will be many unanswered questions because the show has never shown an obligation to explain the science or other reasons behind why things are. It's a character-driven show and it's more important to resolve those story lines. I'd be stunned, for example, if they went to any great lengths to explain what they island is, why it does what it does, or anything like that. The island is a convenient plot device and a metaphor. I don't think it's meant to be explained. It's purpose has always been pit characters against each other.

OK, I'm an idiot and owe you an apology. I've been confusing Abrams with Damon Lindelof. Lindelof and Carlton Cuse have been managing the storyline, not Abrams. Sorry man.

 

[Gaddabout]

OK, I'm back to getting irritated with the Others storyline. They really need an episode the better explains why they're there and why they're so distrustful of everyone.

Some cool reveals, though. Not sure if I'm happy about Claire's return.

 

[Russ Smith]

Gad's point about the subtle differences in the characters post explosion(on the plane) is good. I was commenting that kate's clothes had changed slightly for example but then it dawned on me that's just one of many subtle changes in the characters because the explosion changed their reality.

 

[PDXChris]

Claire = Rousseau
Sayid = Juliet?

 

[Chaplin]

Gad's point about the subtle differences in the characters post explosion(on the plane) is good. I was commenting that kate's clothes had changed slightly for example but then it dawned on me that's just one of many subtle changes in the characters because the explosion changed their reality.

There was also one moment where Kate saw Jack (for the first time?) when she was in the cab with the Puppet Master and there was a tiny bit of recognition in her eyes.

So now both Kate and Jack seem to be experiencing some kind of deja vu.

 

[chickenhead]

Pretty obvious they're not trying to sell the hard science of the show and leaning on mythology (Egyptian at this point) to tell a morality tale.

But what I liked was how so much of the other strange things ended up being explained fully, and in some cases were almost mundane, like the polar bear, or how people got off the island (duh, submarine). It was a great exercise in presentation and perception. I was a big fan of that.

 

[chickenhead]

Seinfeld - one of the worst ever

It's funny howthat's part of what made this last season of Curb Your Enthusiasm so brilliant. Not doing a reunion special to try and make up for a bad ending, but doing a show about doing a reunion special on another show, and making fun of how badly the original show had ended. It was like throwing good money after bad...but with it working.

 

[earthsci]

There was also one moment where Kate saw Jack (for the first time?) when she was in the cab with the Puppet Master and there was a tiny bit of recognition in her eyes.

So now both Kate and Jack seem to be experiencing some kind of deja vu.

Yes! And where Claire yelled the name "Aaron" in the hospital. Kate had the same, if not more pronounced, look.

 

[Russ Smith]

Yes! And where Claire yelled the name "Aaron" in the hospital. Kate had the same, if not more pronounced, look.

Yeah we noticed that too there's some clear deja vu going on.

With Sayid I was thinking that the Temple people think he's been claimed by the bad guy because they don't know the bad guy is inside Locke and maybe Sayid has really been "claimed" by Jacob? If they didn't know Jacob was dead then they don't know about fake Locke either? I am not sure what reaction they were looking for when they put the powder on him did they expect him to become the smoke monster and leave?

I like that Claire is back her total disappearance has always bothered me.

 

[Chaplin]

Yeah we noticed that too there's some clear deja vu going on.

With Sayid I was thinking that the Temple people think he's been claimed by the bad guy because they don't know the bad guy is inside Locke and maybe Sayid has really been "claimed" by Jacob? If they didn't know Jacob was dead then they don't know about fake Locke either? I am not sure what reaction they were looking for when they put the powder on him did they expect him to become the smoke monster and leave?

I like that Claire is back her total disappearance has always bothered me.

I thought Hurley told them that Jacob was dead. That's how they explained how/why they brought Sayid to the temple in the first place.

 

[Chaplin]

Yes! And where Claire yelled the name "Aaron" in the hospital. Kate had the same, if not more pronounced, look.

Yep.

But one thing was interesting, she did NOT have this deja vu feeling when she was in the airport elevator with Sawyer. And Sawyer didn't have it with her either. I'm really looking forward to seeing what he's like in the alternate reality.