Lot of buzz for Tebow coming to AZ

[Chopper0080]

Or wanting to bring in a guy who will be 40 next month as the #1 backup to Leinart.

Better than St. Pierre who is +30 and never had any NFL success...

 

[Chopper0080]

You had me until Tebow...

Say what you want about him, he has the physical tools. He has arm strength. He has the intelligence to learn a complex system. His issues are mostly mechanical which just takes dedication and a willingness to change, and he has shown this week that he will sacrifice money to do so.

The guy has been a winner all of his life. He was the leader for Florida for 3 years and on a team that was loaded with top talent. He has battled through and fulfilled hype his entire football career. I just don't see why anyone would bet against this guy now. Do I think that he should be drafted in the first round? No. Do I think that he is ready to come in and take the NFL by storm next year? No. But do I think that a team could use his determination to succeed, and that a smart coach could find a way to make him into a solid offensive weapon until he fixes those mechanics? Yes.

 

[Duckjake]

Better than St. Pierre who is +30 and never had any NFL success...

But not better than a Chris Redman or a Sage Rosenfels or someone else along those lines. Garcia is way too old.

Taking a QB in the first two rounds of the draft this year without seeing what Leinart can do would be a waste of not only the pick but of money as well. All we need for 2010 is a veteran backup who has played some in relief.

Especially since the QBs coming out this year aren't that great anyway.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

We HAVE TO give this year to Leinart. Do NOT draft a QB, period. Next offseason, we need to know if we need to restructure ML (huge cap hit) or if we need to cut him. Put him in there and scrutinize the end results....

 

[Chopper0080]

But not better than a Chris Redman or a Sage Rosenfels or someone else along those lines. Garcia is way too old.

Taking a QB in the first two rounds of the draft this year without seeing what Leinart can do would be a waste of not only the pick but of money as well. All we need for 2010 is a veteran backup who has played some in relief.

Especially since the QBs coming out this year aren't that great anyway.

...so if Leinart fails then what do we do long term? Chris Redman? Draft a QB next year and hope he develops in a year after that? A second round pick that could potentially be your future at QB is not a waste in my opinion. The best possible senario is that Leinart develops and we can trade our backup QB for future picks. The worst is that Leinart fails and we have a vet option as well as an younger option who has had a year to learn the system.

 

[Chopper0080]

We HAVE TO give this year to Leinart. Do NOT draft a QB, period. Next offseason, we need to know if we need to restructure ML (huge cap hit) or if we need to cut him. Put him in there and scrutinize the end results....

I am not implying that we do not give Leinart his opportunity to start. What I am saying is that it would be in the best interest of the future success of our Franchise to make sure that we have a plan B past St. Pierre or Tyler Palko. I like Tebow, and think that given time to develop, he could develop into a legit NFL QB. Time that we have to give him because Leinart has earned his chance to start. If I liked Brown out of West Virginia better, I would advocate for Arizona to take him in the 2nd or 3rd round. We just have to have a long term option if Leinart falls on his face.

 

[IAWarnerFan]

But not better than a Chris Redman or a Sage Rosenfels or someone else along those lines. Garcia is way too old.

Taking a QB in the first two rounds of the draft this year without seeing what Leinart can do would be a waste of not only the pick but of money as well. All we need for 2010 is a veteran backup who has played some in relief.

Especially since the QBs coming out this year aren't that great anyway.

Having the rookie wait a year isn't that big of a deal. Rodgers had to and he seems to be doing a great job for Green Bay. I just don't think it's wise to put all the eggs in the basket of a QB that has a QB rating of 70, 14 TDs to 20 Ints career, and 0 to 3 last year. The Cardinals need at least two QBs for next year even if it some how does work out with Leinart.

With that said tho, I don't like Tebow and hopefully the Cardinals can find a someone better.

 

[Chopper0080]

Having the rookie wait a year isn't that big of a deal. Rodgers had to and he seems to be doing a great job for Green Bay. I just don't think it's wise to put all the eggs in the basket of a QB that has a QB rating of 70, 14 TDs to 20 Ints career, and 0 to 3 last year. The Cardinals need at least two QBs for next year even if it some how does work out with Leinart.

With that said tho, I don't like Tebow and hopefully the Cardinals can find a someone better.

I don't mind this argument. I like Tebow probably more than most. I do however have an issue with the argument that drafting a QB would be a waste as any would probably be better than what we have on our roster now, excluding potentially Leinart.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Say what you want about him

I will. He's an extremely over hyped college player, who like many other college players with poor mechanics make awful pros. At best, it sounds like he'll need a minimum of 3 years to get to be an NFL qb. Not worth a pick in the first 3 rounds.

 

[Zeno]

Jeff Garcia? Seriously? Yuck. The guy couldn't hack it at Raiders camp and hasn't thrown a football in a game in over a year, no thanks. Too old and he is DONE.

I'd much rather sign someone like Trent Edwards to back up Leinart--who rumor has it the Cards are interested in.

 

[Duckjake]

...so if Leinart fails then what do we do long term? Chris Redman? Draft a QB next year and hope he develops in a year after that? A second round pick that could potentially be your future at QB is not a waste in my opinion. The best possible senario is that Leinart develops and we can trade our backup QB for future picks. The worst is that Leinart fails and we have a vet option as well as an younger option who has had a year to learn the system.

I'd rather have a seasoned veteran to step in than some second rate rookie.

A guy like Kurt Warner was in 2005 for instance.

 

[Chopper0080]

Jeff Garcia? Seriously? Yuck. The guy couldn't hack it at Raiders camp and hasn't thrown a football in a game in over a year, no thanks. Too old and he is DONE.

I'd much rather sign someone like Trent Edwards to back up Leinart--who rumor has it the Cards are interested in.

I thought that he was cut because he didn't feel that he was given a fair shot at the starting job. Basically said that he out preformed Russell and wasn't given the opportunity that he was promised.

I could be wrong and will look for the article, but this is why I remembered him being cut for some reason.

 

[Zeno]

I thought that he was cut because he didn't feel that he was given a fair shot at the starting job. Basically said that he out preformed Russell and wasn't given the opportunity that he was promised.

I could be wrong and will look for the article, but this is why I remembered him being cut for some reason.

Yep that was part of it, he basically whined like a child to anyone who would listen. That crap is probably why no other team in the NFL showed interest in him(and the fact he is almost 40).

 

[Chopper0080]

I'd rather have a seasoned veteran to step in than some second rate rookie.

A guy like Kurt Warner was in 2005 for instance.

And once again, I will reiterate. I am not saying that we ignore a vet as a backup for this year or next. What I am saying is that we also draft a guy to develop for the future if Leinart doesn't work out. I like Tebow because I think that he could be had with a lower pick yet also has starter potential in a couple years. If I thought that Canfield or Brown out of WVA had as much potential, I would be advocating for them as well.

As far as signing a vet like Warner was in 2005...I haven't seen the FA QB list, but I haven't heard of any former league MVP's or Super Bowl winners being on it.

 

[Duckjake]

Having the rookie wait a year isn't that big of a deal. Rodgers had to and he seems to be doing a great job for Green Bay. I just don't think it's wise to put all the eggs in the basket of a QB that has a QB rating of 70, 14 TDs to 20 Ints career, and 0 to 3 last year. The Cardinals need at least two QBs for next year even if it some how does work out with Leinart.

With that said tho, I don't like Tebow and hopefully the Cardinals can find a someone better.

Rodgers waited behind Farve for 3 years. Its worked out great. Leinart has waited behind Warner for 2.5 years so lets see how that works out.

We don't need another QBOF in 2010.

 

[O]

Rodgers waited behind Farve for 3 years. Its worked out great. Leinart has waited behind Warner for 2.5 years so lets see how that works out.

We don't need another QBOF in 2010.

Exactly!
Whiz wants no part of Tebow! Mark my words!

 

[Duckjake]

And once again, I will reiterate. I am not saying that we ignore a vet as a backup for this year or next. What I am saying is that we also draft a guy to develop for the future if Leinart doesn't work out. I like Tebow because I think that he could be had with a lower pick yet also has starter potential in a couple years. If I thought that Canfield or Brown out of WVA had as much potential, I would be advocating for them as well.

As far as signing a vet like Warner was in 2005...I haven't seen the FA QB list, but I haven't heard of any former league MVP's or Super Bowl winners being on it.

That's because Warner is the only former Super Bowl winner and league MVP I know of to be let go by two different teams. At the time he was signed by Arizona his stock had fallen to the point where the Cards were able to sign him to a 1 year deal for only $4million.

Turned out that signing an older veteran QB was a far better deal for Arizona than using a top 10 draft pick and spending millions on a rookie didn't it?

 

[Chopper0080]

That's because Warner is the only former Super Bowl winner and league MVP I know of to be let go by two different teams. At the time he was signed by Arizona his stock had fallen to the point where the Cards were able to sign him to a 1 year deal for only $4million.

Turned out that signing an older veteran QB was a far better deal for Arizona than using a top 10 draft pick and spending millions on a rookie didn't it?

Which I am not saying that we should do, so what is the point here?

Look, there is QB to be had in the draft who is a good person as well as a physically gifted athlete. Not only this, but he also was a 4 year starter in college and led one of the best programs in college during his time there. The only catch is that we would need to take time to develop him which he has already proven to be willing to do. Because he will need time to develop, there is a possibility that he could be had in either the 2nd or 3rd round. Now, we have an unproven QB on our roster who will be given the chance to succeed this year, but who has failed to stay healthy. So, on top of having a capable, vet backup this year, wouldn't it be prudent to take a gamble on a talented individual whose stock has fallen because of a correctable flaw in his mechanics?

 

[8ndkorner]

And those teams are the ones consistently drafting at the top of the draft. We don't want to be there. To be honest, we really need to revamp our QB position. It is not that we need to draft a backup, we might need to be drafting our future starter.

The NFL is a QB driven league, and as of now, we are short a QB. Yes, we have Leinart, but he is an unproven option that we can't bank on. We need to sign a legitimate backup like Jeff Garcia, as well as draft a QB who we can try to develop into a long term solution if Leinart doesn't succeed. Even teams like the Colts are bringing in guys like Curtis Painter so that they have a developmental option.

As for Tebow, I like him as a QB. He has what starting QB's in the NFL need and that is drive and love for the game. Tebow loves to compete, that is why he is at the Senior Bowl. Tebow loves to learn which is why he didn't want to wait to start changing into an NFL QB. Does he need work, heck ya. His mechanics need to be fixed and he needs better footwork. But, the most important thing is that he has the physical tools to play in the NFL. Also, if there is one thing that you can count on, it is that Tebow will dedicate everything that he has to learn and change into an NFL QB. He has already proven that by risking his "draft status" in order to start changing into the QB that he will need to become. It is not very often that you have guys who are willing to sacrifice money in order to develop and change their game.

I would take Tebow in the 2nd round in a heartbeat.

Let him compete for the starting QB slot if ML is still on this team. But let's trade for a eteran also. Goodbye Q.

 

[Stout]

Chopper, you realize that, no matter how hard Tebow has tried, no matter what level of dedication he has shown in the past or will show in the future, he has not been able to fix the mechanics of his throwing motion. He drops the ball TO HIS HIP before throwing it. And that's without all of his other blemishes at the QB position. He'd lose 3-4 fumbles a game, easily, with that kind of throwing motion in the NFL. Add n his other warts, and I'll pass on him as a QB.

Now, tell me I can nab him in Rd 5 and convert him to a FB/HB/TE hybrid, and I'm game.

 

[Oly]

Chopper, you realize that, no matter how hard Tebow has tried, no matter what level of dedication he has shown in the past or will show in the future, he has not been able to fix the mechanics of his throwing motion. He drops the ball TO HIS HIP before throwing it. And that's without all of his other blemishes at the QB position. He'd lose 3-4 fumbles a game, easily, with that kind of throwing motion in the NFL. Add n his other warts, and I'll pass on him as a QB.

Now, tell me I can nab him in Rd 5 and convert him to a FB/HB/TE hybrid, and I'm game.

Round 5 is are money round if we do that he will turn out to be a H.O.F. QB.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I don't think a quality backup is really necessary. Hardly any NFL teams have real talent at 2nd string QB. In fact about half of them don't even have any talent at starter.

All you need is some guy who can hold down the fort for a series or a game.

This. If you're relying on/playing your backup QB, your season's likely in trouble anyway.

 

[Cards Czar]

I am wanting John Skelton QB from Fordham in the 5th. Big Sleeper at QB.

 

[Stout]

I am wanting John Skelton QB from Fordham in the 5th. Big Sleeper at QB.

Hmm, I don't know a single thing about this kid. Any scouting reports? I'm intrigued.

 

[Goober Man]

I don't know much about Skelton other than he has the physcial tools for a QB that you need in the NFL 6'5 258lbs and a strong arm from what i've seen from highligh videos. Hopefully nfldraftcountdown will start putting up some scouting reports soon. http://www.draftcountdown.com/ScoutingReports/QB/John-Skelton.php from a stats standpoint though they mean very little when lookin at a prospect he seems to have decent but not mind blowing numbers and a decent completion %58.8 for his carerr. BUT that could be because of his system...maybe he threw a lot of screens or something but I have never seen him play so don't take my word on that.


One of my sleeper QBs that I have seen play is Western Michigan QB Sam Hiller. Who also has almost the same measureables has Skelton but weighs a little less 6'5 234lbs. Has very good throwing mechanics, footwork and pretty accurate at throwing at Mid Range to short routes. Still nfldraftcountdown hasn't updated their scouting reports yet so just take my word on it ;-)

Found a site with their scouting reports

Skelton http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1267818

Hiller http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/564002