It is total salary that is what they have actually been paid.
But the cap hit is an indicator of what their salary breaks down to. As an example, Bulger's total salary in '07 was $17M. In '08 it was $7M. When looking at any one of those years on his multi year deal can be misleading. His cap hit of $9M each of those years is realistically what he's actually "worth". In '08 his total salary was $7M but he still got $12M of his signing bonus. That's $19M for '08 if you want to just look at a one year sample of his contract. His total salary shows $7 but he got more than that and his salary cap hit was $9M. Total salary can be just as misleading as the cap hit number.
And if you are going to try and compare bonuses then that will be a mistake as well considering those QB's signed 6 year deals where as Warner only signed a three year deal. The difference will be huge and complete misleading.
I agree that bonuses can be misleading but I don't think in the way that you mean. If anything, it further illustrates the disparity between what Warner has received and some of the other QB's in the league. Those signing bonuses are often at the front end of the contract and regardless if the player reaches the backloaded salary portion of their deal, they generally get their signing bonus. That will likely be how Warner's deal is set up when it gets to that point. He'll get a respectable salary and a longer contract with a big signing bonus that can be spread out over the length of the contract, the team and Warner knowing full well he won't be playing out those final year(s). He'll get his bonus and the Cards will take less of a hit each year while paying it off.
Which brings up another point, you cant even go into the negotiations for this new contract to say as you put it, to try and make up for not getting paid like a starter the last contract.
It happens. Warner's deal with the Rams in '00 was much like that. He far outperformed his veteran's minimum contract with no incentives in '99 and they gave him a huge bonus and big contract to balance the books so to speak.
Lets say we believe that premise, what stupid agent in his right mind is going to use that as a negotiating tactic considering it was Warner and the Agent temselves that negotiated and signed that last contract in the first place.
That contract was under far different circumstances and I don't think it will be a tactic at all to point out that Warner has been playing for far less than his production is worth around the league. I think his Cardinals career has sort of balanced out though. He was overpaid his first couple of years and underpaid the last couple. I think that's why $10M-$12M at this stage is fair for both sides. It's perfectly reasonable to expect him to continue what he's done the last two years and if so, that is the price range that is reasonable for the production he's had.
You can only go in and say you want to be paid like a starter at this point in time.
Yes, and his production over the last two years will be a huge bargaining chip in that regard. The fact that he outperformed his contract will play into the final price not being as discounted as much as the Cardinals want.
I regect the orginal premise this debate started with in the first place, we dont even have to debate the money or how you want to rank Kurt money wise in the first place.
I thought it was Bartelstein that brought up the top 5 talk? I agree that there really isn't a certain spot that Warner needs to rank but I think he's earned it being closer to the top 1/4 more than the top 1/2 or 1/3.
IMO $8 million with incentives per year for two or see you Kurt. Don't break the bank and the future on a 38 year old qb.
On paper, that's perfectly reasonable but I can see how it would be much different on a personal level. Incentives is just a nice way of saying a player has to prove something and the team doesn't trust what is being offered. It's not the most endearing negotiating tactic. I also don't think $12M-ish is going to break the bank. The Steelers paid Roethlisberger $27M last year and the Patriots are willing to spend $29M on the QB spot in '09.
You may want to check that buddy. 38-39 for a two year deal. I could care less what age he is today.
The post read "...a 39 year old QB." That's quite a bit of projection unless you're assuming it's all guaranteed money. But the fact is, he is 37 right now and that's what age they will be offering the money to.
Don't believe it, Warner knows he is not worth that kind of money! If true we have a new QB.
