Marquese Chriss

[Carolinacacti]

Suns plans for these two big men was to have them shoot 3 pointers then progress to driving to the hoop. Chriss has a nice shot just not falling for him this year. Next year we will see both being better players.

 

[95pro]

Let’s hope it’s a sophomore slump.

 

[Suns_fan69]

One of Benders biggest issues is that he isn’t aggressive enough and that is a mental issue that can be fixed and is just like what you said about Chriss. His other big issue is strength and obviously that can be improved as well.

I actually think attitude and aggression (on court) are harder to fix than physical attributes or basketball skills. Some people are just wired for it (like Booker, KG, Kobe, MJ, etc), others aren't. Can you guys think of examples of someone who started their career with lackadaisical and then turned it on later? Shaq kind of went the other way.

 

[Suns_fan69]

To be clear, I'm not saying Bender has it either. Jackson and Booker have that drive though, I'm pretty sure that much we can all agree on.

 

[Hoop Head]

I actually think attitude and aggression (on court) are harder to fix than physical attributes or basketball skills. Some people are just wired for it (like Booker, KG, Kobe, MJ, etc), others aren't. Can you guys think of examples of someone who started their career with lackadaisical and then turned it on later? Shaq kind of went the other way.

Hassan Whiteside is the only person I can think of somewhat recently.

 

[3rdside]

Though not frequent, Bender has certainly gotten better at putting the ball on the floor to make plays happen. His facilitating is certainly getting better than it has been in the past and he is mixing it up inside for rebounds on a more regular basis.

One of Benders biggest issues is that he isn’t aggressive enough and that is a mental issue that can be fixed and is just like what you said about Chriss. His other big issue is strength and obviously that can be improved as well.

Bender could do with a euro buddy (Luka Doncic, anyone? Slovenians and Croatians can usually understand each other) before anyone writes him off.

Not that it needs to be said again but the brashness of USA culture isn't easily assimilated to by many, not least young, gangly, passive, don't speak english as a first language, probably slightly socially awkward 7ft euros.

And I wouldn't rule out Chriss just yet either even though I want to strangle him right now; get Bender a buddy, Chriss a psychologist and both time with a decent PG and let's go from there.

 

[3rdside]

*badly worded..Don't write him off because of his talent - i think he has plenty - but we could expedite its fulfilment with an on-court bud that would give him a bit more confidence in and amongst a bunch of brasher-than-him locals.

That being said - and slightly tangential but related - having guys like Dudley and Chandler and (the former) Earl Watson do suggest method to this horrendous tanking madness; losing sucks but those above three really do (did) radiate a 'nicer' club vibe as they're 'nice' guys and being around nicer people while you're losing is far more palatable than being around self serving a$$holes.

So Bender, while struggling a bit, at least shouldn't be hating life to the detriment of his potential and nor should Booker and Jackson, our other rocks, be either.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I actually think attitude and aggression (on court) are harder to fix than physical attributes or basketball skills. Some people are just wired for it (like Booker, KG, Kobe, MJ, etc), others aren't. Can you guys think of examples of someone who started their career with lackadaisical and then turned it on later? Shaq kind of went the other way.

There have been countless players that were terrible in their first few years for many reasons varying from physical skill to mental issues. Sure Bender will probably never be a legit star level player, but that doesn’t mean that he can’t or doesn’t have a decent chance of turning into a good rotation player on a good team.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I actually think attitude and aggression (on court) are harder to fix than physical attributes or basketball skills. Some people are just wired for it (like Booker, KG, Kobe, MJ, etc), others aren't. Can you guys think of examples of someone who started their career with lackadaisical and then turned it on later? Shaq kind of went the other way.

Jermaine O'Neal comes to mind. Dirk, actually...though he had made that transformation apparent by year two.

 

[Mainstreet]

Sometimes I think we demand too much of these young players to produce early... a sort of an instant gratification thing. For example, Steve Nash played four years of college basketball before entering the NBA and then he did not immediately set the league on fire.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Sometimes I think we demand too much of these young players to produce early... a sort of an instant gratification thing. For example, Steve Nash played four years of college basketball before entering the NBA and then he did not immediately set the league on fire.

Exactly. And it’s not like we didn’t know we were taking on a project at the time they were drafted (especially Bender who was considered to be very raw). In all honesty I think it would be wise to send Bender down to the GLeague for a stint and make him the focal point of the offense. Hopefully that will get him to open up on the court more. Dude has never been the focal point of a team before, at least not since he was 15 years old.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Exactly. And it’s not like we didn’t know we were taking on a project at the time they were drafted (especially Bender who was considered to be very raw). In all honesty I think it would be wise to send Bender down to the GLeague for a stint and make him the focal point of the offense. Hopefully that will get him to open up on the court more. Dude has never been the focal point of a team before, at least not since he was 15 years old.

Patience is important. But what is alarming is when a player regresses. That's the difference between Chriss and Bender. Bender's progress has been slower, but reasonably steady. Chriss had done fairly well throughout last year, progressing nicely, then he has regressed significantly. THAT is reason to be concerned.

 

[SirStefan32]

Patience is important. But what is alarming is when a player regresses. That's the difference between Chriss and Bender. Bender's progress has been slower, but reasonably steady. Chriss had done fairly well throughout last year, progressing nicely, then he has regressed significantly. THAT is reason to be concerned.

I do agree. Bender keeps adding things to his game. He just needs to keep adding, and keep being more and more aggressive.
Frustrating thing with Chriss is that it's all mental with him. He didn't get slower from last season to this one, he didn't lose any skill he had, he just shouldn't be worse than he was last year.

 

[Mainstreet]

If Bender can get stronger, this alone would significantly improve his game. So some of his development is waiting for this to happen. The effort is there.

I don't know what to make of Chriss anymore. It's hard to know what motivates him. He has the tools.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Patience is important. But what is alarming is when a player regresses. That's the difference between Chriss and Bender. Bender's progress has been slower, but reasonably steady. Chriss had done fairly well throughout last year, progressing nicely, then he has regressed significantly. THAT is reason to be concerned.

It is certainly a reason for concern, but that doesn’t mean we should necessarily give up on him either. He is dealing with some mental hurdles and with counseling and maturity he may very well be able to get past them relatively soon. It starts with this off season. If he takes this offseason far more seriously than the last I think he could make a big improvement next season.

 

[Mainstreet]

It is certainly a reason for concern, but that doesn’t mean we should necessarily give up on him either. He is dealing with some mental hurdles and with counseling and maturity he may very well be able to get past them relatively soon. It starts with this off season. If he takes this offseason far more seriously than the last I think he could make a big improvement next season.

I don't think we should give up on Chriss but if the Suns got the right trade offer for him I'd have to consider it.

 

[BC867]

Chriss has a nice shot just not falling for him this year.

I've always wondered about that type of quote. "Shot just not falling" is passive. "Not making his shots" is a different story.

Making shots doesn't happen to a player. He makes it happen. Or not.

 

[SweetD]

Why not sit him and don't put him in these positions, where he is pressing to make it all work right now. Go sign a g league guy to play his 15 min and just let him learn. Heck I think we need to cut Bender's minutes down, why has he been just given the starting job??

 

[SirStefan32]

Why not sit him and don't put him in these positions, where he is pressing to make it all work right now. Go sign a g league guy to play his 15 min and just let him learn. Heck I think we need to cut Bender's minutes down, why has he been just given the starting job??

I think people learn by doing. I've managed people for a long time, and the best way to teach them something is letting them do it. If he is going to learn, he can't be sitting on the bench. Suns have two big men who are very young and not developing quickly. They both need to play. As to Bender starting, why not? Unless they go small with Warren at 4, their choices are bad, worse, and terrible. Let the youngsters play, and see if they develop and improve.

 

[BC867]

I think people learn by doing. I've managed people for a long time, and the best way to teach them something is letting them do it. If he is going to learn, he can't be sitting on the bench. Suns have two big men who are very young and not developing quickly. They both need to play. As to Bender starting, why not? Unless they go small with Warren at 4, their choices are bad, worse, and terrible. Let the youngsters play, and see if they develop and improve.

But if the company for whom you work is in its eighth year of losing (sales, money), would you follow that approach?

I know the Board of Directors of companies for whom I've worked would not accept that as a one- or five-year plan after eight years of failure (to make the playoffs). It is too passive an approach after all this time.

 

[SirStefan32]

But if the company for whom you work is in its eighth year of losing (sales, money), would you follow that approach?

I know the Board of Directors of companies for whom I've worked would not accept that as a one- or five-year plan after eight years of failure (to make the playoffs). It is too passive an approach after all this time.

Again, you are complaining, but offer no solution.

 

[Hoop Head]

But if the company for whom you work is in its eighth year of losing (sales, money), would you follow that approach?

I know the Board of Directors of companies for whom I've worked would not accept that as a one- or five-year plan after eight years of failure (to make the playoffs). It is too passive an approach after all this time.

So does that mean that Chriss should leave because the Suns have had trouble turning the ship around? I don't see how bashing management, again, comes into play here. The issue is whether Chriss or Bender should be given the playing time to develop in what is a lost season. They're not hurting anything by playing them 30 minutes a night. They'll be able to address their needs better next year by seeing what those 2 bring to the table. It's past the trade deadline and the Suns aren't a team that will add anyone who was recently bought out so they can't really improve their roster at this point. Even at the trade deadline it wouldn't make much sense to add a player to challenge them for playing time unless it was someone who factored into the teams long term plans. So they don't have a lot of options at PF right now, might as well see what their 2 second year players can do.

 

[Errntknght]

I wonder how close the Suns - and other NBA teams - come to coaching their young players the optimum amount. Considering how much they are paid and how young they are it could be a worthwhile investment for most every player to have a coach that works with him almost constantly - the cost wouldn't be prohibitive. I realize there would be a possibility it would muddle things more than help, so you wouldn't want to just do it willy-nilly.

The reason I started to think about this is that in following the Cards forum I have noticed that the posters talk fairly frequently about whether the Cards do enough coaching of their young players. I wouldn't say it was a concensus, but they do say they think the secret to Bellichicks success is his ability to take players that failed elsewhere and turn them into contributors by coaching them better. Football is quite different and they do have position coaches, along with defense and offense being pretty much independent entities.

As a case in point, consider Archie Goodwin, who I did spend time considering how he might have been helped. His biggest failing, IMO, was that he never developed any shots that he could use close in - runner, floater, stop and pop, jump hook. Once he found a seam he always went all the way to rim, regardless of how many players had a chance to block him or impede his progress. Of course, he should have taken it on himself to round out his repretoire but there was never a hint that he even contemplated it. A coach beating him up about it day in and day out - and forcing him to pick a couple of things and work on them every day might have gotten through to him. His defense was pretty poor even though he had the tools to be a good defender so this would be another area where strong coaching might get him to change his gambling style to good positioning.

In general, I'd say that working on their fundamentals would be the principal item but also on the mental side of the game. Working on whatever their weaknesses are - left to themselves people will practice what they are good at and avoid practicing what they are poor at - it's not much fun failing and failing.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I wonder how close the Suns - and other NBA teams - come to coaching their young players the optimum amount. Considering how much they are paid and how young they are it could be a worthwhile investment for most every player to have a coach that works with him almost constantly - the cost wouldn't be prohibitive. I realize there would be a possibility it would muddle things more than help, so you wouldn't want to just do it willy-nilly.

The reason I started to think about this is that in following the Cards forum I have noticed that the posters talk fairly frequently about whether the Cards do enough coaching of their young players. I wouldn't say it was a concensus, but they do say they think the secret to Bellichicks success is his ability to take players that failed elsewhere and turn them into contributors by coaching them better. Football is quite different and they do have position coaches, along with defense and offense being pretty much independent entities.

As a case in point, consider Archie Goodwin, who I did spend time considering how he might have been helped. His biggest failing, IMO, was that he never developed any shots that he could use close in - runner, floater, stop and pop, jump hook. Once he found a seam he always went all the way to rim, regardless of how many players had a chance to block him or impede his progress. Of course, he should have taken it on himself to round out his repretoire but there was never a hint that he even contemplated it. A coach beating him up about it day in and day out - and forcing him to pick a couple of things and work on them every day might have gotten through to him. His defense was pretty poor even though he had the tools to be a good defender so this would be another area where strong coaching might get him to change his gambling style to good positioning.

In general, I'd say that working on their fundamentals would be the principal item but also on the mental side of the game. Working on whatever their weaknesses are - left to themselves people will practice what they are good at and avoid practicing what they are poor at - it's not much fun failing and failing.

I would say that there are teams that do this a lot better than others. For instance, I think Kawhi Leonard would not be that special if he had been drafted by Orlando. Pop finds a way to put players in a position to succeed. He does this by picking his players carefully. He picks players with the basic goods and teachabiliy. That's why Pop would have had nothing to do with Archie Goodwin. He is just flat not teachable.

I know we have all been frustrated with Chriss. But his comments off the court demonstrate at least an outward attitude of teachability. There seems to be a light on there that was not with Archie. His frustrations with himself on the court look like pouting to the average observer. We see the facial expression but we do not know what is going on in his head. I like that Triano is pulling him for griping at the refs. He is also sitting any player immediately that gets a tech. That is what needs to happen with this young team right now. The refs notice Triano doing it and will appreciate it too.

 

[BC867]

Again, you are complaining, but offer no solution.

Again, I'm not getting paid to run the Suns. If a fan has to depend upon another fan to be more knowledgeable than the Brass, what does that say about the Brass?

I said I wouldn't keep bashing them, but I'll respond. I'm trying to understand why you keep posting that you think I am the lack of solving the Suns problems.

OK, as I've posted before . . . the owners need to strip Sarver of his serving as Managing General Partner because he has failed. And the new one needs to hire a General Manager who doesn't have to learn on the job how to build a balanced team. And that an experienced GM will hire a Head Coach who isn't going to be fired a few games into the season and replace him with an Interim who immediately announces that he doesn't want the job beyond this season.

It starts at the top, Stef. Those are my solutions to begin putting us into contention after what will be eight seasons of missing the playoffs and hoping that tanking will bring us the dumb luck to put together a balanced team. What more do you want from me? When are you going to stop simplifying the cause of the problem? With your experience in management, I know you know better. You're just toying with me, aren't you? You probably laugh like hell every time I respond.