Miami/Riley Hot after Amare- Per Yahoo..

[Chaplin]

Don't yell at me. You are assuming the no-Beasley rumors are true and others are assuming the Beasley rumors are true. Both types of rumors are ALL OVER THE INTERNET and both have "articles" with "sources." Nobody knows for sure what did and did not happen except the front offices. Unless you are one of these sources, you have no business presenting speculation (yours or ESPN's) as fact.

Unfortunately, reasoning like this pretty much invalidates everything as just a rumor. I've read that the Heat GM is quoted as saying that Beasley hasn't been offered. But you're right, it could be false, but if you think that, how can you believe anything you read?

 

[82CardsGrad]

You keep harping on that, and the possibility is real, but would Amare be happy playing center for the Heat? Because if they don't get rid of Beasley, that's exactly what Amare would do. And if they decide to move Beasley to the bench, how would that affect his "fragile" ego?

Don't think that Miami is this bed of roses, because it isn't. Outside of Beasley and Wade, Miami has nothing.

Why in the world would Miami move Beasley to the bench if Amare were to join them?? That seems like such an odd statement.
Amare is from Florida. Florida does not have a state income tax... I believe Miami offers a great amount of attraction for Amare and I would not at all be surprised to see him there if the Suns can't lock him up with an extension...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Sarver has been very up front about that fact for years. Sure he would like to win a championship but he is not going to do it with a $90 million payroll (like the Lakers). He has been paying the luxury tax for years and has been easily in the upper half of payroll his entire time here yet is continuously branded as cheap. His self-stated plan is clear: win consistently, play an entertaining style, and hope they luck out with a team that makes a run to the title. In other words, this current team is the exact blueprint of his plan. The only other successful way to build a championship contender is a very painful process: 1) blow up the team, suck for 2-5 years, hope during one of those years you get a top 1-3 pick and that your pick turns out to be a superstar. Then suck or be mediocre for a few more year while you try to build a team around the star. 2) blow up team, suck 2-5 years, stockpile talent with high picks, and then trade for a star from a desperate team (a la Lakers & Celtics) that puts you over the top. There are probably 2 dozen teams that have tried this over the last 15 years and only a handful have been successful at it. If we did this we are more than likely to turn out like the Wizards than anything else. I actually prefer what Sarver and Kerr are doing. Try to hang on and be successful while developing young talent. The Suns are clearly better today than they were 2-3 months ago because of Robin and Goran. Why not continue to try to develop those guys while keeping the nucleus intact. I don't think it is a given at this moment that we lose to any other team in the playoffs beside the Lakers. If they made it to the Western Conference finals or even the semis I think you call that a successful season. Heck, that is basically as well as we have done since Nash has been here.

this what i read (tell me if i'm wrong): blah, blah, blah, i'm okay if we always make the playoffs and bow out in the second round, blah, blah, blah, rather than taking our lumps trying to actually win a championship.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Really? Where did you see that?

Beasley was never offered.

eh, i don't think you can say that definitively either way. we don't really know. of course the heat are going to say beasley was never offered if they don't have to admit it to save his ego.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You keep harping on that, and the possibility is real, but would Amare be happy playing center for the Heat? Because if they don't get rid of Beasley, that's exactly what Amare would do. And if they decide to move Beasley to the bench, how would that affect his "fragile" ego?

Don't think that Miami is this bed of roses, because it isn't. Outside of Beasley and Wade, Miami has nothing.

other than the fact that amare is from there, apparently makes his offseason home there, has stated that he'd love returning to miami, and has arguably the 3rd best player in the league whose won a championship. but yeah, otherwise nothing.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Unfortunately, reasoning like this pretty much invalidates everything as just a rumor. I've read that the Heat GM is quoted as saying that Beasley hasn't been offered. But you're right, it could be false, but if you think that, how can you believe anything you read?

lol, with the nba, i don't anymore.

 

[GYDevil]

this what i read (tell me if i'm wrong): blah, blah, blah, i'm okay if we always make the playoffs and bow out in the second round, blah, blah, blah, rather than taking our lumps trying to actually win a championship.

Tell me where it is written that if you "take your lumps" and suck for years that it is easier to win a championship. We will probably have to agree to disagree. I think a more viable way to win a championship is to stick with a core group of players to build chemistry and try to improve through strategic FA signings (Grant Hill), trades (Jared Dudley) and draft picks (Lopez & Dragic). I would argue that we have a chance to be a top 2-3 team in the west if Amare buys in and Robin continues to develop. Trading Nash and Amare for mid-to-late 1st round picks and cannon fodder is not my idea of working towards a championship team.

 

[Town Drunk]

Last minute trade talks have surfaced between the Utah Jazz and Miami Heat surrounding Carlos Boozer.

The Jazz have been hoping to move Boozer for some time now. Names dropped in the potential trade include point guard Mario Chalmers and big man Udonis Haslem. Washington is also rumored to be involved to make the deal work.
Source: Marc J. Spears on Twitter

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Tell me where it is written that if you "take your lumps" and suck for years that it is easier to win a championship. We will probably have to agree to disagree. I think a more viable way to win a championship is to stick with a core group of players to build chemistry and try to improve through strategic FA signings (Grant Hill), trades (Jared Dudley) and draft picks (Lopez & Dragic). I would argue that we have a chance to be a top 2-3 team in the west if Amare buys in and Robin continues to develop. Trading Nash and Amare for mid-to-late 1st round picks and cannon fodder is not my idea of working towards a championship team.

you really have to have a superstar to win a championship. we don't have that right now. nash is awesome and i've loved his career, but he is incapable of carrying a team to a championship and his star will start fading within the next couple of years. amare is a great second banana. he's a scottie pippen. he's not a michael jordan. if you stay mediocre you never get bad enough to have a shot at a lebron, wade, wall, etc. and as my brother pointed out to me last night, the days of landing a kobe with the 16th pick are behind us b/c high schoolers are no longer allowed to enter the draft, so they're not as big unknowns. so your best opportunity to land that stud is to bottom out. now that said, i'm not saying you don't develop your role players. you can't win without them. so keep developing lopez, dragic, clark, and dudley, but do so without the 45 win season crutches that are the nashes and hills of the world. you add the hills as final pieces for a championship, not to prop up mediocre seasons.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Last minute trade talks have surfaced between the Utah Jazz and Miami Heat surrounding Carlos Boozer.

The Jazz have been hoping to move Boozer for some time now. Names dropped in the potential trade include point guard Mario Chalmers and big man Udonis Haslem. Washington is also rumored to be involved to make the deal work.
Source: Marc J. Spears on Twitter

interesting. anyone hear the talk that if the cleveland deal went down there were rumors of us moving ilgauskas to the jazz for boozer? thought that was interesting.

i actually WANT this deal to happen. if it does it'll take the heat outta the running for amare this summer. one less suitor for him.

 

[mojorizen7]

Tell me where it is written that if you "take your lumps" and suck for years that it is easier to win a championship. We will probably have to agree to disagree. I think a more viable way to win a championship is to stick with a core group of players to build chemistry and try to improve through strategic FA signings (Grant Hill), trades (Jared Dudley) and draft picks (Lopez & Dragic). I would argue that we have a chance to be a top 2-3 team in the west if Amare buys in and Robin continues to develop. Trading Nash and Amare for mid-to-late 1st round picks and cannon fodder is not my idea of working towards a championship team.

I agree but we did that. The title run is over for the core of Nash/JRich/Amare/Hill.
Why can't people see that?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I agree but we did that. The title run is over for the core of Nash/JRich/Barbosa/Amare/Hill.
Why can't people see that?

mojo, i think your post should really read "The title run is over for the core of Nash/JJ/Raja/Marion/Amare/Barbosa because now the core is Nash/JRich/Amare/Hill and that crew has NO CHANCE of winning a championship."

 

[mojorizen7]

mojo, i think your post should really read "The title run is over for the core of Nash/JJ/Raja/Marion/Amare/Barbosa because now the core is Nash/JRich/Amare/Hill and that crew has NO CHANCE of winning a championship."

I'm not afraid of watching a team of Dragic,Barbosa,Dudley,PF,Lopez play hard every night and begin to build something thru a couple drafts and FA.

Fledgling in no mans land and waiting for Nash to leave on his own terms just because he's "earned it?"......you can count me out.

 

[Black Jesus]

you really have to have a superstar to win a championship. we don't have that right now. nash is awesome and i've loved his career, but he is incapable of carrying a team to a championship and his star will start fading within the next couple of years. amare is a great second banana. he's a scottie pippen. he's not a michael jordan. if you stay mediocre you never get bad enough to have a shot at a lebron, wade, wall, etc. and as my brother pointed out to me last night, the days of landing a kobe with the 16th pick are behind us b/c high schoolers are no longer allowed to enter the draft, so they're not as big unknowns. so your best opportunity to land that stud is to bottom out. now that said, i'm not saying you don't develop your role players. you can't win without them. so keep developing lopez, dragic, clark, and dudley, but do so without the 45 win season crutches that are the nashes and hills of the world. you add the hills as final pieces for a championship, not to prop up mediocre seasons.

Wall is overrated. Jennings and Rose will have better careers.

Lets not forget that he has the best backup PG that would start at ANY other school to go along with big men that protect him in Patterson AND Cousins.

This is going to be a weak NBA draft class.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm not afraid of watching a team of Dragic,Barbosa,Dudley,PF,Lopez play hard every night and begin to build something thru a couple drafts and FA.

Fledgling in no mans land and waiting for Nash to leave on his own terms just because he's "earned it?"......you can count me out.

you and i (and cheese) should watch suns games together these days. i think we'd have similar commentary.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Wall is overrated. Jennings and Rose will have better careers.

Lets not forget that he has the best backup PG that would start at ANY other school to go along with big men that protect him in Patterson AND Cousins.

This is going to be a weak NBA draft class.

could be. which is why i'm not totally upset that we don't have our pick this year (though it would have been great if we had actually gotten something for it other than a salary dump).

as for wall, i've watched him a few times and come away impressed. is he better than rose? the pundits keep saying he will be, for me the jury's out (but i have to give the experts some credit here). as for jennings, i love the kid, but i have a feeling he'll never be transcendant. all-star, yeah, but likely never lead a team, ala isaiah thomas, to a championship.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

this what i read (tell me if i'm wrong): blah, blah, blah, i'm okay if we always make the playoffs and bow out in the second round, blah, blah, blah, rather than taking our lumps trying to actually win a championship.

Exactly, in the words of Red, "Get busy living or get busy dying". If you aren't a championship contender, you should be building to it. Anything else is just a waste of time and energy, and wishful thinking. The most frustrating part of all of this is the fact that again, this current group has absolutely NO DIRECTION.

 

[mojorizen7]

you and i (and cheese) should watch suns games together these days. i think we'd have similar commentary.

LOL. Something tells me the cynicism meter would be off the charts

Seriously,I just want to care again.

 

[devilalum]

LOL. Something tells me the cynicism meter would be off the charts

Seriously,I just want to care again.

Yeah, you 3 and Elindholm are like the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse.

 

[tobiazz]

Unfortunately, reasoning like this pretty much invalidates everything as just a rumor. I've read that the Heat GM is quoted as saying that Beasley hasn't been offered. But you're right, it could be false, but if you think that, how can you believe anything you read?

GMs are the least reliable source of truth After no trade goes down, pretty much every GM will say we never considered trading player X to avoid needlessly harming the player's emotions.

I don't believe/assume any rumors are true, but I can assign a likelihood of truth based on where the info is coming from and my instincts or experience over the years. There was much talk of the Suns not wanting Beasley at all and trying to involve a third team. It seems reasonable that Miami would offer Beasley and expirings for Amare and that Phoenix may not accept that offer. Who knows?

Personally, watching the NBA for ~20 years now (yikes) it seems like anytime there is a lot of talk, no trade happens and most trades come seemingly out of nowhere. If you were a GM, why would you tell anyone not in an extremely small trusted circle about potential trades? I think most of the info released is smokescreen. It's probably best to not pay attention to any rumors until the trade deadline passes.

 

[SirStefan32]

There might still be hope

from ESPN
It's appeared that a Amare Stoudemire trade was all but dead this morning. However, a Suns source tells ESPN.com just 15 minutes before the deadline that the Suns now have a potential deal cooking.

No details have emerged and the chances of pulling something off in the last 15 minutes might be impossible. But it does appear that an Amare deal is still on life support.

 

[SirStefan32]

Eh, guess not.

 

[elindholm]

Eh, guess not.

Heh!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

LOL. Something tells me the cynicism meter would be off the charts

Seriously,I just want to care again.

that's my new sig. thanks mojo

 

[slinslin]

Wall is overrated. Jennings and Rose will have better careers.

Lets not forget that he has the best backup PG that would start at ANY other school to go along with big men that protect him in Patterson AND Cousins.

This is going to be a weak NBA draft class.

hahaha

Hope to talk to you again in a year. Can't believe I just read what you wrote. Wall is better than Rose at just EVERYTHING.