RugbyMuffin
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I will tell you right now if that happens I am out of here. I am a Cardinals fan. If the Cardinals go away I will have to find a new team.
That is F'D up
Name change rumor?
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I will tell you right now if that happens I am out of here. I am a Cardinals fan. If the Cardinals go away I will have to find a new team.
That is F'D up
I'm not in favor of a name change, but I don kinda like the Calvary--just not for the Cardinals.
MaoTosiFanClub
The problem
If they change the name I'll be very bitter. But I'll be extremely pissed if they change the colors to some awful shade of purple or teal like the D-Backs home jerseys. If this happens I will throw a tantrum and boycott home Cards games for one year.
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Tim Wagner is a name change maniac.
He actually sent a letter to George Bush attempting to force a name change for the Cards.
He is the epitome of idiocy. I wonder if this is the same guy. Believe me, I will know. As will many others.
He actually sent a letter to George Bush attempting to force a name change for the Cards.
He is the epitome of idiocy. I wonder if this is the same guy. Believe me, I will know. As will many others.
Derm
slippery when wet
Give me an F-ing break.
Tim Wagner's a dork and so is this so called rumor.
Tim Wagner's a dork and so is this so called rumor.
Re: Re: Re: Name change rumor?
He is a guy who post on the Cardinals board ocassionally. All of his threads are the same. He wants the Cardinals to change their name and uniforms to reflect the desert enviroment. His posts sometimes run 2,000 to 3,000 words in giving his opinion of why this change is necessary. The biggest problem is that every thread is the same and says the same thing over and over like a broken record. He is stuck in neutral and can only talk on one subject. After a while, it becomes maddening. He has no sense of history and could care less about the team. I don't think he's even a fan, just some nut with no original thought processes and completely single minded. Never a mention of a team member or any football related items. Just the same old monotenous drone.
He is a guy who post on the Cardinals board ocassionally. All of his threads are the same. He wants the Cardinals to change their name and uniforms to reflect the desert enviroment. His posts sometimes run 2,000 to 3,000 words in giving his opinion of why this change is necessary. The biggest problem is that every thread is the same and says the same thing over and over like a broken record. He is stuck in neutral and can only talk on one subject. After a while, it becomes maddening. He has no sense of history and could care less about the team. I don't think he's even a fan, just some nut with no original thought processes and completely single minded. Never a mention of a team member or any football related items. Just the same old monotenous drone.
Cardinals.Ken
That's Mr. Riff-Raff to you!
At least he's not Tim Wakefield! 
jon_nyaz
The art of music
Re: Change
Cry me a river Buckeye. So you're saying that the only thing that keeps you loyal to this team is the name? That's crap. This team needs a complete overhaul and the name, logo, colors, stadium and front office should all be changed.
Cry me a river Buckeye. So you're saying that the only thing that keeps you loyal to this team is the name? That's crap. This team needs a complete overhaul and the name, logo, colors, stadium and front office should all be changed.
jon_nyaz
The art of music
Re: Re: Re: Re: Name change rumor?
Don't know who this guy is, but I agree with him. The Cardinals stand for losing football as far as I'm concerned. A new name and a new identity would be welcome if they could back it up with performance.
Don't know who this guy is, but I agree with him. The Cardinals stand for losing football as far as I'm concerned. A new name and a new identity would be welcome if they could back it up with performance.
Cbus cardsfan
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Name change rumor?
So then,you think in Baseball the Cubs should change their name because all they're associated with is losing.I agree with the others.The main reason i stayed a CARDINAL fan is because of the name.Nothing against Arizona but i would have preffered it stay the St.Louis Cardinals.I don't root one bit for the St.Louis Rams who,according to you,should stick with the Rams name because they have won recently.
So then,you think in Baseball the Cubs should change their name because all they're associated with is losing.I agree with the others.The main reason i stayed a CARDINAL fan is because of the name.Nothing against Arizona but i would have preffered it stay the St.Louis Cardinals.I don't root one bit for the St.Louis Rams who,according to you,should stick with the Rams name because they have won recently.
Reddog
ASFN Lifer
The name will never change and shouldn't. Too much tradition and history. I hope the logo and color schemes do.
CaptTurbo
ASFN Icon
Id find a new team if we were the cavalry
BuckeyeCardinal
Cantankerous Curmudgeon
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Re: Re: Change
So you don't care about tradition.
I do.
How would changing the name improve the team?
So you don't care about tradition.
I do.
How would changing the name improve the team?
First off, you have a nice ass, Maddog.
Second, it's not true that all Tim Wagner's posts were about the name change. I once called him out at azcentral, he took it personally (you guys know what a not nice person I am, right?) and proceeded to post insults of a not-so-nice nature to me under a different name. (Guess it's easier to pick on a girl.)
Third, if the only reason the Cardinals decide to go ahead with a name change is to get more AZ fans, forget it. Do you honestly believe that more people will come out if the team name changes but its win/loss percentage does not? Plus, I think that many loyal fans (ie us) will be miffed.
Fourth, the element of history is there. The Cards have been around forever. Keep the name.
Win games. That's what puts peoples' moneymakers in the seats.
Second, it's not true that all Tim Wagner's posts were about the name change. I once called him out at azcentral, he took it personally (you guys know what a not nice person I am, right?) and proceeded to post insults of a not-so-nice nature to me under a different name. (Guess it's easier to pick on a girl.)
Third, if the only reason the Cardinals decide to go ahead with a name change is to get more AZ fans, forget it. Do you honestly believe that more people will come out if the team name changes but its win/loss percentage does not? Plus, I think that many loyal fans (ie us) will be miffed.
Fourth, the element of history is there. The Cards have been around forever. Keep the name.
Win games. That's what puts peoples' moneymakers in the seats.
jon_nyaz
The art of music
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Name change rumor?
Um, no. Your rebuttal is thin and poorly thought out. The Cubs haven't moved twice, have they? To my knowledge, they've always been the Chicago Cubs and their fan base, which is <b>not</b> a transient, fickle bunch, loves them despite the losing.
The Cardinals on the other hand have nothing to do with Arizona. They belonged to someone else. Twice. Our residents here are typically from somewhere else too and they have no compelling reason to back the team given the complete lack of performance for the last 60 years. Everyone knows that the only true way to get people to buy into the team is to vastly improve performance. However, as someone who knows a thing or two about branding, a complete identity change that spurs the imagination and offers something that people can relate to can and will provide a boost of novelty followed by a significant period of loyalty (assuming performance improvement accompanies the identity change).
As far as the Rams are concerned, I do think they could/should consider an identity change, but once again they have two things that the Cardinals lack. One is a stable resident base. The other is a winning program. So they easily get away with what the Cardinals can't.
Um, no. Your rebuttal is thin and poorly thought out. The Cubs haven't moved twice, have they? To my knowledge, they've always been the Chicago Cubs and their fan base, which is <b>not</b> a transient, fickle bunch, loves them despite the losing.
The Cardinals on the other hand have nothing to do with Arizona. They belonged to someone else. Twice. Our residents here are typically from somewhere else too and they have no compelling reason to back the team given the complete lack of performance for the last 60 years. Everyone knows that the only true way to get people to buy into the team is to vastly improve performance. However, as someone who knows a thing or two about branding, a complete identity change that spurs the imagination and offers something that people can relate to can and will provide a boost of novelty followed by a significant period of loyalty (assuming performance improvement accompanies the identity change).
As far as the Rams are concerned, I do think they could/should consider an identity change, but once again they have two things that the Cardinals lack. One is a stable resident base. The other is a winning program. So they easily get away with what the Cardinals can't.
jon_nyaz
The art of music
Re: Re: Re: Change
See my above post. It's a branding concept. I have my marketing hat on. And the only tradition this team has is a losing one. In general I care about tradition, but I would rather see a stadium filled with passionate fans for the HOME TEAM for a change.
See my above post. It's a branding concept. I have my marketing hat on. And the only tradition this team has is a losing one. In general I care about tradition, but I would rather see a stadium filled with passionate fans for the HOME TEAM for a change.
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Thanks!!!!!
See my above post. It's a branding concept. I have my marketing hat on. And the only tradition this team has is a losing one. In general I care about tradition, but I would rather see a stadium filled with passionate fans for the HOME TEAM for a change.
A better example would be the Kentucky Fried Chicken franchise.
They had begun having real trouble marketing their product because of changes in American eating habits. In an effort to stop the downward trend the company went to the brand "KFC" to remove "fried" and its negative conotation.
It worked for a short while but the product was still the same and sales dropped again.
"New team in town" worked for a while, "Buddy Ryan" worked for one season, "Emmit Smith" did not work at all. The product, since the '98 season, has been so bad no branding strategies will sell it other than "there's a new owner in town".
A better example would be the Kentucky Fried Chicken franchise.
They had begun having real trouble marketing their product because of changes in American eating habits. In an effort to stop the downward trend the company went to the brand "KFC" to remove "fried" and its negative conotation.
It worked for a short while but the product was still the same and sales dropped again.
"New team in town" worked for a while, "Buddy Ryan" worked for one season, "Emmit Smith" did not work at all. The product, since the '98 season, has been so bad no branding strategies will sell it other than "there's a new owner in town".
Red Air Force
DILLIGAFF
IF winning accompanies a name change I think it would definetly help local fan support within AZ. However I also think they would lose many out of state fans who would feel alienated. The thing about out of state fans though, is that they do not buy many tickets. Which is what the team really needs.
CardinalMike
Chickens can't clap!
All Tampa had to do was change their colors. Then again who was smoking what when they decided that strained carrots orange and white made good uniform colors?
Cardinal Mike!!
Cardinal Mike!!
Cardinals.Ken
That's Mr. Riff-Raff to you!
Umm...that would have been me...sorry...
jon_nyaz
The art of music
I like Tampa's uniforms!
denverbirdfan
thanks for flying
here's what would happen
the cards would change their name/colors to outlaws or something dumb like that - get a "raideresque" logo - and people would be interested until we're 1-5 again and talking about a new name change. i'm a cub fan (95 years since '08) and a big red fan (56 years since '47) and a name change would be simply a wimpy cover for not solving the real problems of winning.
the cards would change their name/colors to outlaws or something dumb like that - get a "raideresque" logo - and people would be interested until we're 1-5 again and talking about a new name change. i'm a cub fan (95 years since '08) and a big red fan (56 years since '47) and a name change would be simply a wimpy cover for not solving the real problems of winning.
jon_nyaz
The art of music
Re: here's what would happen
If the Bidwill's did it right (for which I have very little faith), they would change the identity of the team using a democratic process that directly involved the residents of the state of AZ. It's been done many times before and it creates a sense of loyalty that would transcend the performance of the team to a certain degree.
If the Bidwill's did it right (for which I have very little faith), they would change the identity of the team using a democratic process that directly involved the residents of the state of AZ. It's been done many times before and it creates a sense of loyalty that would transcend the performance of the team to a certain degree.
IMO I don't want a name change. If one was done, however, I have always liked the name "Toros".
When they run onto the field - cue a stampede track.
When they do crappy - we can yell - "Bull $^!#"
When they run onto the field - cue a stampede track.
When they do crappy - we can yell - "Bull $^!#"
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