Name change rumor?

[denverbirdfan]

i don't exactly remember people shying away from sds in '98 while we were winning because they didn't get to vote on the team name. in fact, if we were to start winning, the fact that we were the arizona cardinals (a team that has sucked for so long) would capture the country's imagination - not just phoenix's.

 

[seesred]

Sometimes change is good. Our team needs change. We have a long history of being a so so to bad franchise. Bidwill is loved by the other owners but not by the fan base. Comparing our team to the Cubs or Red Sox has no bearing. Those teams have been in the market place for ever. They have tradition in players , in stadium, in memories. WE must creat what they have.

The stadium will help, it will be our home. New players and some winning will help that will creat excitment. Changing the name for our team would help. Running on the field would be Arizonas team. With our colors and our jerseys etc; The coyotes changed their name and they are moving to their home with new colors and new players. The new building is near sold out. The first games tickets are selling for near $1,000 on the glass.

When this team came to town people were excited. WE were 7-4 trhe first year and didn't win another game. THe prices were to high, the product wasn't as advertised, the stadium stunk, and even with all that to buy season tickets people were paying big money and the seats were full. Yes 1998 was special, but thats not tradition thats one year. Dads, Moms and kids, remembering the games together seeing the outlaws or what ever in a beautifull stadium will be a memory!

GBR

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
See my above post. It's a branding concept. I have my marketing hat on. And the only tradition this team has is a losing one. In general I care about tradition, but I would rather see a stadium filled with passionate fans for the HOME TEAM for a change.

Go ahead and change the name.

Keep Bidwill and his boys around. He'll probably change the name just to appease fans like you.

I'm sure you'll be happy with the Arizona Toros who still suck.

Get rid of Bidwill and you won't have to change the name.

Just change the name for change sake and you lose some fans.

Why do you think the Browns kept their name?

 

[jon_nyaz]

Originally posted by denverbirdfan
i don't exactly remember people shying away from sds in '98 while we were winning because they didn't get to vote on the team name. in fact, if we were to start winning, the fact that we were the arizona cardinals (a team that has sucked for so long) would capture the country's imagination - not just phoenix's.

Sigh... The point is that an identity change may actually help create fan loyalty without performance. The Diamondbacks had tremendous fan support their first year and the team sucked. Obviously winning cures all, but it may be a while before the Cardinals become a perenial powerhouse and an identity change involving the public that coincides with the new stadium would add a freshness and excitement to an otherwise rotten smelling franchise.

 

[SECTION 11]

Marketing-wise, fan-wise, etc. it's worked very well for the Coyotes.

The Coyotes have cut payroll how many times during the last eight months? And this is before moving into a new facility? That's unheard of (unless you're the Eagles). Yet despite getting rid of their best players, cutting payroll on top of that, maintaining high ticket prices, blah blah blah, they're still loved for the most part in the Valley. Strange isn't it?

I'm all for a name change, uniform change, venue change.

By the way, I consider myself a history buff.

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by BuckeyeCardinal
Why do you think the Browns kept their name?

Because the Browns have throngs of loyal fans.
The Cardinals have nothing even remotely close to that. They get bashed more by their home city than they do the rest of the NFL.

This isn't a good comparison at all.

 

[jon_nyaz]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by BuckeyeCardinal


Why do you think the Browns kept their name?

Once again.... Cleveland is a town with a very stable residency. Phoenix has one of the most unstable residencies in the country. The people in Cleveland have lived there for generations. Their daddies were Browns fans. Their grandaddies were Browns fans. And now THEY are Browns fans. To top it off, the Browns don't suck every year like clockwork. Phoenix and the Cardinal organization don't have the luxury of a stable residency and they haven't performed on the field. Why is this so hard for you to understand?

The bottom line is that if the identity of the team were changed, and we lost fans like you who care more about the name "Cardinals" than anything else but we attracted five to ten times more fans that would never have been caught dead rooting for the Cardinals, then that is well worth it.

 

[seesred]

THe name Cleveland Browns is deep with tradiotion ion that city. It didn't matter if they won or lost the city is in love with the Browns. There is a big difference . If our team was still the Chicago Cardinals they two would be to deep in tradition to change a 40 , 50 year city team. Our team started in 1988. had no following in this city. They have yet to attract but 20-30 thousand fans to root for them or die with them or rember the fact that they havn't won a championship in 95 years. Yes the Cub fans are beautifull die hards. They will root for that team no matter who owns them or how they fail. The team, is deep in that city and ther city loves them for what they do.

The Cards must creat that carring. I think they are closer than most think because I hear all these people say I was listening or watching and I was hopeing they would win. CHange the situation around, new name, new stadium , new colors and dispite the owners we will bring in fans and creat excitment that might just rub off on the players and everyone gets a lift and a memory and 50 years from now it will always be Arizonas team. If giving to charities was a measurment for winning or losing we are champions now. Bidwill famalies charities are tremendous givers to ARIZONA needs. Not Chicago not Cleveland not Boston.

THis team will find its time and win just like in the 70's with this ownership and a full worn down stadium. WE were close a few years ago and we will be there again. I hope we change everything including every sock and every shoe. Let them finnaly be ours, not theirs.

GBR

GBR

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
The bottom line is that if the identity of the team were changed, and we lost fans like you who care more about the name "Cardinals" than anything else but we attracted five to ten times more fans that would never have been caught dead rooting for the Cardinals, then that is well worth it.

I completely agree.

 

[seesred]

I totaly agree as well. I wouldn't want to lose you but6 I do want 60 thousand plus to call this team ours.

GBR

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: Change

Originally posted by BuckeyeCardinal
They change the name....I change teams.

This is ridiculous.

 

[Rivercard]

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
Sigh... The point is that an identity change may actually help create fan loyalty without performance. The Diamondbacks had tremendous fan support their first year and the team sucked. Obviously winning cures all, but it may be a while before the Cardinals become a perenial powerhouse and an identity change involving the public that coincides with the new stadium would add a freshness and excitement to an otherwise rotten smelling franchise.

Spoken like a true marketer. I have to listen to this drivel all day at work and now here it is on the board. Let me tell you, football is not like KFC or corporate America. Football from a fan's perspective is about passion & loyalty. It is not about some marketing scheme designed to cover up a bad team and get people in the seats for one season. If they wanted to change the name they should have done it when they first moved to AZ (ala the Titans). A name change overhaul at this stage reaks of desperation.
Mr. B has already changed the name once since moving to Arizona (remember the Phoenix Cardinals). Let's hope he's smart enough to not do it again.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
Sigh... The point is that an identity change may actually help create fan loyalty without performance. The Diamondbacks had tremendous fan support their first year and the team sucked. Obviously winning cures all, but it may be a while before the Cardinals become a perenial powerhouse and an identity change involving the public that coincides with the new stadium would add a freshness and excitement to an otherwise rotten smelling franchise.

Yeah but the Dbacks were created from scratch, there was no St. Louis Cardinals past that moved there and became the Dbacks.

I would still follow the new team name but I became a Cardinal fan in 1975 and my loyalty has nothing to do with where the team plays. If they moved to Havana I'd still be a fan.

I just think changing the name is like getting a new job title instead of a raise or actual promotion, it's window dressing.

I wouldn't stop following if they became the Cavalry or whatever but I seriously doubt if enough current non fans would become fans just because they changed the name. I see Jon's point about involving the people but I gotta tell you that's not always what it's cut out to be. You'll have several names submitted all with loyal followings, the one selected will be great for its supporters, and alienate those who backed a different name.

If it's all done as a clean sweep I suppose that would be a good thing but my preference would be keep the name, improve the football team.

 

[Rivercard]

Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by SECTION 11
This is ridiculous.

What is so rediculous about that? Fans get very attached to team names/logos etc. Just like Raider fans would get upset to have a name change when they moved to LA, old-timer Cards fans would too.

 

[Pariah]

Originally posted by Russ Smith
If they moved to Havana I'd still be a fan.

I think that would be pretty cool--the Havana Rollers. Or, the Havana Bananas.

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by Rivercard
If they wanted to change the name they should have done it when they first moved to AZ (ala the Titans).

Or with their second golden opportunity, in 2006.

 

[jon_nyaz]

Originally posted by Rivercard
Spoken like a true marketer. I have to listen to this drivel all day at work and now here it is on the board. Let me tell you, football is not like KFC or corporate America. Football from a fan's perspective is about passion & loyalty. It is not about some marketing scheme designed to cover up a bad team and get people in the seats for one season. If they wanted to change the name they should have done it when they first moved to AZ (ala the Titans). A name change overhaul at this stage reaks of desperation.
Mr. B has already changed the name once since moving to Arizona (remember the Phoenix Cardinals). Let's hope he's smart enough to not do it again.

Nothing wrong with being a "true marketer"! You are right that passion and loyalty is what creating a fan base is all about. But any business person will tell you that passion and loyalty is also what creating a brand is all about. So it's the same damn thing whether you like it or not. People will only part with their money, and offer their loyalty, if they see the value in something. So tell me all mightly judgmental one, how would you propose the Arizona NFL franchise do that considering their sorry-ass brand?

 

[ajcardfan]

How about a compromise?

The team can be an unpronounciable symbol, and referred to as "The team formerly known as the Arizona Cardinals."

 

[maddogkf]

Originally posted by Pariah
I think that would be pretty cool--the Havana Rollers. Or, the Havana Bananas.

I like the Cuban Cigars as a team name myself.....sort of NFL Europe-ish like the Scottish Claymores

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
Nothing wrong with being a "true marketer"! You are right that passion and loyalty is what creating a fan base is all about. But any business person will tell you that passion and loyalty is also what creating a brand is all about. So it's the same damn thing whether you like it or not. People will only part with their money, and offer their loyalty, if they see the value in something. So tell me all mightly judgmental one, how would you propose the Arizona NFL franchise do that considering their sorry-ass brand?

I see your point but we all realize the reason the "brand" is sorry is because the team loses not because of the name.

If they change the name as part of a COMPLETE overhaul, I'd support it, if they just change the name and put the same product in a new package, it would piss me off.

have they done any sort of projected attendance figures for the new stadium yet or is it too early for them to do such things? DO they have any feel for how much attendance will jump in the new stadium I would be stunned if it didn't. You have to forgive me I live in California where the local news can project an entire election from talking to 3 people in line at the bagel shop that morning!

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by maddogkf
I like the Cuban Cigars as a team name myself.....sort of NFL Europe-ish like the Scottish Claymores

But if we still stink it opens up way too many jokes. And the Seahawks extinguish the Cigars 38-0/

The advantage of Havana is you know the Big Red will get government backing.

 

[jon_nyaz]

Originally posted by Russ Smith
I see your point but we all realize the reason the "brand" is sorry is because the team loses not because of the name.

If they change the name as part of a COMPLETE overhaul, I'd support it, if they just change the name and put the same product in a new package, it would piss me off.

have they done any sort of projected attendance figures for the new stadium yet or is it too early for them to do such things? DO they have any feel for how much attendance will jump in the new stadium I would be stunned if it didn't. You have to forgive me I live in California where the local news can project an entire election from talking to 3 people in line at the bagel shop that morning!

I completely agree. A complete overhaul including the new stadium, new identity and a new front office would be the right thing to do. Changing the identity and putting a terrible product out there will accomplish very little in the long run.

 

[Rivercard]

Originally posted by jon_nyaz
You are right that passion and loyalty is what creating a fan base is all about. But any business person will tell you that passion and loyalty is also what creating a brand is all about. So it's the same damn thing whether you like it or not. So tell me all mightly judgmental one, how would you propose the Arizona NFL franchise do that considering their sorry-ass brand?

Here's the difference. People are not emotionally invested in buying Fried Chicken. People who buy fried chicken could care less that Colonel Sanders has a spiffy new mustache. The solution is simple, we need better product - not a shiny new box to put it in.
Now irony of ironies, I'm off to give a presentation to the marketing group here at work. (I'm not kidding!)

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Change

Originally posted by SECTION 11
Because the Browns have throngs of loyal fans.
The Cardinals have nothing even remotely close to that. They get bashed more by their home city than they do the rest of the NFL.

This isn't a good comparison at all.

So you're calling those of us who have followed the Cards for 40+ years non-loyal fans!!!

Did you ever hear of the 1947 championship?

I know....2 long ago...doesn't count....I was born in 1948 pal....it means something to me.

The Cards played Philadelphia for the chamionship that year. Charley Trippi scored on a punt return...Tommy Thompson of Philly had only one eye but comleted 27-44 for 297 yards....bottom line is that we won 28-21.....but who cares about that....that's tradition...that sucks......what sucks is that old Bidwill dies after the season and his wife keeps evfry thing in the family.

The Cubs haven't won since 1918.....have their fans asked for a name change....hell no.....they're true fans....you name change guys make sick.....a bunch of mamby pamby who cares about tradition frikkin losers.....kiss may arse.

 

[FanOfTheGame1]

However, as someone who knows a thing or two about branding, a complete identity change that spurs the imagination and offers something that people can relate to can and will provide a boost of novelty followed by a significant period of loyalty

It makes me sad to hear "marketing-speak". There isn't a word of truth to it, the entire marketing/advertising industry is just a house of cards. But of course you can't tell them that.