Nick Bosa vs Quinnen Williams. Your Pros/Cons of drafting 1?

[Veer]

Actually Belichick brought heavy blitz pressure through the middle, including stuff that Mahomes probably hasn't seen before. Mahomes predictably could escape quite often, but while the Pats blitzed through the middle, their edge defenders were focussed on containing Mahomes rather than rush him. Plus Belichick is a master in taking your best routes away, which took Mahomes out of his wide ranging comfort zone.

With Chandler Jones and Nick Bosa, I'd expect us to get home rushing 4 very consistently. I like some aggressive blitzing for us, but remember how often we got burned by good playcallers when we predictably brought a blitz under Bettcher and Bowles. That's what seperated the really elite defenses of this era from our very good unit.

 

[PACardsFan]

The right DL is valuable in either scheme.

All I know is (1) we were inconsistant vs. the run playing the 3-4 last year and (2) a disruptive presence inside could wreak havoc for opposing offenses. In terms of "need", I'd rank positions (1) CB, (2) NT, (3) ILB and then (4) an EDGE guy.

But if we were to go the BPA route, I'd be leery of Bosa's injury history and assessment that he's more technician than athlete.

In a perfect world, I'd want my #1 pick to be a freakish athlete before anything else. Next, I'd want him to be an animal in terms of effort and, finally, a student of the game.

If the draft were held today, My top 3 would be : Q Williams, Greedy Williams and then Bosa - but it's early and all that could change

I've been trying to watch more tape of these guys this past week. Whereas Bosa is phenomenal with his hands, it's wrong to say that he's not athletic. He does have an array of moves, and has perfected almost every one of them. Can injuries derail his career? Sure, but injuries can apply to any of these top players. Quinnen is also a guy that is a difference maker. DT's always scare me though. High risk, high reward kind of guy. He can control the LOS, or he can eat himself out of the NFL. I was initially completely opposed to drafting him, but could come around if that's the route that Keim takes. Greedy Williams has to be the greatest name ever for a DB. Again, DB's scare me this high in the draft order. This kid is a freak at times, and average at other times. I wouldn't take this guy unless we traded down, which I am NOT a fan of doing. One thing is certain, LSU is DB U. The tape I have watched on Oliver just may not be good tape. He seems to be super athletic & a sure tackler. But, he seems to engage blockers instead of shedding them. I've seen him make too many tackles after 3 yard gains. That concerns me when he has to play against bigger & stronger NFL players.

Bottom line, if we stay at #1, it would have to be either Bosa or Q Williams. There are some great players at the top of this draft, but these 2, IMO, are the only ones I would risk taking at #1.

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

I've been trying to watch more tape of these guys this past week. Whereas Bosa is phenomenal with his hands, it's wrong to say that he's not athletic. He does have an array of moves, and has perfected almost every one of them. Can injuries derail his career? Sure, but injuries can apply to any of these top players. Quinnen is also a guy that is a difference maker. DT's always scare me though. High risk, high reward kind of guy. He can control the LOS, or he can eat himself out of the NFL. I was initially completely opposed to drafting him, but could come around if that's the route that Keim takes. Greedy Williams has to be the greatest name ever for a DB. Again, DB's scare me this high in the draft order. This kid is a freak at times, and average at other times. I wouldn't take this guy unless we traded down, which I am NOT a fan of doing. One thing is certain, LSU is DB U. The tape I have watched on Oliver just may not be good tape. He seems to be super athletic & a sure tackler. But, he seems to engage blockers instead of shedding them. I've seen him make too many tackles after 3 yard gains. That concerns me when he has to play against bigger & stronger NFL players.

Bottom line, if we stay at #1, it would have to be either Bosa or Q Williams. There are some great players at the top of this draft, but these 2, IMO, are the only ones I would risk taking at #1.

Bosa is an advanced technician and has elite size and athleticism. He would start immediately thereby easing the transition of the new staff. It’s a no brainer unless he gets injured before the draft

 

[GatorAZ]

Bosa is an advanced technician and has elite size and athleticism. He would start immediately thereby easing the transition of the new staff. It’s a no brainer unless he gets injured before the draft

I don’t think he’s as strong as Joey was at the same age so I wouldn’t expect his production to be the same right away. But he will be just as good if not better by year 2-3 IMO. Another reason why I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing back Golden since we have the funds

 

[Krangodnzr]

I don’t think he’s as strong as Joey was at the same age so I wouldn’t expect his production to be the same right away. But he will be just as good if not better by year 2-3 IMO. Another reason why I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing back Golden since we have the funds

Golden is only worth a modest 2-3 year deal. I suspect he will want a short term deal with a chance to start to try to parlay it into a big contract.

 

[JeffGollin]

I don’t think he’s as strong as Joey was at the same age so I wouldn’t expect his production to be the same right away. But he will be just as good if not better by year 2-3 IMO. Another reason why I wouldn’t be opposed to bringing back Golden since we have the funds

At this early stage of tye offseason, most of my thinking is influenced more by what I've heard than it is what I've seen.

What makes me nervous about Bosa (other than the injury - which is also based on hear-say) is that he's described as a "technician" who plays his position mistake-free. Kind of reminds me of the perfect fit for a Wilks defense, and that's what makes me a bit leery. Hopefully, Bosa will prove he's more than that during the period between now and the Combine.

 

[BW52]

Every "so called expert" has Bosa as the number 1 prospect.Most have Q.Williams number 2.Watching videos of both shows 2 high quality players.I prefer Bosa because I think he can play 3-4 DE or 4-3 DE well.Q.Williams looks pretty good also but is just a bit behind Bosa IMHO.Iwant the Cards to pick the best guy for what they want on defense.Bosa and Q.Williams should be the two options at #1 .I just don`t want the Cards to overthink it and pull something out of their ass and screw around by drafting a WR or LB or CB or QB with top pick.Take the pick by drafting the guy you want and don`t mess it up.

 

[TheCardFan]

Chandler Jones draft video....played with his hand on the ground/DE at Syracuse.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-draft/09000d5d828a4af1/Patriots-pick-Chandler-Jones-No-21

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Chopper0080]

At this early stage of tye offseason, most of my thinking is influenced more by what I've heard than it is what I've seen.

What makes me nervous about Bosa (other than the injury - which is also based on hear-say) is that he's described as a "technician" who plays his position mistake-free. Kind of reminds me of the perfect fit for a Wilks defense, and that's what makes me a bit leery. Hopefully, Bosa will prove he's more than that during the period between now and the Combine.

The same thing was said about Larry Fitzgerald. Not a freak athletically. Had advanced technique from being around the league when he was young. Just saying.

 

[DVontel]

The same thing was said about Larry Fitzgerald. Not a freak athletically. Had advanced technique from being around the league when he was young. Just saying.

Yea, I’m not so sure what’s so wrong with being a technician. That should be the #1 trait when reviewing a first round prospect.

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

Yea, I’m not so sure what’s so wrong with being a technician. That should be the #1 trait when reviewing a first round prospect.

Larry Fitzgerald has been criticized for lack of speed since he came out of high school. Seems to have worked out alright. I value technique and passion for the game more than ever

 

[Finito]

Fitzgerald was a hell of an athlete when he was young. We've just been watching Old Larry for so long we forget it.

He could blow by guys when he needed to and outside of moss he's the best I ever seen at jump balls he could jump out the building.

Now why Larry has been able to last so long he was also a huge technician that's allowed him to go from the outside to the inside when he couldn't cut it outside anymore

 

[Krangodnzr]

At this early stage of tye offseason, most of my thinking is influenced more by what I've heard than it is what I've seen.

What makes me nervous about Bosa (other than the injury - which is also based on hear-say) is that he's described as a "technician" who plays his position mistake-free. Kind of reminds me of the perfect fit for a Wilks defense, and that's what makes me a bit leery. Hopefully, Bosa will prove he's more than that during the period between now and the Combine.

Just watch his tape and he's just an old school, smack you in the mouth, ride the tackle into the QB kind of player. Tough, smart, rarely misdiagnoses plays. And hes got enough quickness to turn the corner.

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

Just watch his tape and he's just an old school, smack you in the mouth, ride the tackle into the QB kind of player. Tough, smart, rarely misdiagnoses plays. And hes got enough quickness to turn the corner.

http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2019nbosa.php

Basically needs to put on a few pounds and will be an equivalent of his brother. Fine in 34 or 43 or even Wilks land

 

[BACH]

I'm leaning more and more towards Josh Allen

 

[Dr. Jones]

Easy:

If Wilks was still here: Q. Williams
With Vance Joseph: N. Bosa

 

[scandalous_b]

Every "so called expert" has Bosa as the number 1 prospect.Most have Q.Williams number 2.Watching videos of both shows 2 high quality players.I prefer Bosa because I think he can play 3-4 DE or 4-3 DE well.Q.Williams looks pretty good also but is just a bit behind Bosa IMHO.Iwant the Cards to pick the best guy for what they want on defense.Bosa and Q.Williams should be the two options at #1 .I just don`t want the Cards to overthink it and pull something out of their ass and screw around by drafting a WR or LB or CB or QB with top pick.Take the pick by drafting the guy you want and don`t mess it up.

Bosa is either a 4-3 DE or a 3-4 OLB. He’s nowhere near big enough to be a 3-4 DE.

With that being said, most NFL defenses are in the nickel probably about 70% of the time. Either way he’ll be an edge rusher with his hand on the ground the majority of the time.

 

[BW52]

Q.UOTE="scandalous_b, post: 3883000, member: 15550"]Bosa is either a 4-3 DE or a 3-4 OLB. He’s nowhere near big enough to be a 3-4 DE.

With that being said, most NFL defenses are in the nickel probably about 70% of the time. Either way he’ll be an edge rusher with his hand on the ground the majority of the time.[/QUOTE]

Bosa has enough strength and technique to hold up at 3-4 DE.6`3 270 isn`t exactly a midget.Who`s to say he couldn`t add 10-15 LBs if the Coaches wanted him too.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Q.UOTE="scandalous_b, post: 3883000, member: 15550"]Bosa is either a 4-3 DE or a 3-4 OLB. He’s nowhere near big enough to be a 3-4 DE.

With that being said, most NFL defenses are in the nickel probably about 70% of the time. Either way he’ll be an edge rusher with his hand on the ground the majority of the time.

Bosa has enough strength and technique to hold up at 3-4 DE.6`3 270 isn`t exactly a midget.Who`s to say he couldn`t add 10-15 LBs if the Coaches wanted him too.[/QUOTE]

It's a misuse of him to put him at 34 DE.

34 DEs are usually converted DTs.

 

[JeffGollin]

Larry Fitzgerald has been criticized for lack of speed since he came out of high school. Seems to have worked out alright. I value technique and passion for the game more than ever

Your logic is hard to argue with.

But my gut continues to raise a red flag when a "systems" guy is brought in to fill a " break all the dishes" role.

(Usually, logic trumps gut but I'm sticking with my opinion).

 

[Krangodnzr]

Your logic is hard to argue with.

But my gut continues to raise a red flag when a "systems" guy is brought in to fill a " break all the dishes" role.

(Usually, logic trumps gut but I'm sticking with my opinion).

Boss is not a systems guy. I think you need to watch more film.

Bosa could thrive at most front seven positions. He's that good

 

[BW52]

Bosa has enough strength and technique to hold up at 3-4 DE.6`3 270 isn`t exactly a midget.Who`s to say he couldn`t add 10-15 LBs if the Coaches wanted him too.

It's a misuse of him to put him at 34 DE.

34 DEs are usually converted DTs.[/QUOTE]


You point that fact out and yet you state Bosa can play any of the front 7 positions in a later post.I think the point is that I think Bosa can hold up at the DE spot against the run.I know that a lot of 3-4 DEs are bigger and generally less skilled passrushing and more run defense oriented while the pass rush comes from elsewhere.

 

[DVontel]

Good Lord


If Chandler Jones can flourish as a 3-4 OLB after running a 4-3 @ Syracuse & in New England, I see no reason why a better prospect in Nick Bosa can’t do the same.

 

[The Kraken]

Not to mention, Joey Bosa, who is similarly built, played as a 34 OLB during his 1st year w/the chargers...10.5 sacks in 12 games "out of position"

 

[Chopper0080]

Fitzgerald was a hell of an athlete when he was young. We've just been watching Old Larry for so long we forget it.

He could blow by guys when he needed to and outside of moss he's the best I ever seen at jump balls he could jump out the building.

Now why Larry has been able to last so long he was also a huge technician that's allowed him to go from the outside to the inside when he couldn't cut it outside anymore

All of these guys are great athletes entering the league, but Larry was never a freak athlete. He ran a 4.48 at the combine. TE Ben Watson ran a 4.5.

Also, Larry benefits on jump balls with his body control and his height, not because he has all world hops. Again, there is a certain level of athleticism you have to have to be an NFL player. Larry has always had that, but he not abnormally so ala players like Andre Johnson or Calvin Johnson or Randy Moss.