Niners at Cardinals gameday thread 12-17-23

[nashman]

Simple they not really trying to win lol… multiple games we have marched eighth down the field and scored now with first drive looking great mixing it up under center etc. we score then go totally away from it to shotgun and start playing around. More evaluation going on than trying to win imho…

Also what is with complete lack of play action passes with that running game?

 

[nashman]

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Should have been roughing on the play for contact to the head just another one of many dirty or late hits not called today! And shouldn’t really be funny to any man…

 

[Brak]

On the contrary. Franchise him and give him all of the money.

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[BritCard]

It’s both. These WRs aren’t helping much.

Yesterday Hollywood barely played, so Wilson was picking up CB1 coverage most of the game. So that didn't help.

Do we have the best WR's in the league? Nope. Do we have WR's that are better than what Kyler is giving them? Yes we do.

Both Hollywood and Wilson had over 90 yards each with Josh Dobbs in the first Niners game.

Kyler can't throw on time and in rhythm. Nearly every pass I recall yesterday was to a wide open guy that was schemed open. Especially McBride. There were a couple of throws where McBride saved Kylers ass on throws that were off target that were easy throws. The only pass I recall that wasn't wide open was the TD to Higgings and that was still pretty open.

Basically, unless either outside receiver can get wide ass open against the best cornerbacks the opposition have they have no chance. Kyler isn't going to find you on a back shoulder throw or an out route that requires timing, or the other 90% of passes that WR's rely on that require timing and accurate ball placement.

Being successful at WR isn't about beating your man by 3 yards so Kyler can find you wide open. It's running routes that require your QB to deliver the ball on time and in the right place because the offense has the advantage in knowing where the ball is going. And Kyler simply isn't, or can't or doesn't trust himself to do that.

Maybe it's a result of lack of practice and not having an offseason to build trust, but he's played with Hollywood for years and there has been little evidence of Kyler being able to do this in previous seasons.

 

[Stout]

Yesterday Hollywood barely played, so Wilson was picking up CB1 coverage most of the game. So that didn't help.

Do we have the best WR's in the league? Nope. Do we have WR's that are better than what Kyler is giving them? Yes we do.

Both Hollywood and Wilson had over 90 yards each with Josh Dobbs in the first Niners game.

Kyler can't throw on time and in rhythm. Nearly every pass I recall yesterday was to a wide open guy that was schemed open. Especially McBride. There were a couple of throws where McBride saved Kylers ass on throws that were off target that were easy throws. The only pass I recall that wasn't wide open was the TD to Higgings and that was still pretty open.

Basically, unless either outside receiver can get wide ass open against the best cornerbacks the opposition have they have no chance. Kyler isn't going to find you on a back shoulder throw or an out route that requires timing, or the other 90% of passes that WR's rely on that require timing and accurate ball placement.

Being successful at WR isn't about beating your man by 3 yards so Kyler can find you wide open. It's running routes that require your QB to deliver the ball on time and in the right place because the offense has the advantage in knowing where the ball is going. And Kyler simply isn't, or can't or doesn't trust himself to do that.

Maybe it's a result of lack of practice and not having an offseason to build trust, but he's played with Hollywood for years and there has been little evidence of Kyler being able to do this in previous seasons.

This. All of this. Especially the bolded, which is his biggest problem.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

This. All of this. Especially the bolded, which is his biggest problem.

Do we think that bringing someone like Kurt Warner would help him to learn more about reading a defense and throwing guys open?

 

[ajcardfan]

Do we think that bringing someone like Kurt Warner would help him to learn more about reading a defense and throwing guys open?

Kurt Warner isn't going to take a huge paycut and work more hours to coach. He has a lot of interests besides football.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Kurt Warner isn't going to take a huge paycut and work more hours to coach. He has a lot of interests besides football.

That's why I said someone like him

Someone who can teach him

Doesn't Carson Palmers brother have a school or something like that?

 

[kerouac9]

FIVE fumbles yesterday. Oof.

 

[Stout]

Do we think that bringing someone like Kurt Warner would help him to learn more about reading a defense and throwing guys open?

I think Kyler having someone other than his damned father as his personal and offseason QB coach would freaking help lol

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Yesterday Hollywood barely played, so Wilson was picking up CB1 coverage most of the game. So that didn't help.

Do we have the best WR's in the league? Nope. Do we have WR's that are better than what Kyler is giving them? Yes we do.

Both Hollywood and Wilson had over 90 yards each with Josh Dobbs in the first Niners game.

Kyler can't throw on time and in rhythm. Nearly every pass I recall yesterday was to a wide open guy that was schemed open. Especially McBride. There were a couple of throws where McBride saved Kylers ass on throws that were off target that were easy throws. The only pass I recall that wasn't wide open was the TD to Higgings and that was still pretty open.

Basically, unless either outside receiver can get wide ass open against the best cornerbacks the opposition have they have no chance. Kyler isn't going to find you on a back shoulder throw or an out route that requires timing, or the other 90% of passes that WR's rely on that require timing and accurate ball placement.

Being successful at WR isn't about beating your man by 3 yards so Kyler can find you wide open. It's running routes that require your QB to deliver the ball on time and in the right place because the offense has the advantage in knowing where the ball is going. And Kyler simply isn't, or can't or doesn't trust himself to do that.

Maybe it's a result of lack of practice and not having an offseason to build trust, but he's played with Hollywood for years and there has been little evidence of Kyler being able to do this in previous seasons.

It’s the accuracy.

And our receivers are god awful. There’s countless metrics out there showing our receivers are among the worst in the league at separation.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Yesterday Hollywood barely played, so Wilson was picking up CB1 coverage most of the game. So that didn't help.

Do we have the best WR's in the league? Nope. Do we have WR's that are better than what Kyler is giving them? Yes we do.

Both Hollywood and Wilson had over 90 yards each with Josh Dobbs in the first Niners game.

Kyler can't throw on time and in rhythm. Nearly every pass I recall yesterday was to a wide open guy that was schemed open. Especially McBride. There were a couple of throws where McBride saved Kylers ass on throws that were off target that were easy throws. The only pass I recall that wasn't wide open was the TD to Higgings and that was still pretty open.

Basically, unless either outside receiver can get wide ass open against the best cornerbacks the opposition have they have no chance. Kyler isn't going to find you on a back shoulder throw or an out route that requires timing, or the other 90% of passes that WR's rely on that require timing and accurate ball placement.

Being successful at WR isn't about beating your man by 3 yards so Kyler can find you wide open. It's running routes that require your QB to deliver the ball on time and in the right place because the offense has the advantage in knowing where the ball is going. And Kyler simply isn't, or can't or doesn't trust himself to do that.

Maybe it's a result of lack of practice and not having an offseason to build trust, but he's played with Hollywood for years and there has been little evidence of Kyler being able to do this in previous seasons.

Anyone who thinks our receivers are playing at an acceptable level has Kyler Derangement Syndrome.

Kyler's splits with/without Hopkins do not paint a pretty picture.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That's why I said someone like him

Someone who can teach him

Doesn't Carson Palmers brother have a school or something like that?

We need to stop with this. He’s in his fifth year in the NFL not in high school. If it’s going to happen it all starts with Kyler not QB academy.

 

[DVontel]

Anyone who thinks our receivers are playing at an acceptable level has Kyler Derangement Syndrome.

Kyler's splits with/without Hopkins do not paint a pretty picture.

That’s just Brit

 

[football karma]

beating the dead horse that is Steve Keim's drafts is easy, but-- his last five years worth of capital used at WR:

2018: 2nd (Kirk)
2019: 2nd, 4th (Isabella, Butler)
2020: 2nd (Hop trade)
2021: 2nd (Rondale)
2022: 1st (Hollywood trade)

 

[Brian in Mesa]

No, because if you convert then a FG can be one of the scores you still need. Kick and you still need 2 TDs.

You could just tell we were going to come away with zero relying on K1 in the red zone vs Prater anywhere on the field.

 

[ajcardfan]

You could just tell we were going to come away with zero relying on K1 in the red zone vs Prater anywhere on the field.

Okay, but it is still 2 TDs v TD and FG to tie. I have not been happy with many of his 4th down and extra point decisions this year. But that one was a no brainier. Every single NFL coach would have done it.

 

[Chopper0080]

Anyone who thinks our receivers are playing at an acceptable level has Kyler Derangement Syndrome.

Kyler's splits with/without Hopkins do not paint a pretty picture.

KYler has had zero chemistry with every WR not named Hopkins in his entire career. Some of that blame falls on Kyler (though of course not all of it)

 

[Crimson Warrior]

4 catches on 4 targets for Elijah Higgins vs SF. 44 yards and a TD.

Hmmm...

 

[kerouac9]

KYler has had zero chemistry with every WR not named Hopkins in his entire career. Some of that blame falls on Kyler (though of course not all of it)

He was pretty good with Hollywood before injury last year.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

KYler has had zero chemistry with every WR not named Hopkins in his entire career. Some of that blame falls on Kyler (though of course not all of it)

I would argue he had good chemistry with Christian Kirk as well.

 

[Dback Jon]

I would argue he had good chemistry with Christian Kirk as well.

So was it a mistake not to re-sign Kirk?

 

[Chopper0080]

Hmmmm. Maybe I am in my feelings right now and not remembering his connections with Brown and Kirk. Fair points.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Hmmmm. Maybe I am in my feelings right now and not remembering his connections with Brown and Kirk. Fair points.

That’s the really disturbing part of Kyler right now. If Dobbs could find those guys in the first half of the season, what does it say about Kyler who’s making them seem like complete and utter ghosts?

 

[daves]

What does the effort matter if 2/3 of these starters need to be replaced?

So you wouldn't mind at all if the team was showing both lack of talent and lack of effort?