No excuses for Matt Leinart today

[az1965]

BTW, a detailed article on this by Sandos...

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/9578/nfc-west-a-different-story-without-warner

"NFC West a different story without Warner"

...
But when the three-time Super Bowl starter sat out the second half as a precaution Sunday after feeling "fuzzy" from a big hit, the other NFC West teams must have liked what they saw.

This division is the Cardinals' to lose until the minute Warner walks away, probably after next season.

Backup Matt Leinart struggled to hold off the St. Louis Rams 21-13 after Warner handed him a 21-3 lead and an offense that had amassed 316 yards and 17 first downs in less than two quarters.
...
Holding Leinart to Warner's standard isn't realistic or fair, but an occasional touchdown might be nice. Leinart has thrown one touchdown pass in his last 127 attempts dating to a 23-20 victory over Seattle early in the 2007 season.

 

[Shane]

"Leinart has thrown one touchdown pass in his last 127 attempts"

That's pretty damned bad.

 

[Napier]

I really want Leinart to succed with this team; I was so happy when we drafted him, I thought our QB situation was going to be fixed for the next 10 years - but I am honestly concerned with his progress.

I wouldn't expect him to come on and start lighting up the field, but it scares me that we were forced to punt and could barely convert 3rd downs. Surely at this stage of his career he needs to be doing better than this?

Please, please let Kurt stay healthy this season, I don't know if we can have a play off run without him.

 

[Perfectionist]

Pariah I usually agree with everything you say. But after 4 years, three years in the same offense, and aginst the 1-7 Rams, don't you expect Matt to play better - full week of practice as a starter or not?

I did not like Warners performance against Carolina and if we were judging him on that effort he would never step a foot on the field again. But he came back and has had three solid games in a row.

Matt might have three years in this offense but how much game time has he had. I have seen Warner have terrible, I mean terrible first halves only to come out on fire in the second half. Who knows what Matt would have done if he had another half to play.

I am not really a Leinart fan, but I have seen him change since he arrived in Arizona and will give him a fair shake when he finally does get his chance.

(Hopefully, not the rest of this season)

 

[RugbyMuffin]

He didn't look very good at all. No denying that.

 

[cardpa]

I blame the coaching staff for Leinhart's failure as much as Leinhart himself. This was a game that the Cardinals were expected to blow the Rams away and by all accounts the way the game was going it was well on its way to that conclusion.

Now imagine being Leinhart and expecting to get mop up time near the end of the game and possibly getting pulled if you make one mistake. Not the sort of mindset you want your backup QB to have but one that has been cultivated by the coaching staff based on previous games.

Suddenly Warner gets hurt and your backup is in with this mentality. In addition they dummy down the playcalling and it doesn't even play to your natural strengths (rollouts to the right for a lefthanded QB?)

I question whether Matt is the guy down the road but how will you ever know if you don't put him in situations to succeed? I don't think the coaching staff has done that very well. I also don't think Leihart is comfortable in the offense that is being run now. It may be great for Warner but not a good fit for Leinhart.

I would like to see him get a start late in the season once the Cardinals have clinched which should happen in the next few weeks and see what he has to offer then. Give him the majority of snaps and set a gameplan that fits his strengths. I think its unfair to judge him until this happens.

 

[Dan H]

" In addition they dummy down the playcalling and it doesn't even play to your natural strengths (rollouts to the right for a lefthanded QB?)"

Yeah I was at the game and that was insane. He converted at least one of them by switching the ball over to his other hand, but why the heck put him in that position?

From what I could see he actually didn't look that bad. He was under a ton of pressure. There were a couple of plays where he used his feet to evade the pressure and get rid of the ball before getting hit. Honestly the protection didn't look all that great to me - perhaps that's a reflection of our line, because Leinart was hanging onto the ball much, much longer than Kurt does.

One thing that I don't know if has been mentioned, but it seemed to me the reason why his passes were all so short was generally speaking he was running through his progressions and dumping off to the running backs. What's the problem with that? I'd rather him do that than force the issue.

The Rams were actually pretty impressive today. There is no give-up in that team whatsoever, which is a credit to coaching.

 

[crisper57]

I am starting to wane on my support for Leinart, but this wasn't all on him. He completed 11 of 14 pass attempts. He did not turn the ball over. The fumble wasn't his fault and it stopped a promising drive. He did make one of the biggest plays of the game when he connected with Doucet.

The play calling got super conservative and the passes became check-downs and screens...

Oh, and where did our running game go in the second half? Sure didn't help our passing game out much at that point.

I do feel that after the QB change, the Rams pinned their ears back and came after Matt. He was under pressure all day. Completing 11-of14 under that circumstance is respectable.

Still, there was a big drop off between our two QB's. Matt has to do better with the opportunities he is given.

 

[DeAnna]

The play calling got super conservative and the passes became check-downs and screens...

Oh, and where did our running game go in the second half? Sure didn't help our passing game out much at that point.

Heck, as soon as Matt came in I knew the Rams would pin their ears back and go after him. And they started stacking the line, daring Matt to throw.

The play calling was certainly conservative - how many yards did Beanie get in the 2nd half? Very few, IIRC, but they insisted in running him in the teeth of the defense instead of using more creative runs.

He can still be the future, but he will need a really good running game and a defense.

 

[Proteus]

Heck, as soon as Matt came in I knew the Rams would pin their ears back and go after him. And they started stacking the line, daring Matt to throw.

The play calling was certainly conservative - how many yards did Beanie get in the 2nd half? Very few, IIRC, but they insisted in running him in the teeth of the defense instead of using more creative runs.

He can still be the future, but he will need a really good running game and a defense.

Beanie had 39 yards on 8 carries in the 2nd half.

 

[Rats]

It is very simple. The Cards have invested heavily in ML( 10th overall pick, millions of $$). He could be handed a top NFL Offense and a playoff team in short order if KW is hurt or retires. Demand that he prepares for this and if he does not cut your losses. He has looked poorly prepared for someone with his resume and needs to grow up. This is the NFL.....you can't just show up and have success....you will more likely just suck like he has. For me, the Cards should find another vet as back up and cut ML or trade him. He is not worth the bonus next season and will always be fighting to get out of KW shadow, which I do not think he will respond to( preparation wise ).

 

[JeffGollin]

I'm Uncomfortable...


To kill Leinart isn't helpful. He's the only #2 QB we've got.

Obviously, the contrast between Warner's 3 TD first half performance and Matt's zero-point 2H outing is pretty unsettling. But if not Kurt, who? Leinart's the only #2 QB we've got.

His job is to avoid glaring errors, move the team and put at least some points on the board. He clearly didn't do all of that, but it begs the question: "Is the problem permanent and uncorrectable? Or are there things that can be done to get Matt to perform better?"

Instead of ripping Leinart, we should be asking ourselves: "What will it take to get him functioning well enough to help us win football games?"

A few thoughts:

1. Matt and Kurt have different styles - Matt is a lefty. Matt is more mobile. Matt can improvise better. Matt is not as consistently accurate. Matt can't instantly read defenses and pull the trigger the way Kurt can.

2. I'm assuming the objective is for Matt to be able to step in at a moments' notice and execute at a high level. To do this, he may be more suited to execute certain plays while not as good running others. (For example - they had him rolling right. It's hard for a left handed passer to make accurate throws rolling to his right).

3. While it might be "good for consistency sake" to make Kurt and Matt interchangeable when it comes to designing, executing and dialing up offensive plays, it might make sense to install one or more special "packages" of a half-dozen or so plays that would leverage Matt's streingths.

4. During the week, it might also make sense for the Cards to have Leinart and a #5 receiver (I'm thinking Sean Morey) work together on timing to give Matt a security blanket out there when they throw him to the wolves.

I'm sure there will be a few hoots and hollers about "why should we have to do special stuff to coddle Prince Charming?" But the objective should be to have a backup QB who can come right in and play effectively. And if doing special stuff playing to Leinart's strengths can help us in football games, then we should do it.

 

[moklerman]

Matt can't instantly read defenses and pull the trigger the way Kurt can.

This is true. It's not really an indictment against Leinart for him not to read defenses at a HOF level though. But it does bring up what I think is Leinart's problem right now. He just doesn't have enough experience to "know" where he's going with the ball and that's compounding everything else.

On the quick-hitter stuff he's basically fine. When he has to drop back and read the defense is where he's holding onto the ball and having accuracy problems. Even when he decides where he's going with the ball it's not in time and I think that's leading to him overthrowing the ball on some of the intermediate routes.

He's that split second late in making the read because of his inexperience and he's gunning it to try and make up for the timing issue which is causing him to throw too hard and too high.

I'm very confident that once he gets a chance to work with the offense for a while and "know" what he's doing rather than reacting, a lot of the the clunkiness will go away.

 

[john h]

Way too much criticism on Leinart. He made some good plays, didn't turn the ball over and didn't force any passes. And the Cardinals won.

What exactly is being expected of Leinart? He managed the game and held onto the win in a relief role. B+.

If you cannot score one point in a half no matter what else he does then he gets a "D" from me. There were moments I thought the game was in danger of being lost. Had a couple of those fades in the end zone by the Rams been caught then we would have been in deep trouble. A QB must score points. I do not think he managed the game as I think all the calls came from the coach. In the end it appears that Matt will be our QB when Kurt retires. I suspect we will win no division championship with Matt at the helm from what I have seen when he played. I hope I am wrong as I thought drafting him was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I desperately want him to succeed but i have great reason to be concerned. Anyone who replaces Kurt is going to look bad to us. We are looking at a Hall of Fame QB day in and day out and have come to expect winning. We have forgot the Cardinals of several years ago when we changed QB's on a yearly basis.

 

[conraddobler]

Oh pulease.

People are WAY WAY WAY over the top on this.

I'll be the first to say I want the QBOTF to be a stud and it's completely possible that WILL NOT BE Matt and that's fine with me.

What he's doing is just pressing, he's scared to lose, not because of himself but because of the team and the fact he came in when he was up and all he can do is blow it.

He didn't blow the game, he was boring, did what they asked, that's it.

Yeah Warner looked great in comparison because he is great in comparison but there aren't anymore Kurts out there so people need to chill and just let things follow their own course.

I'm sure this coaching staff will dump Matt if he needs dumping, just relax folks.

 

[Shane]

What he's doing is just pressing, he's scared to lose, not because of himself but because of the team and the fact he came in when he was up and all he can do is blow it.

I call BS. There should be no more of a comfy situation for a back up to succeed than what Leinart has been presented with all three appearances this season. You come into a game with a 3 TD lead and in full command. No need to press at all and mentally if you are pressing there is a problem.

That is a much easier situation and should be a recipe for success much more so than coming in a game where it is tied or close and you have to worry about being THE MAN to lead this team to victory. In his three appearances victory was almost all but assured. He stunk end of story. There really is no excuse for it.

 

[conraddobler]

I call BS. There should be no more of a comfy situation for a back up to succeed than what Leinart has been presented with all three appearances this season. You come into a game with a 3 TD lead and in full command. No need to press at all and mentally if you are pressing there is a problem.

That is a much easier situation and should be a recipe for success much more so than coming in a game where it is tied or close and you have to worry about being THE MAN to lead this team to victory. In his three appearances victory was almost all but assured. He stunk end of story. There really is no excuse for it.

Whatever.

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

'cept he's NOT starting, and draft position means nothing now.

otherwise, great points.

No.. It means we have a lot of $$ tied up in a incompetent backup QB.

 

[Pariah]

No.. It means we have a lot of $$ tied up in a incompetent backup QB.

This is getting circular.

We don't know if he's incompetent or not, IMO.

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

This is getting circular.

We don't know if he's incompetent or not, IMO.

wait.. you were serious?

sorry.

 

[WildBB]

Instead of ripping Leinart, we should be asking ourselves: "What will it take to get him functioning well enough to help us win football games?"

A few thoughts:

1. Matt and Kurt have different styles - Matt is a lefty. Matt is more mobile. Matt can improvise better. Matt is not as consistently accurate. Matt can't instantly read defenses and pull the trigger the way Kurt can.

That's the bottom line. Can he be a game manager and win games. I believe he can. He needs a chance to start a whole game and develop his rhythm. And then do it again. There is NO SUBSTITUTE for actual game experience, and that is what he's lacking. One half doesn't tell anything really.

Even Warner is famous for throwing up stinkers and he's plays every week.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Is Lienart our QOTF? At this point, yes. He is the only option we have at this time.

Has he proven that he can replace Warner? Not yet.

So what do we take from the Rams game.

1. Lienart isn't pretty coming off the Bench at a moments notice. He appears nervous, has poor footwork and tends to overthrow his passes when he isn't prepared.

2. Lienart calmed down after a few series. He made enough plays to preserve the win.

3. Lieanart wasn't asked to win the game. All we needed from him was not to lose the game. There was no need for him to chuck the ball around coming cold off the bench. The goal was to drain time off the clock. A pick 6 would have been disastrous. I don't question the play calling at all.

 

[JeffGollin]

Is Lienart our QOTF?...

If Kurt is unable to go, he's our QOTP! We need to give him all the help we can.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

rewatched the 2nd half and Leinart had 2 bad throws. He overthrew his first pass,which is reasonable considering it was his 1st throw, and he had a miscue with Fitz on another. Actually that looked like the same play he missed with Fitz in Chicago. People are acting like Warner heaves it downfield quite abit. I remember a ton of comments on here about Warner checking down and not pressing the issue deep. Also, early in the year, Warner said himself, that he's a timing QB and that the timing was off with the WR's but that it would come around and it has. Yet people expect Leinart to step right in and not miss a beat. Someone was claiming his play to Doucet was lucky. He made a nice play to avoid the rush and put the ball right on target at probably the most crucial moment of the game for the Cards. I don't know if ML will be great,or even good, but there's nothing on the nothing on the tape to convince me he didn't do exactly what was asked of him yetserday. Heck, if Becht doesn't fumble and they give Beanie the ball on 3rd and 1, the Cards possibly get 14 points and everyone is singing his praises. Obviously, that didn't hapen so it was all his fault.

 

[DutchmanAZ]

IMHO - Leinart did exactly what he was asked to do, and did a decent job. I'll save the gallows for him until after he gets at least 4 consecutive games under his belt as a starter.