Oh What a Night

[Harry]

I continue to be flummoxed by people who think it was impossible for Monti to walk and chew gum at the same.

Expectations for this franchise are so horrifically low.

Why waste a year of eligibility

 

[Cheesebeef]

Why waste a year of eligibility

Not sure what you mean or if this is supposed to be humorous, Harry?

 

[kerouac9]

Except it’s such overrated ass talking point from talking heads & has convinced fans that’s the way to go when in reality it has only benefited teams that already have good overall talent & makes it more welcoming for that rookie/young QB & are able to add good depth players.

I agree to this extent: the rookie contract matters if you've already transitioned off your veteran starter. Either you were playing with an Andy Dalton-type whose contract expired or you took your medicine the season before by dumping your veteran starter and going with someone new. That usually means you have something in place to grow around.

Either by cutting or trading him, the Cards will be in an impossible position if they move on from Kyler Murray this offseason. They'll have to field a roster as talent-poor as the one we currently have, with some rookies providing unpredictable results.

Then Gannon and Monti go into 2025 with a record that's like 7-37 and maybe one or more coordinators fired. Then the desperation moves begin.

A lot of people will go into 2025 feeling like this team is successful and building something if they finish 6-11 next year.

 

[Harry]

Harry, Looking forward to it! Here’s my biggest fear.
Kyler has been playing his style football for 20 years against inferior opponents. Asking him to “ learn” a new style seems like a waste of time. His habits, physical stature and strengths doesn’t fit the NFL prototype offense. His physical abilities and style rarely succeed in the NFL. Unless of course you have a top 3 defense and top 3 running game. If you have that, many qbs can succeed.
How long do we stick with the Kyler experiment? How long do we wait to get an insurance policy in place.

At this point, and I’ll catch some heat for this, I would take Fields over Murray for the exact reasons you pointed out.

Have to admit it flashed through my mind. However, Fields’ ceiling is lower. He’s had more chances to excel and his arm is medium. I’d rather go all in, but if there isn’t significant improvement by 8 2024 games a change is merited.

 

[Harry]

Not sure what you mean or if this is supposed to be humorous, Harry?

No that’s why Monti didn’t sign anyone.

 

[Chopper0080]

Are you guys ready to have discussions on why Drake Maye “can’t get it done” or “why he isn’t good enough to get us over the hump” against teams with much more blue-chip talent than us by 2027?

If Monti can't make it work with Drake Maye, I don't know how he would make it work with this Kyler Murray.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I never thought I would ever say this but Fields was clearly the better QB yesterday.

He looked poised and in control.

Now wait a minute... "Fields was clearly the better QB"?

Fields was 15/27 (56%), 170 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT. With a pure passer rating of 71.5

And he had all ******* day to throw ball on about 12 of those drop backs. I mean there wasn't a Cardinal pass rusher within 15 yards of him.

And he still threw a horrific Q4 interception that kept the Cardinals in the game!

Murray was 24/38 (63%, still not good enough but trending better) 230 yards, 2 TDs, no INTs with a pure passer rating of 97.5, with above-average pass rush pressure.

It what universe was Justin Fields "clearly the better QB"?

Clearly the better QB?

How many points did CHI get for Fields' poise and control? Or for his footwork or pocket presence?

Wow. Come on man. You're better than that.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Now wait a minute... "Fields was clearly the better QB"?

Fields was 15/27 (56%), 170 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT. With a pure passer rating of 71.5

And he had all ******* day to throw ball on about 12 of those drop backs. I mean there wasn't a Cardinal pass rusher within 15 yards of him.

And he still threw a horrific Q4 interception that kept the Cardinals in the game!

Murray was 24/38 (63%, still not good enough but trending better) 230 yards, 2 TDs, no INTs with a pure passer rating of 97.5, with above-average pass rush pressure.

It what universe was Justin Fields "clearly the better QB"?

Clearly the better QB?

How many points did CHI get for Fields' poise and control? Or for his footwork or pocket presence?

Wow. Come on man. You're better than that.

Let’s just ignore the 97 rushing yards and a TD that Fields had, leading a dominant win where Kyler was able to put up pretty looking stats, sitting on 10 points the entire game before a cheese TD at the end of the fourth.

I guess rushing stats for the QB are only important when Kyler gets them…

 

[DVontel]

If Monti can't make it work with Drake Maye, I don't know how he would make it work with this Kyler Murray.

My main point is not Drake Maye, it’s not even Kyler Murray.

My main point is wanting to build the team first. Wanting to build the farm before I build the house.

I’ve had the same mindset as you of “get the QB first, worry about the rest later”, but I’m starting to see & acknowledge that’s becoming a lie with my view across the league.

With that rookie QB contract talking point, you use it to add a good bit of depth to your already talent established team, you don’t use it buy your team through FA.

We did with that with one QB. I really don’t want to do it with another QB.

I also seen people say we should have stuck with Rosen & draft Bosa, which probably would have landed us one of the 2020 QBs. Those same people want us to do the same thing with Kyler/MHJ/Maye aka tempt fate once again. I just don’t understand.

If it means watching Kyler another year of playing bleh, then so it. But I would feel better for the next QB after him having MHJ as one of his running mates out there.

 

[TheCardFan]

Wait a minute... "Fields was clearly the better QB"?

I know, it sounds crazy!

It's not a stat that I can point to but rather just my opinion in watching them.

I felt like Fields was about to make plays/making plays while Kyler was trying not to lose.

Pocket presence, decision making, playmaking, etc.

Fields threw the INT a tad late or that game is a blowout start to finish (21-0 and then 31-10).

What is this from a top 6 paid NFL QB?

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Crimson Warrior]

If Monti can't make it work with Drake Maye, I don't know how he would make it work with this Kyler Murray.

Drake "10th place heisman trophy finish" Maye? j/k Chopper.

 

[Arz101]

Excellent post.

This should be a very interesting and extremely important offseason. The Cardinals have pretty much a blank slate to build this team in Monti’s image (minus being stuck with Kyler for another year). I’m excited to see the Cardinals finally start truly rebuilding after this season was a massive tear down of Keim’s total mess.

What blank slate what was 2023 for?

 

[Arz101]

Are you guys ready to have discussions on why Drake Maye “can’t get it done” or “why he isn’t good enough to get us over the hump” against teams with much more blue-chip talent than us by 2027?

It is not a certainty that long rebuilds work either.

It is about developing culture from ground up. My hopes are low with this ownership if it will ever happen.

So give me 8 to 11 win seasons every year over these long rebuilds.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I know, it sounds crazy!

It's not a stat that I can point to but rather just my opinion in watching them.

I felt like Fields was about to make plays/making plays while Kyler was trying not to lose.

Pocket presence, decision making, playmaking, etc.

Fields threw the INT a tad late or that game is a blowout start to finish (21-0 and then 31-10).

What is this from a top 6 paid NFL QB?

You must be registered for see images attach

I mean that's understandable, and not necessarily crazy, but you have to factor in the pass rush, maybe the talent in the opposing secondary and things like that too.

The chart above is not great (especially the side line throws!) but my rebuttal is that the Cardinals have to get some WRs that can make a play on the ball.

Hypothetically, if all those sideline throws yesterday were to MJH, are they all still incompletions?

 

[Stout]

Now wait a minute... "Fields was clearly the better QB"?

Fields was 15/27 (56%), 170 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT. With a pure passer rating of 71.5

And he had all ******* day to throw ball on about 12 of those drop backs. I mean there wasn't a Cardinal pass rusher within 15 yards of him.

And he still threw a horrific Q4 interception that kept the Cardinals in the game!

Murray was 24/38 (63%, still not good enough but trending better) 230 yards, 2 TDs, no INTs with a pure passer rating of 97.5, with above-average pass rush pressure.

It what universe was Justin Fields "clearly the better QB"?

Clearly the better QB?

How many points did CHI get for Fields' poise and control? Or for his footwork or pocket presence?

Wow. Come on man. You're better than that.

See Cheese below. This is viewing the game through Kyler colored glasses.

 

[kerouac9]

I know, it sounds crazy!

It's not a stat that I can point to but rather just my opinion in watching them.

I felt like Fields was about to make plays/making plays while Kyler was trying not to lose.

Pocket presence, decision making, playmaking, etc.

Fields threw the INT a tad late or that game is a blowout start to finish (21-0 and then 31-10).

What is this from a top 6 paid NFL QB?

You must be registered for see images attach

Get that bag Kyler. But oh, my.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

See Cheese below. This is viewing the game through Kyler colored glasses.

cheesebeef is on ignore, but it's cool. Agree to disagree.

 

[TheCardFan]

Hypothetically, if all those sideline throws yesterday were to MJH, are they all still incompletions?

I don't remember them all but the last two on the drive we could have tied the game (IIRC)...

Threw it to Wilson out of bounds and then I think he threw it past the WR (who wanted a PI) on 4th down.

I would be ecstatic if Kyler from the first half of 2021 was getting MHJ.

 

[TheCardFan]

cheesebeef is on ignore, but it's cool. Agree to disagree.

I am not the only person on ignore these days?

 

[Chopper0080]

My main point is not Drake Maye, it’s not even Kyler Murray.

My main point is wanting to build the team first. Wanting to build the farm before I build the house.

I’ve had the same mindset as you of “get the QB first, worry about the rest later”, but I’m starting to see & acknowledge that’s becoming a lie with my view across the league.

With that rookie QB contract talking point, you use it to add a good bit of depth to your already talent established team, you don’t use it buy your team through FA.

We did with that with one QB. I really don’t want to do it with another QB.

I also seen people say we should have stuck with Rosen & draft Bosa, which probably would have landed us one of the 2020 QBs. Those same people want us to do the same thing with Kyler/MHJ/Maye aka tempt fate once again. I just don’t understand.

If it means watching Kyler another year of playing bleh, then so it. But I would feel better for the next QB after him having MHJ as one of his running mates out there.

Honest question, does using the #2 pick on Maye vs MHJ really change this calculus that much?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I don't remember them all but the last two on the drive we could have tied the game (IIRC)...

Threw it to Wilson well out of bounds and then I think he threw it way past the WR (who wanted a PI) on 4th down.

I would be ecstatic if Kyler from the first half of 2021 was getting MHJ.

100% understand what you're saying. And just between you and me, I'm trying to put on a brave face.

But I also honestly believe that if for 2024 we seriously upgrade the WR room, and Petzing unleashes the QB run game ( I think we're holding back now) I think we can be a top 8 NFL offense. Now maybe I sound like the crazy one? haha.

 

[DVontel]

Honest question, does using the #2 pick on Maye vs MHJ really change this calculus that much?

5+ years ago me? No.

Current day me? Yes.

 

[Harry]

Couldn’t disagree more on the idea of taking Maye.

 

[PACardsFan]

I never thought I would ever say this but Fields was clearly the better QB yesterday.

He looked poised and in control.

This is silly. Did you hear what Fields told his OL before the game? He told them not to hold, because if they got through, the Cardinals DL was slow as $hit. Anyone could look poised and in control when you have 10 seconds to survey the field. Does that apply to the Chicago DL that was coming at Kyler? Hell no. Sweat is as good as any DLineman in the NFL, and the Bears have the #1 run D in football. The point being that Murray was facing a significantly better defense than what Fields was facing. Murray‘s Qb Rating was 98, Fields QB rating was 72.

 

[PACardsFan]

I mean that's understandable, and not necessarily crazy, but you have to factor in the pass rush, maybe the talent in the opposing secondary and things like that too.

The chart above is not great (especially the side line throws!) but my rebuttal is that the Cardinals have to get some WRs that can make a play on the ball.

Hypothetically, if all those sideline throws yesterday were to MJH, are they all still incompletions?

Better bet that NONE of those sideline passes would have been incompletions with MHJ. If only half of those passes were caught, we would have extended 3-4 drives. That could result in 14-21 more points. That’s why it’s truly devastating for any offense to not have a SINGLE legit WR on the field.