Pacers @ Suns 1-19-16

[Hoop Head]

I think it might be expecting too much but I see no reason why Booker won't be as good as Klay Thompson in 2-3 years. I think he's already had a better rookie campaign than him. I'm not sure if he'll be playing alongside Bledsoe or Knight then but once he gets a little more aggressive I don't think it will matter much who is playing in the backcourt with him.

 

[Shaggy]

I feel that Hornacek maybe a good coach, but just is a push over and the players know it. He plays the players that get in his ear more then the others. It reminds me of a coach I had. He would play the players that were more outspoken(the ***** ones) or the parents were yapping at them for more playing time for their kids. We sucked that year because the better players didn't play as much as the outspoken ones. This seems just like it.

 

[Mainstreet]

I feel that Hornacek maybe a good coach, but just is a push over and the players know it. He plays the players that get in his ear more then the others. It reminds me of a coach I had. He would play the players that were more outspoken(the ***** ones) or the parents were yapping at them for more playing time for their kids. We sucked that year because the better players didn't play as much as the outspoken ones. This seems just like it.

I do think Hornacek has control issues with the players. The Suns need a leader on the roster. I think Devin Booker will be that leader with time. Also Bledsoe may be that leader as well. I was hoping Tyson Chandler would take more of a leadership role.

 

[Phrazbit]

Hornacek lost his command over the players last year when he flip flopped on his "If you get T'd then you're benched" rule within a week of creating it. He did it specifically to curb the Morris twins idiocy but Goran was the first guy to get T'd up afterwards, we lost that night and the rule soon went out the window. It was a foolish rule to make in the first place, the T problems were specific to two idiots, not the entire roster, then even more foolish to rapidly abandon when its clear he was playing favorites.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So how are you'all liking this team?

Bledsoe's great isn't he?

Oops. Sorry! He's can't play. Will he ever play a full season?

Missed out on Pau, huh? I thought he was done. All NBA after all the know it all's said he was done. (And that's basically everyone).

I could go on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on, and, on but why?

Phraz (the lover of discourse, ha!), Cheese, Chaz. What a joke.

You all deserve this team!

Suns fans deserve what they have.

Sarver is smarter than his fans! Hard to believe cause he's a fool!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Know nothings that know-it-all.

HAhahahahahhahhhah! (BCS excepted, he's pretty smart, but likes big guy too much).

I can't imagine what life is really like as a troll.

 

[devilalum]

I can't imagine what life is really like as a troll.

A little lonlier than it used to be.

sent from a fone

 

[leclerc]

We need a new point guard

I've given up on Knight. He should not be in our future. Start Bledsoe/x with Booker and start shopping Knight.

 

[leclerc]

Goodwin and Warren hardly saw the floor in the first half. Good that they got yanked showing very little enthusiasm and aggression. Booker is my man.

 

[95pro]

Goodwin and Warren hardly saw the floor in the first half. Good that they got yanked showing very little enthusiasm and aggression. Booker is my man.

Well they have been getting limited minutes even though they have been outplaying fellow teammates who share the same position. Hard to be go all out only knowing that you'll get yanked later again.

 

[leclerc]

I agree that it's not easy when they have great games and get limited playing time the next few games. It really bugs me. However when you're in there you have to play hard. No excuses.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I've given up on Knight. He should not be in our future. Start Bledsoe/x with Booker and start shopping Knight.

I think it's still too early to give up on him. I do think some hard lessons are in order though. Long twos should earn him time on the bench. Ignoring teammates should earn him time on the bench. Make him look at the game video and see his selfishness.

 

[elindholm]

Long twos should earn him time on the bench.

The thing is, I'm starting to think that he takes those shots because they are the only ones he can get reliably. Maybe he could come off of screens and be more of a catch-and-shoot guy, but he seems to do better with the ball in his hands. The defense is usually smart enough to be on him outside the arc, he's not adept at getting to the basket without mishandling, and he doesn't have an in-between game. So, once he's made up his mind that he's going to be the one taking the shot, he's probably figured out that the long two is what the defense will be most willing to give him.

Of course, he still takes contested ones too, but I suspect that his thinking is somewhere along those lines. If he thinks at all.

If we're feeling generous, we could call this the Paul Pierce phenomenon. Pierce has never been a great shooter, but he gets more effective in the playoffs, or at least did during the bulk of his career. I think that's because he's a pretty good long-two shooter, relatively speaking. You don't want long twos is you can get a better shot, but if the defense is taking away everything else, a decent long two might be the best option. Pierce was a better long-two shooter than most, and so his value went up in step with the other team's defensive intensity.

 

[leclerc]

On my last post about lack of effort and playing time - it should work both ways, but with this team it doesn't. Goodwin had a good 2nd half with a lot of effort, even hitting 4 FTs on a row (!) and even got to finish the game but that's no guarantee to get renewed trust in the next game. That's one of the reasons I would like a coaching change.

 

[Phrazbit]

Knight was playing better early in the year... that's my only hope for him. Early on when the team was less selfish he was actually playing pretty damn good. As we started to struggle and especially when Bledsoe was gone his rate of lazy, long 3s and 2s went through the roof. You can tell it drives his teammates nuts, as Knight strolls across half court, doesn't bother to call for a screen or even put a move on his man, just chucks up a contested shot from 20-25 feet with a man in his face and 18 seconds left on the clock.

 

[Catlover]

Knight was playing better early in the year... that's my only hope for him. Early on when the team was less selfish he was actually playing pretty damn good. As we started to struggle and especially when Bledsoe was gone his rate of lazy, long 3s and 2s went through the roof. You can tell it drives his teammates nuts, as Knight strolls across half court, doesn't bother to call for a screen or even put a move on his man, just chucks up a contested shot from 20-25 feet with a man in his face and 18 seconds left on the clock.

I know it's unlikely but I'm hoping that it's his ankle more than anything. He started off the season struggling and it wasn't until he was confident enough in his ankle to take the ball strong to the basket that his outside game picked up. From that point on he played pretty well until that game when Bledsoe hurt his knee and Knight tweaked his ankle again. Neither player was as good from then on but Brandon especially struggled.

It's most likely just coincidence but it's hard to watch Knight and see the same player that played so well in Milwaukee last season. He may have been disappointing at times as a point guard but he was a dominant player on most nights judging by the box scores.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The thing is, I'm starting to think that he takes those shots because they are the only ones he can get reliably. Maybe he could come off of screens and be more of a catch-and-shoot guy, but he seems to do better with the ball in his hands. The defense is usually smart enough to be on him outside the arc, he's not adept at getting to the basket without mishandling, and he doesn't have an in-between game. So, once he's made up his mind that he's going to be the one taking the shot, he's probably figured out that the long two is what the defense will be most willing to give him.

Of course, he still takes contested ones too, but I suspect that his thinking is somewhere along those lines. If he thinks at all.

If we're feeling generous, we could call this the Paul Pierce phenomenon. Pierce has never been a great shooter, but he gets more effective in the playoffs, or at least did during the bulk of his career. I think that's because he's a pretty good long-two shooter, relatively speaking. You don't want long twos is you can get a better shot, but if the defense is taking away everything else, a decent long two might be the best option. Pierce was a better long-two shooter than most, and so his value went up in step with the other team's defensive intensity.

Long twos are ok if nothing else is available, contested long twos are not.

 

[JCSunsfan]

On my last post about lack of effort and playing time - it should work both ways, but with this team it doesn't. Goodwin had a good 2nd half with a lot of effort, even hitting 4 FTs on a row (!) and even got to finish the game but that's no guarantee to get renewed trust in the next game. That's one of the reasons I would like a coaching change.

I am sure there is more to it than just game play. Effort and effectiveness in practice plays into it too. There is more going on than fans can see.

 

[sunsfan88]

Knight is just not that good of a player and may never be. Even when he was with the Bucks, their fans wanted him gone despite the fancy stats he put up because he was a huge ball hog there and numbers proved that the Bucks were actually a better team with Knight on their bench than in the game.

We're having the same complaints about Knight that Bucks and Pistons have had dating back 3-4 years ala contested jumpers, ball hogging, long twos etc.

He's been in the league 4 years now and if he hasn't figured a way to change it by now then not when he ever will.

 

[BC867]

We're having the same complaints about Knight that Bucks and Pistons have had dating back 3-4 years ala contested jumpers, ball hogging, long twos etc.

He's been in the league 4 years now and if he hasn't figured a way to change it by now then not when he ever will.

Not figured a way to change it or not want to change it. I think the latter is what Knight has settled into.

As strong as skills are, mindset is even stronger.

 

[sunsfan88]

Not figured a way to change it or not want to change it. I think the latter is what Knight has settled into.

As strong as skills are, mindset is even stronger.

When it comes to Knight, Gambo said it best

https://twitter.com/Gambo987/status/680973188759617536

 

[95pro]

Knight would make a good 6th man, bring him in to score/shoot. if he's hot he's hot. if not sit him.

 

[BC867]

Knight would make a good 6th man, bring him in to score/shoot. if he's hot he's hot. if not sit him.

Here we would go again, benching a light Guard after we bring him here to be a starter.

On a different team, fine. But remaining on the Suns . . .

(A) Knight would rebel as much as those before him in the same situation.

(B) Another disgruntled player on the roster.

Ignorance is indeed doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Psychologically, demoting a player on a team is a lot more damaging than moving him to a team where he begins again.

 

[95pro]

Here we would go again, benching a light Guard after we bring him here to be a starter.

On a different team, fine. But remaining on the Suns . . .

(A) Knight would rebel as much as those before him in the same situation.

(B) Another disgruntled player on the roster.

Ignorance is indeed doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Psychologically, demoting a player on a team is a lot more damaging than moving him to a team where he begins again.

im not saying that's what we should should do, but more or less thats what Knight should be relegated to.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Here we would go again, benching a light Guard after we bring him here to be a starter.

On a different team, fine. But remaining on the Suns . . .

(A) Knight would rebel as much as those before him in the same situation.

(B) Another disgruntled player on the roster.

Ignorance is indeed doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Psychologically, demoting a player on a team is a lot more damaging than moving him to a team where he begins again.

Yeah. Players like Manu, Havilecek, Vinnie Johnson, all had that role. It is so demeaning.



Getting torqued about that is very weak-minded. You cannot run a decent basketball team if you are constantly petrified about hurting a player's feelings. Players should get the role their play earns, period. They have to learn to deal with that. He had his shot at starting. Greg Popovich doesn't fret over player feelings.

Its funny, you want a tough minded coach who coaches in fear of player feelings. Can't have it both ways.

 

[FutureSuperstar]

The last game was great, but also sad at the same time because Hornacek waits until mid-season to do:

1. Play Archie consistently - These last couple games Goodwin really hasn't done anything too surprising. He should have been playing 15-20 min. a game all season ... Price should have never been playing.

2. TC/Len playing together ... Like, what? How is the 1st time they're trying this 40 games into the season? Ridiculous. It's a way for both guys - Who aren't getting the minutes/game they want for the season (They're not complaining, but their mpg on the season are too low) - to play 25-30 min. game ... All it takes is for the to play together for 5-10 min. a game. I said it a while ago, it's a good option - Defensively, it'll help the rim-protection, communication, etc. - Sure it might be a little weakness to have them run around the court, but not like Leur/Markieff/Teletovic can run around the court much better ... You could argue Len can defend the perimeter better than those guys (or at least Teletovic) ... The rebounding, + length around the basket more than makes up for that on defense

Then offensively, I think it works too. This "clog the lane" BS I don't agree with ... If 1 sets a pick for Bledsoe to drive, suddenly the other one is around the basket and this is a PLUS, not a MINUS ... If TC/Len helps on the drive, Bledsoe has an easy pass off or alley oop pass to make. Since TC/Len are bigger than the other PF's, their man might stick to them more, freeing up the drive for the ballhandler ... Wouldn't you rather have a center in the paint (ready to catch the ball if their man rotates to Bledsoe) as opposed to Markieff/Leur/Teletovic ?

The rest of the season should be simple - Knight/Goodwin/Booker get all the minutes at the guards spots ... Tucker/Warren take the 3' (I wouldn't mind Weems getting some run too) ... Then the 96 min. at the 4/5 could be split like this:

Len - 28
TC - 28
Teletovic/Leur - 40

It's simple, but knowing the coaching staff they'll probably screw the minutes up.