PFF debate on Murray to AZ

[speedy]

There is no objective measurement for that. He turns 29 later this year. Not exactly a spring chicken. There are similar players available at younger ages that don't cost $14m per year.

He’s one of the few players on this team that earns and deserves the contract he is paid. Fitz is 2nd on that list, and mainly because of his steady performance, loyalty, and consistency as an offensive football player. PP is a value/valuable player.

...I’ve been watching the forum for the past couple weeks, about every 1-1.5 hours; you guys thinking it’s a good idea to trade Rosen are on dope. No Effin way

 

[DRM08]

...I’ve been watching the forum for the past couple weeks, about every 1-1.5 hours; you guys thinking it’s a good idea to trade Rosen are on dope. No Effin way

I don't think it's a good idea. Repeatedly have said the smart move is to trade down with the #1 pick. I believe the Murray stuff is a smokescreen to get someone like the Raiders to trade into #1 spot. If the Cardinals can't pull that off, then keep Rosen and take a good pass rusher at #1.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

I stopped it as soon as I heard there is “no debate” Murray gives us a chance at a super bowl. The way some people talk we should be able to get 3 first round and 3 second round picks for our #1. The phone should be ringing off the wall with offers. Just keep this in mind. It’s been mentioned the Patriots are interested in Rosen . That SHOULD tell you something.

I watched rosen make some throws in tight windows last yr, bullet throws with velocity & accuracy, wow throws. I also watched him make some boneheaded throws but for right now I'm gonna place all the BH'ed throws in the "under pressure/gun shy" category. He was probably trying to get rid of it before getting knocked to the ground once again. I remember thinking during his amazing throws "wow, imagine what he could do if he had time to pass"? The Patriots showing interest does tell me something, they know how to scout players. Maybe one day our scouting dept will catch up lol?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Dumping Murray behind the same line with the same receivers will fail just as horribly. The incredible draft capital owned with the #1 pick can restock much of your team.

Fleece the Raiders again, get #4 and #27. Then trade 27 to a team with two late second round picks, like Houston, Philadelphia, or Kansas City. Maybe trade down again from 4 to 10 or so, for another 2nd round pick.
Now you have #10 and four second round picks.

Raiders take Murray, Broncs trade up for Haskins, you get some stud at 10 like an OT, CB, or DL, and clean up in the 2nd.

I say keep that #27 pick & make another good pick at #33. Maybe trade down a few slots with the #33 pick & acquire that teams other 2nd rd pick, not sure who has multiple picks in the 2nd rd though?

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Nonsense.So Murray can run around like a little flea.That still means he will have a harder time seeing the field and
Using the playbook unless you want sandlot football and think that style of play will be a winner.So he scrambles around waiting for those WRs to get open like they did at Okie U.Atkinson

He can definitely buy time with his legs but that's all he has on Rosen right now, other than being familiar with the "air raid". Rosen can see the field better & can make all the same throws in tighter windows. We have too many needs to draft another QB with the #1 pick, especially a 5'8" QB. I don't care what the combine said his height is, I saw him standing next to tua at the heisman ceremony, tua is definitely 6'1" & Murray looked like a midget next to him.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Yet in a clean pocket his passer rating was 80. Below Lamar Jackson.
But was that 80 from premccoy or postmccoy? Not pre or post mattered, leftwich was only allowed to run the offense McCoy installed, this was talked about the first game he called after McCoy was fired. Had leftwich been allowed to use the offense BA taught him.............we will never know? They weren't gonna switch the offense back to the BA days during the 4th game of the season.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

The amount of dropped balls was beyond ridiculous def well above the norm

You're 100% right Shane, how many balls did J.J nelson & Chad Williams drop this yr? What about the big one that sherfield dropped against Seattle that could've possibly gave us the win? Yet rosen never sulked, badmouthed the WR's just sucked it up & walked either back to the huddle or to the sidelines.

 

[TJ]

Yet in a clean pocket his passer rating was 80. Below Lamar Jackson.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Can’t be taken at face value. How often was the pocket clean? How about the skill players Rosen was throwing to compared to anyone else? What about the play calling?

 

[Dr. Jones]

Can't you guys just tell when a player comes in and makes a team better? Sure.... We had some crappy players. Sure.... Our line had a ton of injuries.

Didn't Rosen also not play very well? Can't both be true?

All of these excuses as to why we stick to the status quo drive me crazy.

I don't think Rosen is bad..... I just also don't think he will be a top 5, win many games by himself QB. I do think Murray can be that type of guy.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

 

[cardsunsfan]

You're 100% right Shane, how many balls did J.J nelson & Chad Williams drop this yr? What about the big one that sherfield dropped against Seattle that could've possibly gave us the win? Yet rosen never sulked, badmouthed the WR's just sucked it up & walked either back to the huddle or to the sidelines.

I do feel although he kept fighting, often his accuracy went down after he was a little demoralized after a few drops.. I think when he can chain a few completions together he is much better. We really need a few good receivers this year.. Hoping from a trade down a 1 we could get a really good one at 27... or a great Olineman... A lot of people on here can't agree on even the #1 defensive player.. Some have liked Bosa, Williams or Allen.. if that is so much up for debate we will be assured that if we trade with the Raiders and they take Murray.. I really think that would be a win/win scenario. Maybe we can get N'Keal Harry WR or Jamal Williams OG or Andre Dillard LT..

 

[BW52]

Can't you guys just tell when a player comes in and makes a team better? Sure.... We had some crappy players. Sure.... Our line had a ton of injuries.

Didn't Rosen also not play very well? Can't both be true?

All of these excuses as to why we stick to the status quo drive me crazy.

I don't think Rosen is bad..... I just also don't think he will be a top 5, win many games by himself QB. I do think Murray can be that type of guy.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Can`t you understand why people completely disagree with you and have very serious doubts about Murray having success at the NLl level?Too short,too smart,would need to be a rollout QB to get passing lanes etc;.Now there are question pertaining to his work ethic,chalkboard skills and attitude.He is going to be put under a microscope daily and so far he isn`t doing well.It is part of the process .A lot of people don`t buy into the Murrau hype train.

 

[PACardsFan]

I watched rosen make some throws in tight windows last yr, bullet throws with velocity & accuracy, wow throws. I also watched him make some boneheaded throws but for right now I'm gonna place all the BH'ed throws in the "under pressure/gun shy" category. He was probably trying to get rid of it before getting knocked to the ground once again. I remember thinking during his amazing throws "wow, imagine what he could do if he had time to pass"? The Patriots showing interest does tell me something, they know how to scout players. Maybe one day our scouting dept will catch up lol?

I've gone back & rewatched the entire season. Unfortunately, the number of boneheaded throws far outnumbered the number of wow throws. Can that change some with better coaching & better players around him? Sure it can. My contention though is that Rosen will always be predisposed to boneheaded plays. If everything fell into place nicely, he can get us to the playoffs. Like a Plummer or Palmer, we would NEVER win a SB with Josh Rosen as our QB.

 

[speedy]

Obviously everyone on the Murray wagon sees the next Russell Wilson. I honestly thought Wilson would be a one contract phenomenon until his size caught up with him. Obviously I was wrong in my belief. I do think there’s a big difference between 70 vs 67-68” though, when talking about an under center prospect in this league. I don’t see him setting the world on fire like some think.

 

[PACardsFan]

Can't you guys just tell when a player comes in and makes a team better? Sure.... We had some crappy players. Sure.... Our line had a ton of injuries.

Didn't Rosen also not play very well? Can't both be true?

All of these excuses as to why we stick to the status quo drive me crazy.

I don't think Rosen is bad..... I just also don't think he will be a top 5, win many games by himself QB. I do think Murray can be that type of guy.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

I'm with you with Murray. I think he's special & a difference maker. Rosen will never be a difference make, not ever. Sometimes, to be great, tough decisions have to be made. I hate the thought of losing out on Bosa, but the QB position is too important in the NFL & I see Murray being every bit as good as Mahomes. I can see the videos of him making play after play for some other team & it'll be too much to stomach after being a fan of this team for 56 years. Stop trying to be just GOOD. After hiring an outside the box HC, now have the balls to draft a QB at #1 that can make us GREAT.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Can`t you understand why people completely disagree with you and have very serious doubts about Murray having success at the NLl level?Too short,too smart,would need to be a rollout QB to get passing lanes etc;.Now there are question pertaining to his work ethic,chalkboard skills and attitude.He is going to be put under a microscope daily and so far he isn`t doing well.It is part of the process .A lot of people don`t buy into the Murrau hype train.

I can understand, and empathize. I just find it lazy & myopic.

 

[Minski]

I personally want to stick with Rosen and sort out other positions in the draft, but if K2 does like Murray more we’ve gotta get him, after all K2 is the QB guru

 

[JeffGollin]

They were blasting the Cards big time. It was almost like the Suns dysfunction article part deux.

Bank it:

When the Cardinals lose, there will be a gazillion media-people waiting to pounce on the management, the roster, the unis...you name it.

Lesson: Either win or put up with getting trashd.

 

[iLLmatiC]

Can't you guys just tell when a player comes in and makes a team better? Sure.... We had some crappy players. Sure.... Our line had a ton of injuries.

Didn't Rosen also not play very well? Can't both be true?

All of these excuses as to why we stick to the status quo drive me crazy.

I don't think Rosen is bad..... I just also don't think he will be a top 5, win many games by himself QB. I do think Murray can be that type of guy.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

We aren't drafting Murray.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I agree with the PFF guys, if you think Murray’s going to be great, draft him and either trade Rosen now for picks, if the market is there. If it’s not hold both quarterbacks until the market adjusts (and it will). If you want to play the game like Reid or Belichick when you make a move now and have two quarterbacks as assets to play with on the market , play the long game.

If you have both, and start Rosen, and he lights it up. We still have another year or two to determine trade values, like a Brees and Rivers situation.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Can`t you understand why people completely disagree with you and have very serious doubts about Murray having success at the NLl level?Too short,too smart,would need to be a rollout QB to get passing lanes etc;.Now there are question pertaining to his work ethic,chalkboard skills and attitude.He is going to be put under a microscope daily and so far he isn`t doing well.It is part of the process .A lot of people don`t buy into the Murrau hype train.

The bolded is because of what Caserly said? You know Charley had conflict of interest right BW52? Mad maybe because Kyler didn't use his interview prep service?

Come on man.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I agree with the PFF guys, if you think Murray’s going to be great, draft him and either trade Rosen now for picks, if the market is there. If it’s not hold both quarterbacks until the market adjusts (and it will). If you want to play the game like Reid or Belichick when you make a move now and have two quarterbacks as assets to play with on the market , play the long game.

It's a gamble, but in the end, it's an easy decision b8rtm8nn. Trust your eyes and your football instincts sir.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

It's a gamble, but in the end, it's an easy decision b8rtm8nn. Trust your eyes and your football instincts sir.

I have no football instincts. That is why I would draft Murray and hold both this year and figure out which one is better for us for the long term. I just want to win.

 

[JeffGollin]

Four unknowns are:

Which of the 2 QB's is better right now?

Which of the two has the higher upside?

Which QB is more likely to more quicklly outgrow the standard "dumb rookie" phase?

If we draft Murray, is the projected upgrade in QB play worth more than the addition of a non-QB like Bosa or Q Williams?

 

[slanidrac16]

I've gone back & rewatched the entire season. Unfortunately, the number of boneheaded throws far outnumbered the number of wow throws. Can that change some with better coaching & better players around him? Sure it can. My contention though is that Rosen will always be predisposed to boneheaded plays. If everything fell into place nicely, he can get us to the playoffs. Like a Plummer or Palmer, we would NEVER win a SB with Josh Rosen as our QB.

If Trent filter can win a super bowl why can’t Rosen?

 

[DVontel]

Drafting Kyler with Rosen still on the team is #notsmart.