RJ is a Yankee

[Indrid Cold]

Yes, I'd call him oft injured when he reinjured his shoulder in Spetember after having surgery on it in the spring. Along with the broken leg, he's also missed time with a strained hamstring, ESPN has this in his 2003 scouting report;

2003 Season
In a July game against the Devil Rays, Julio Lugo dropped down a bunt and Troy Glaus charged the ball. Pitcher Aaron Sele tipped it and Glaus slipped as he shifted direction. His right shoulder crashed into the Tropicana Field turf, and after an aborted rehabilitation assignment, he was diagnosed with a partially torn rotator cuff. Glaus never played at 100 percent all year, with wrist, hamstring, back and shoulder injuries preceding the season-ending rotator cuff tear.

The rotator cuff he eventually had surgery on in May 2004.

I don't agree giving a player a 4 year/$45 million deal when he's been injured most of the last 2 seasons. He's played a total of 149 games over those 2 years, and his 2003 stats says he must have played hurt.

I've never read an RJ quote that said he would ONLY go to the Yankees. Care to provide one?

Welcome to reality. I'm sorry it sucks sometimes

I'm firmly held to the reality that this trade does nothing to help the Diamondbacks. I can just see Moorad giving his former client Green a nice extension that would overpay him for the next 4 or 5 years.

Perhaps you were satisfied with the Schilling trade since he would only go to a contender too. How well did Fossum, Lyon, and Goss do this season?

 

[KingofCards]

What does indrid cold mean?

 

[boondockdrunk]

I dont think that this trade is going to go down... sounds to me that either Green will want to stay in LA, or LA takes back the offer because they recently lost Beltre.

However, in response to Indrid's comment out Penny.... he has to pass a physical... and if something is wrong with him I am sure that the trade wont go through.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

If Penny is healthy this is the deal of a lifetime. Our bullpen is going to be sick.

 

[Evil Ash]

I've never read an RJ quote that said he would ONLY go to the Yankees. Care to provide one?

None have quoted RJ but his agents say it over and over and over again. I'm sure you could find the stories in Newsday and the NY Times that show this

I'm firmly held to the reality that this trade does nothing to help the Diamondbacks. I can just see Moorad giving his former client Green a nice extension that would overpay him for the next 4 or 5 years.

Fine thats your opinion but I disagree. RJ is not coming back here, if he stayed here it would be to the end of his contract and then he would leave.

He wants to win another ring and get paid. Although I like the moves we've done I don't think we're that close to winning another WS in the next couple of years.

Perhaps you were satisfied with the Schilling trade since he would only go to a contender too. How well did Fossum, Lyon, and Goss do this season?

Nope I didn't like it. It was a rushed deal so that jerry colangelo could get the player he coveted for 3 years (Richie Sexson) and that completely backfired.

Also the players we are getting are proven at major league level unlike those in the Curt deal.

So what realistic deal (and I emphasize realistic) deal would you do to get equal value and please you?

 

[devilalum]

A least the Dbacks unlike the other teams involved don't have to worry about Randy having hurt feelings if the deal falls through.

He might even be happier about being here if he feels like the Dbacks tried their best to give him what he wanted.

 

[WildBB]

A middle line-up of:

Gonzo
Glaus
Green

is pretty decent... if Gonzo can return to form

They're GGGrrrreat!

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

This deal is far from done. Let's hope these things happen:

1. Penny passing a physical
2. RJ and Green must accept trade
3. Dodgers have Delgado or Beltran signed and sealed
4. RJ extension completed

 

[Evil Ash]

This deal is far from done. Let's hope these things happen:

1. Penny passing a physical
2. RJ and Green must accept trade
3. Dodgers have Delgado or Beltran signed and sealed
4. RJ extension completed

1,2, and 4 I don't think will be any major problems and expect them all to occur. I fear #3 is going to be the key thing to getting this deal done and its also the biggest the biggest hurdle

 

[KingLouieLouie]

http://www.dailynews.com/Stories/0,1413,200~28541~2603293,00.html

Dodgers minor-league pitcher Brandon Weeden, whose name didn't appear in many of those reports, also would go to the Diamondbacks.

http://www.columbuscatfish.com/page/roster/player_detail.php?player=103

http://kffl.com/player/9049/MLB

The Associated Press reports Los Angeles Dodgers P Brandon Weeden, 20, was the New York Yankees top pick in the 2002 amateur draft, taken on the second round with the 71st pick overall. He was 2-0 with a 1.73 ERA in four starts and three relief appearances last season with the rookie Gulf Coast Yankees and 0-2 with a 3.72 ERA in five starts at Class-A Tampa.

Lord, just hope all becomes finalized, because if Weeden is in the fold..it just adds more lusture to the trade w/out a doubt...

 

[Kolo]

Not sure if these year-old BA scouting reports on the Brazoban and Weeden have been posted, but if not--

Brazoban, 23, signed as an outfielder out of the Dominican Republic in 1997 and converted to the mound in July 2002 after stalling with a .242/.290/.337 performance in low Class A. In 1½ seasons as a reliever, he has advanced rapidly, reaching Double-A midway through 2003. Overall, he has gone 2-4, 5.23 with a 69-31 K-BB ratio and .272 opponent average in 65 innings. Armed with an overpowering 97-mph fastball and a plus slider, Brazoban has to overcome his reputation as a lazy worker and improve his command. He doesn't respond well to getting hit, and posted a 7.81 ERA in Double-A Trenton after having a 2.83 ERA at high Class A Tampa in 2003.

Weeden, 20, was New York's top pick (second round) in the 2002 draft. The Yankees had high hopes for him but brought him along slowly. Primarily a shortstop in high school, he showed arm strength to go with a lean, athletic frame. He has the makings of a good delivery, and scouts believe there's projection to his 89-92 mph four-seam fastball. Weeden's breaking ball is a work in progress, and he needs to show more confidence in the pitch. He split 2003 between the Rookie-level Gulf Coast League and short-season Staten Island, going 2-2, 2.58 in 12 games (nine starts). In 45 innings, he had a 38-23 K-BB ratio and .188 opponent average.

 

[Indrid Cold]

I wouldn't believe much out of the NY papers when it comes to rumors. Even the vaunted NY Times has been having credibility problems(see Jayson Blair). All I've heard out of RJ is that he'd be perectly content to stay here in Az where his home is. And I'd rather see a lock Hall of Fame pitcher go to the mound once every 5 days, rather than Shawn Green continue on his downward career slide for the $16 million each make.

I'm not one to throw out imaginary trades. After all, you really need to talk to the other GMs to find out who is even interested. There are other contenders around though besides Boston and the Yankees who could use somebody of Johnson's caliber.

I understand Johnson's no trade clause lessens the value the DBacks can get for him in return since he'll only agree to a deal that sends him to a contender, but I think RJ has made it clear he wouldn't agree to a deal like Schilling did...where the DBacks get virtually nothing in return. I don't know his views on this one, but Shawn Green and Brad Penny aren't the answer.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I don't know his views on this one, but Shawn Green and Brad Penny aren't the answer.

And a 42 year old pitcher with no cartilage in his knee and who could leave next winter with us getting zero in return is the answer? Give me a break.

I'd rather see a lock Hall of Fame pitcher go to the mound once every 5 days, rather than Shawn Green continue on his downward career slide for the $16 million each make.

Just because you say it doesn't make it true. If anything Green's 2004 numbers indicate that he is getting better. 255/335/399 before the break and 281/371/529 after the AS break. That's significant improvement in every category. Green has only really had two poor years during his entire career as a full-time player. 2003 was an aberration in Green's career numbers due to the fact that he played through a torn labrum and bursitis in his shoulder. 2000 was also a disappointing year (for his standards) and much of that could be put on switching leagues and a major adjustment to Dodger Stadium.

 

[Djaughe]

...I'd rather see a lock Hall of Fame pitcher go to the mound once every 5 days, rather than Shawn Green continue on his downward career slide for the $16 million each make.
....

I agree that I would like to see R.J. settle his career in AZ. But the reports circulating for awhile indicates that he wants to win and be on a team that can give him an extension.

I like brad penny and glad we can get him back after we did the mantai trade. I'm not quite sure about Green either...I just hope last year was an abberation because of his surgery and not a sign of things to come.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I agree that I would like to see R.J. settle his career in AZ. But the reports circulating for awhile indicates that he wants to win and be on a team that can give him an extension.

I like brad penny and glad we can get him back after we did the mantai trade. I'm not quite sure about Green either...I just hope last year was an abberation because of his surgery and not a sign of things to come.

second half of the year the guy hit 18 homers and had 55 RBIs - his numbers were down because of his shoulder problems - once healthy - he started swinging the bat again. If Penny's healthy - this team just completely reloaded. I'm stoked for next season now. Penny, Ortiz, Webb ain't that bad - our division SUCKS - and if Glaus can stay healthy - we will be battling down to the last day. Kind of a boom or bust offseason, but what the hell - it's not our money.

 

[Indrid Cold]

What does indrid cold mean?

You never saw the movie, The Mothman Prophecies?

 

[Indrid Cold]

And a 42 year old pitcher with no cartilage in his knee and who could leave next winter with us getting zero in return is the answer? Give me a break.

So instead we get a subpar Shawn Green in the walk year of his $16 million yr deal, and Brad Penny who the great Dr Frank Jobe can't figure out what to do with the nerve in his shoulder. At least RJ proved this year his knee can still get it done. Outside of wins, his other numbers were right inline with what he put up on the board before he hurt his knee.

Doesn't it bother you at all that Moorad deals for a former client who makes way too much money for what he's done the last 2 years? Doesn't it bother you that Brad Penny has a nerve problem in his shoulder that hasn't allowed him to throw since September, and he was shut down again in November? What kind of positive outlook for the DBacks do those two players have? All I see is a bloated contract and a broken down pitcher. Oh that's right, the Dbacks also get a decent reliever and a prospect.

 

[Indrid Cold]

Just because you say it doesn't make it true. If anything Green's 2004 numbers indicate that he is getting better. 255/335/399 before the break and 281/371/529 after the AS break. That's significant improvement in every category. Green has only really had two poor years during his entire career as a full-time player. 2003 was an aberration in Green's career numbers due to the fact that he played through a torn labrum and bursitis in his shoulder. 2000 was also a disappointing year (for his standards) and much of that could be put on switching leagues and a major adjustment to Dodger Stadium.

And Green did the same thing this year as he did in 2003...lousy first half, good 2nd half. In 2004 he went 253/.335/.399 before the All Star break and .281/.371/.529 afterwards. His defense has also become a liability if he's going to play RF. But even if he does put up numbers like his 2nd halves in 03 and 04, is that .900 OPS worth $16 million?

 

[joeshmo]

So instead we get a subpar Shawn Green in the walk year of his $16 million yr deal, and Brad Penny who the great Dr Frank Jobe can't figure out what to do with the nerve in his shoulder. At least RJ proved this year his knee can still get it done. Outside of wins, his other numbers were right inline with what he put up on the board before he hurt his knee.

All I see is a bloated contract and a broken down pitcher. Oh that's right, the Dbacks also get a decent reliever and a prospect.

You have no clue about Penny's injury except for what you read on his player page at cbs.sportsline. It is a bruise pushing up against a nerve causing a lot of pain, once the bruise heals he is 100% again without any long term effects or chances of reinjury. That hardly makes him a "broken down" pitcher, in fact far from it. Also, he still has to pass a physical, if he doesnt the trade doesnt go through.

As of right now the only valid arguement you have that holds any water at all is Greens's contract number.

 

[Indrid Cold]

I think I'll take Dr Frank Jobe's diagnosis over yours. Right now Penny isn't throwing, and they don't know when he can begin throwing. That sounds like a broken down pitcher to me. I wish it wasn't true, but until I read some positive report on Penny's condition I can't believe that he's ready to go. And with the way the arbitration process works, I'm sure he'll get a raise even though he might not be fit to pitch.

 

[Ryanwb]

I think I'll take Dr Frank Jobe's diagnosis over yours.

So you talk to Dr. Jobe often?

:roll:

 

[chickenhead]

IF Green and Penny remain healthy, and if they play at least to their averages, it could be an okay trade. If not, it's not. My comparison isn't as much with RJ, it's with the offers we've received straight from the Yankees. I'd rather have a locked-in Vazquez with the Yanks paying a portion of his salary, plus another usable player, than the downside of Green and Penny. That being said, we'll see if this deal happens, and then we'll see how they do.

 

[Djaughe]

I like penny...green kinda troubles me. But hey thats what the doctors are for when they do the phys. exam.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

And Green did the same thing this year as he did in 2003...lousy first half, good 2nd half. In 2004 he went 253/.335/.399 before the All Star break and .281/.371/.529 afterwards. His defense has also become a liability if he's going to play RF. But even if he does put up numbers like his 2nd halves in 03 and 04, is that .900 OPS worth $16 million?

Actually .900 OPS is worth about $16 million if not more in FA these days.

We have two choices:

a) Get Shawn Green, a potential superstar, for one year at $16 million and if he works out it's money well spent. If he doesn't, he walks and we can use that money next winter.

b) Sign Jeromy Burnitz and a #5 starter to multi year deals equaling $16 million, both of whom everyone knows are going to nothing more than one-dimensional and mediocre, and be stuck with them through 2006.

I'm going for option a.

And please tell me your medical background where you can distinguish Penny's injury. I'm pretty sure the DBacks aren't going to take on a guy who may never pitch again, they do have team doctors you know. The fact that he has been sht down for the winter means absolutley nothing. Most teams shut their pitchers down in the offseason anyways if there's even the slightest concern of an injury.

 

[Indrid Cold]

So you talk to Dr. Jobe often?:roll:

No, but I can read what he says in the papers. Or didn't you see my earlier post?

"In 41 years of examining thousands of pitchers, Dr. Frank Jobe has never come across an injury like Brad Penny's.
Consequently, no one can be certain when Penny will pitch again. "If the bruise is on the outside of the nerve, it could take three to four weeks to recover," Jobe said. "If the bruise is on the inside, it could be a matter of months. But either way, he needs rest and must stretch out the arm with exercise. Not only have I never seen something like this, but it is so rare that there isn't even any [research] literature on it."

Nice personal attack though. At least I come up with some substance to my doubts about this trade. All I get from Dbacks fans who like this trade is maybe Green can start producing again, and maybe Brad Penny is healthy.