Rumor: Bobcats, Clippers, Suns

[coloradosun]

The #7 pick in my deal goes for a veteran center, who blocks shots, sets picks, can rebound, run the court and does a lot of dirty work. He is a much better fit than Blount, Dampier or Okur.

Would you prefer to have White sitting on the bench for every game that does not include the Lakers or Ratliff starting.

 

[Chaplin]

The #7 pick in my deal goes for a veteran center, who blocks shots, sets picks, can rebound, run the court and does a lot of dirty work. He is a much better fit than Blount, Dampier or Okur.

Would you prefer to have White sitting on the bench for every game that does not include the Lakers or Ratliff starting.

What convinces you that Ratliff is a better fit than Dampier or even Blount or Okur?

 

[coloradosun]

What convinces you that Ratliff is a better fit than Dampier or even Blount or Okur?

He's not going to demand the ball (Dampier)and not going to chuck one up from outside(Okur), and runs the court better, can fill the lanes. I see him more of a team player and quite a tandem with Amare. With his three blocks a game that is 6 possible points the opponents will not have, eliminating some close games.

 

[Cheesebeef]

pulling out "the dad" is classic throwback.

and i think kobe and anyone would miraculous. in fact, i think kobe by himself would be miraculous. if we somehow pulled of kobe and okur i'd wet myself. if it were kobe and dampier i'd wet everyone on the board.

holy crap - the mental image of that is frightening - I knew you'd be the only one who commented on "the dad".

 

[Joe Mama]

pulling out "the dad" is classic throwback.

and i think kobe and anyone would miraculous. in fact, i think kobe by himself would be miraculous. if we somehow pulled of kobe and okur i'd wet myself. if it were kobe and dampier i'd wet everyone on the board.

Count me among those who no longer hopes the Phoenix Suns can acquire Kobe Bryant and Dampier.

What convinces you that Ratliff is a better fit than Dampier or even Blount or Okur?

Theo Ratliff is the best shot blocker in the league. If we want someone who is going to come in and immediately make a difference on defense he would fit the bill. I don't think it really matters much though. He was probably the biggest factor last year in Portland's late-season turnaround. I suspect they will want to keep them around.

Besides, he's one of those players like Marcus Camby, who I would be nervous about. He's notorious for his injury problems. He's also a good but not great rebounder.


Joe

 

[sunsfn]

Getting back to the trade, I still think that the Clippers will get more from Atlanta than from Charlotte, so Atlanta they can get Howard.


Just a guess, time will tell.

 

[George O'Brien]

Getting back to the trade, I still think that the Clippers will get more from Atlanta than from Charlotte, so Atlanta they can get Howard.

Just a guess, time will tell.

Actually there are other scenerios no even being discussed. There have been rumors that the Clippers would like to trade Brand. He's an outstanding player, but the Clippers never really like having to pay players what they are worth.

So one possibility would be for the Clippers to keep Howard and trade Brand ant Ely for Jason Terry and the Hawk's first pick. This clears about $6 million in cap space and gives them the money to go for Kobe, if they wanted to, although they would probably just hoard it.

 

[Joe Mama]

Actually there are other scenerios no even being discussed. There have been rumors that the Clippers would like to trade Brand. He's an outstanding player, but the Clippers never really like having to pay players what they are worth.

So one possibility would be for the Clippers to keep Howard and trade Brand ant Ely for Jason Terry and the Hawk's first pick. This clears about $6 million in cap space and gives them the money to go for Kobe, if they wanted to, although they would probably just hoard it.

whoever is floating that trade rumor is stupid. LA Clippers know that Kobe Bryant isn't even going to consider playing for them if they trade away Brand. BTW one of the reasons the Clippers would not make the trade originally proposed in this thread is that it would give the Phoenix Suns the room under the salary cap to pursue Kobe Bryant.

Joe Mama

 

[George O'Brien]

whoever is floating that trade rumor is stupid. LA Clippers know that Kobe Bryant isn't even going to consider playing for them if they trade away Brand. BTW one of the reasons the Clippers would not make the trade originally proposed in this thread is that it would give the Phoenix Suns the room under the salary cap to pursue Kobe Bryant.

Joe Mama

You are right. I rather lost the original point of the thread, which is to take advantage of the Clippers.

I guess I would have to agree that trading Brand would make the Clippers even less attractive to Kobe than they already are. The more reasonable explanation would be that Sterling is cheap and Brand makes a lot of money.

Of course, the basketball explanation would be that they could get some very good players if they offered Brand with the plan of building around Howard as their savior. (Wilcox would start until Howard would be ready to take over).

Realistically, if Brand were shopped, there would be a lot of teams willing to give up a lot to get him.

 

[Joe Mama]

You are right. I rather lost the original point of the thread, which is to take advantage of the Clippers.



Realistically, if Brand were shopped, there would be a lot of teams willing to give up a lot to get him.

Sure there would. But Sterling isn't going to trade him. This must be something you picked up from a message board as part of a trade idea.

Joe

 

[George O'Brien]

Sure there would. But Sterling isn't going to trade him. This must be something you picked up from a message board as part of a trade idea.

Joe

It was a news article, but I agree it is hardly a "hot rumor". In any case, it would really depend on just how promising the Clips think Howard is. If he really is the second coming of KG, then it would be crazy to trade him just because they are already deep at PF. But they wold need to move somebody.

 

[elindholm]

Why not draft Howard first, and then wait a couple of years before deciding whether he's the second coming of Garnett?

I've never bought the argument that you don't draft potential stars at positions where you already have stars. Wait until the "potential" stars actually realize that potential, and then decide what to do. Passing on Howard (if that's who they want) or trading Brand at this point would both be stupid moves, if the only reason is to avoid a conflict that might materialize down the road.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Why not draft Howard first, and then wait a couple of years before deciding whether he's the second coming of Garnett?

I've never bought the argument that you don't draft potential stars at positions where you already have stars. Wait until the "potential" stars actually realize that potential, and then decide what to do. Passing on Howard (if that's who they want) or trading Brand at this point would both be stupid moves, if the only reason is to avoid a conflict that might materialize down the road.

totally agree here. it's the reasoning that caused the blazers to take sam bowie over michael jordan 'cuz they already had drexler. take the best player and then, when they blossom, you can turn 'em around into something you need. a good case in point . . . the cavs back in the day. they drafted kj even though they already had price 'cuz he was the best player available. later that year they were able to turn kj (along w/ mark west and ty corbin) into the power forward they needed, larry nance.

 

[George O'Brien]

Why not draft Howard first, and then wait a couple of years before deciding whether he's the second coming of Garnett?

I've never bought the argument that you don't draft potential stars at positions where you already have stars. Wait until the "potential" stars actually realize that potential, and then decide what to do. Passing on Howard (if that's who they want) or trading Brand at this point would both be stupid moves, if the only reason is to avoid a conflict that might materialize down the road.

Yet it happens...

Seriously, it would really depend on what they got for Brand to know if it made sense.

 

[fordronken]

Why not draft Howard first, and then wait a couple of years before deciding whether he's the second coming of Garnett?

I've never bought the argument that you don't draft potential stars at positions where you already have stars. Wait until the "potential" stars actually realize that potential, and then decide what to do. Passing on Howard (if that's who they want) or trading Brand at this point would both be stupid moves, if the only reason is to avoid a conflict that might materialize down the road.

The thing is, they know Brand is good now, and they have a glaring need that would be much more difficult to fill if they used their draft pick on a guy who won't play for them for at least a year or two.

 

[elindholm]

The thing is, they know Brand is good now, and they have a glaring need that would be much more difficult to fill if they used their draft pick on a guy who won't play for them for at least a year or two.

That's certainly true. But if by their "glaring need" you mean center, no one in the draft can help them anyway, and if you mean PG, that's what free-agent money is for.

I'm not saying they should necessarily draft Howard, only that, of the various reasons not too, the fact that he duplicates Brand's position shouldn't be one of them.

 

[F-Dog]

Didn't Miami offer a huge signing bonus to Brand so the Clippers wouldn't match? If that's the case, it would be another reason that Brand is unlikely to get shipped out.


It wouldn't surprise me if the Clips took Howard and kept him, then floundered around for a year or two looking for a Wilcox and/or Kaman trade where they didn't get screwed over. I remember how stubborn they got with Darius Miles...

 

[elindholm]

Didn't Miami offer a huge signing bonus to Brand so the Clippers wouldn't match? If that's the case, it would be another reason that Brand is unlikely to get shipped out.

Ah, good point, I had forgotten about that.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Which poses an interesting question. Based on what we know now, who would you rather have next year: Barbosa or Vujanic?

Barbosa. Better body, better speed, better D, younger, and we've already seen him in an nba setting. We know he can compete.

We need Barbosa's D, his knack for stealing the ball will improve.

 

[Chaplin]

Barbosa. Better body, better speed, better D, younger, and we've already seen him in an nba setting. We know he can compete.

We need Barbosa's D, his knack for stealing the ball will improve.

I don't see how anyone can accurately answer this question. It's like saying what's better: Harry Potter 2 or Harry Potter 3, when you haven't even seen Harry Potter 3 yet. You've HEARD that it is pretty good, but do you really know?

 

[JCSunsfan]

I don't see how anyone can accurately answer this question. It's like saying what's better: Harry Potter 2 or Harry Potter 3, when you haven't even seen Harry Potter 3 yet. You've HEARD that it is pretty good, but do you really know?

That's true. But it is still possible to know which player has the better body, speed etc.

We have seen Barbs hold his own on an NBA court, and we've seen the potential.

We haven't seen Milos. He could end up like Tony Parker, or like the Yugo center we signed last summer and who didn't make it through the first few weeks of preseason.

That's why, if I have to choose now, I take Barbs.

 

[Errntknght]

"I don't see how anyone can accurately answer this question."

We don't have to answer it accurately, just answer on the basis of what we know and have heard. I've heard that Milos isn't much of a defender, and few Euros have been labelled as poor defenders then proved otherwise, so I go with Barbs - who isn't really a good defender yet but he has good possibilities in that realm. I don't expect him to turn out to be a starting PG in the NBA but I think he'll be a solid bench contributor as a combo guard who can up the tempo of a game.
The key thing to remember when it comes to getting players is to think playoffs, where weak defenders get picked on unmercifully. If a guy won't help you in the playoffs you are better off without him - with him you might go into the playoffs thinking your team is better than it really is.

 

[George O'Brien]

"I don't see how anyone can accurately answer this question."

We don't have to answer it accurately, just answer on the basis of what we know and have heard. I've heard that Milos isn't much of a defender, and few Euros have been labelled as poor defenders then proved otherwise, so I go with Barbs - who isn't really a good defender yet but he has good possibilities in that realm. I don't expect him to turn out to be a starting PG in the NBA but I think he'll be a solid bench contributor as a combo guard who can up the tempo of a game.
The key thing to remember when it comes to getting players is to think playoffs, where weak defenders get picked on unmercifully. If a guy won't help you in the playoffs you are better off without him - with him you might go into the playoffs thinking your team is better than it really is.

This is exactly why I'm not interested in Steve Nash.

I'm not counting on Vujanic to become a starter. I see him as "instant offense" in situations where he is not up against a major offensive threat.

 

[Chaplin]

It's one thing to actually know body type, speed, etc. in order to make a comparison, but here's the thing: We don't even know that about Milos except what the media feeds us. According to the media Big Jake was going to do wonders for us and Luc Longley was going to bring 3 championships worth of experience. We need to wait at least until we've seen Milos actually play before making a judgement about him, don't you think?

 

[JCSunsfan]

It's one thing to actually know body type, speed, etc. in order to make a comparison, but here's the thing: We don't even know that about Milos except what the media feeds us. According to the media Big Jake was going to do wonders for us and Luc Longley was going to bring 3 championships worth of experience. We need to wait at least until we've seen Milos actually play before making a judgement about him, don't you think?

Chap, that's all true. But I don't think that was the original question. Wasn't the question who you would keep if you had to make a choice now?

If, in order to make some deal this summer, we've got to make a choice between the two, who do you keep and who do you ship?

Of course, I would love to bring Milos in and see what he's got. And I believe that's what we'll do.