SA Reaction To Amare's Accusations

[Azlen]

This is all due to the fact that there was just way too much time between games 2 and 3. Thankfully we will have something new to talk about after tonight.

 

[az1965]

This is all due to the fact that there was just way too much time between games 2 and 3. Thankfully we will have something new to talk about after tonight.

We will hopefully be celebrating a victory tonight...

 

[The Man In Black]

wow, you're such an insightful poster and a REAL ASSET TO THIS BOARD. clearly, you have unbiased, well-thought out opinions, and your MEDICAL KNOWLEDGE knows no bounds.

i for one no longer think that the suns can beat GOD'S GIFT TO BASKETBALL, the spurs, due in large part to your expansive intellect and EXTRAORDINARY PERCEPTION OF THE NUANCES OF THE GAME.

thank you, mib. THANK YOU.

Thanks...you're welcome. I look forward to a great game. The Suns are going to need to bust through having lost home court. Pop is a master at adjustments and will find a way to get the third part of the Big 3 going. Defense is a constant(whether perceived dirty or not) and while the Suns are fired up due to Amare's views given to the media, Tim D knows that he will have a big say as to how the game is played.

Good luck this evening...

MIB

PS For those that asked, My life is well. I've got my health, a very cool family, & San Diego is beautiful. Plus the Chargers look awesome this year and the Spurs are in the thick of another chance at the title.

 

[kps0001]

Wow.I guess people just don't comprehend anything anymore. The pic that I got, didn't show that angle. You have a nice pic with a well drawn out polygon of red.

same angle and almost exact same pic just with a well drawn out polygon of red to show some blind Spurs fans what they couldn't otherwise see!

But whatever...Amare looks good to go, Bruce is ready to defend, and Tim Duncan is still the best player in the L on BOTH sides of the ball. I expect a Spurs victory tomorrow.

should be a good game.

You said phalanges...you could've just said toes. See what happens when one tries to simplify for the people who just say foot or achilles?

You have good evening doc, nurse, lvn...Suns Fan.

you failed to bring up my mention of "metatarsals and phalanges" which are a big portion of the bones that compose what most refer to as the foot. Now I dooooo see what happens when I try to simplify things for those who come bringing medical diagrams, pictures of the play in question, and ranting about something that they don't fully understand because they can only see half of the facts.





Is this guy for real?

 

[The Man In Black]

I can talk hoops all day. Med school talk is for the people that give diagnosis, my time in the training room, I was only allowed to give "evaluations"

But hey, if it's basketball, you want to talk about. I'd love to. Been watching the game for what..30 years now. It's a great game.

I've seen many plays and game. I said earlier that I've seen games at the Vet. We can talk about the Gar Heard Rainbow jumper in the 70's, or we can talk about the textbook jumpshot that was Sweet D, or we can even talk about James Edwards and the pot fiasco. And if you don't understand where I'm coming from, trust me...it's just hoops. Talking it, at times though made Lakerfan edgy. I hope to not do the same to you guys. The mods here run a fine board. You won't see me #T*$*^ or any of that because...is it really constructive?

 

[Gee!]

Is this guy for real?

I dont think the Men In Black he talks about are the Spurs..

Its these men in black and their memory eraser thing that have told him what to say..

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[elindholm]

Who gives a sh#@? They are dirty. That's gonna fire them up? Bruce Bowen should be smashed, sent down hard by Burke. They're dirty and they're
f*@#ing crybabies. I hate the Spurs more than I hate the Lakers. I hate ******* Poppazits, that stupid deer-in-the-headlights faced Tim Duncan, Manu G-NOSE-li is a disgusting little turd, Tony Parker's alright for a Spur, but Bruce Bowen is guttersnipe. He should be hurt, badly. F the Spurs!!!!

Well that certainly is a first post to hang your hat on. Welcome to the board, I guess.

 

[Gee!]

But hey, if it's basketball, you want to talk about. I'd love to. Been watching the game for what..30 years now.

Youve only been told youve been watching it for 30 years..

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[The Man In Black]

Youve only been told youve been watching it for 30 years..

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Wow...someone that knows me after what less than 20 posts. AMAZING. Hey can you pick 6 numbers in today Super Lotto?

30 years plus-give or take. I can tell you that I watched Wilt coach basketball for the San Diego Conquistadors.

So you might be asking yourself? What league was that team in? Try the ABA. Yeah that long. Basketball is such a glorious game, don't let your fan mentality get in the way of talking good hoops.

As for the name Man In Black? It's easy...I took it from these guys right here:

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I'm just one guy but there are whole bunch of people who follow what those guys have built up and sustained.

Good luck to your team.

 

[just do it]

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look at the spurs logo, its kinda of a proud gay rights themed rainbow

 

[The Man In Black]

You actually know the colors and understand the issues of the LGBA?

Wow there are some complex minds on this board. I found a plethora, nay a veritable fountain of knowledge here.

Those fiesta colors notwithstanding, the Spurs rep Silver and Black but you knew that

Anyways, I'll be off to watch a different sport and will be tivo'ing the game. I'm sure that when I check back, this board will either be happy or mad.

Y'all be cool Good luck to your team.

 

[msdundee]

Wow...someone that knows me after what less than 20 posts.

We don't "know you" after less than 20 posts and we wouldn't "know you" after 2,000 posts.

We do know why you're here.

 

[__JaG__]

Idiotic article. So the spurs are gonna be more focused because of what amare said? This team has won 3 titles w/pop/duncan, but they werent gonna play a motivated game 3 until amare opened his mouth. Moronic argument.

doesnt seen so "moronic" now does it?? extra motivation is not what the spurs needed at this point...

 

[Errntknght]

Its too bad 'the man in black' can't guard Bruce Bowen for a while - he might not change his tune but he'd be singing an octave higher...

 

[The Man In Black]

You know what, I've talked to him. He was cool enough to have a 2 minute conversation at the Oracle arena with me while he was signing autographs.

His defensive tenacity is borne from the fact that he had to play minor league and french league basketball before he made it to the NBA. 10 day contracts and getting cut will test you so you have to find a way to stick and for Bowen, it's defense.

You guys must not remember the kind of physicality that guys like Alvin Robertson, Sidney Moncrief, and going further back than that, Walt Frazier displayed. The league used to be a no blood-no foul situation. The league used to let you hand check a player. That was something that Jordan did with extreme prejudice on his way to ALL-NBA D team placements.

Even though the rules have changed, Bowen continues his style of play with great success as evidenced by his multiple NBA ALL-D team placments.

I expect that once Bowen hangs it up, Raja Bell looks to be the next best perimeter defender in the league and I for one, would hate to see him change his game.

Basketball is a contact sport but so many people think that the contact should be minimal, until the rules are changed yet again, one won't see that happen any time soon. Defense is still an important component in winning games and ultimately titles.

 

[Errntknght]

You guys must not remember the kind of physicality that guys like Alvin Robertson, Sidney Moncrief, and going further back than that, Walt Frazier displayed.

I've been following the NBA since 1955 so I've seen all those guys play - and none of them were dirty players. Walt wasn't even that physical. I even saw Red A. send "Jungle" Jim Loscutoff onto the floor when opponents got too rough. Bowen would have been quickly taught the error of his ways, and he probably wouldn't been much of a defender after that.

The spiritual ancestor of Bowen is John Starks - dirty, sneaky and whiney. If everyone played the way those guys did, the game would be organized mayhem - which was in the 1920's. (It was played inside a mesh mettle cage and blood alone was not sufficient cause for a foul to be called.)

If that's the kind of game you like to watch, you're entitled but I don't care for it. With the advent of widespread videotaping of games its now possible to get the goods on guys who persistently put other players at high risk of injury, even accomplished sneaks like Bowen. The sooner the league gets rid of them the better, IMO.

 

[cly2tw]

With the advent of widespread videotaping of games its now possible to get the goods on guys who persistently put other players at high risk of injury, even accomplished sneaks like Bowen. The sooner the league gets rid of them the better, IMO.

That's the difference between Raja and Bowen. Raja draws the line where he would put others at high risk of injury, while Bowen salivates on that and enjoys the intimidation effect caused.

BTW, wasn't that John Starks who tunneled Marion on a layup or rebound early in his career and Marion was shell-shock for a long period after being back from the injury?

 

[Errntknght]

Yep, that was Starks (on a rebound)... MIB would probably count that as the crowning achievement of John's days in the league.

 

[The Man In Black]

I've been following the NBA since 1955 so I've seen all those guys play - and none of them were dirty players. Walt wasn't even that physical. I even saw Red A. send "Jungle" Jim Loscutoff onto the floor when opponents got too rough. Bowen would have been quickly taught the error of his ways, and he probably wouldn't been much of a defender after that.

The spiritual ancestor of Bowen is John Starks - dirty, sneaky and whiney. If everyone played the way those guys did, the game would be organized mayhem - which was in the 1920's. (It was played inside a mesh mettle cage and blood alone was not sufficient cause for a foul to be called.)

If that's the kind of game you like to watch, you're entitled but I don't care for it. With the advent of widespread videotaping of games its now possible to get the goods on guys who persistently put other players at high risk of injury, even accomplished sneaks like Bowen. The sooner the league gets rid of them the better, IMO.

With the advent of widespread messageboards it's now possible to overreact on plays and situations on guys who consistently play hard-nosed defense, even accomplished 7 time ALL-NBA Defenders like Bowen. The more times he is voted in validates the need for a lockdown defender like him. Case and point-Raja Bell.

Oh and here is the math that should tell you that he isn't dirty:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/marty_burns/11/15/bowen.reputation/1.html

The GM went on to raise an interesting statistical argument: Let's say Bowen defends the other team's top scorer each night, and that the scorer attempts 20 shots per game. If Bowen actively contests half those shots, he's looking at 820 times per season (10 shots x 82 games) where he's flying out at his man trying to get a hand in his face. Over the span of five years, that's 4,100 plays.
"How many times has he been accused of [sticking his foot underneath] over that time span? Four or five? Out of [4,000] plays?," the GM notes. "When you look at it like that, it doesn't seem like it's intentional."

Is he dirty?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15868457/

Bruce Bowen is dirty.
But then he went into the washroom to wipe the smudge off his face.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/ian_thomsen/02/08/weekly.quiz/1.html

"People say he's dirty,'' says Bowen's teammate Tim Duncan. "He's not dirty. He just puts a different level of defense on people that people aren't used to. He's in people's faces from start to finish, he's within proximity on every shot that you take, and that's just uncomfortable for people.''

 

[Mulli]

Tim Duncan said he wasn't dirty? That settles it then, doesn't it.

 

[elindholm]

So, let's see, if an alcoholic routinely drives under the influence, but only occasionally comes close to hitting someone, that means really his behavior is just fine, right?

 

[The Man In Black]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/ian_thomsen/02/08/weekly.quiz/2.html

5. Why do star players think that Bruce Bowen is dirty?

ANSWER: Ray Allen and others complain that Bowen puts them in situations that could lead to injury, that, for example, he will slide his foot under them as they're landing from a jump shot. (The Mavericks' Josh Howard, who is Bowen's defensive heir, is beginning to hear the same kind of accusations.) Bowen denies the charges, while admitting that he is always trying to distract opponents from putting the ball in the basket.

When I hear these kinds of complaints, it reminds me just how friendly players have become with one another. In the 1980s and earlier it was assumed that they would do everything they could get away with to beat each other -- and if they didn't, then they weren't earning their money. But now an approach like Bowen's is unusual. Of course, Allen has every right to complain if he feels that an opponent is dirty, but it's easy to single out Bowen because so few players are as ambitious defensively.

"It's almost like you've broken the code if you're really trying to stop me,'' Gregg Popovich says. "But that's not the deal here. Bruce doesn't play that game. When people complain, it's mostly a frustration that for the rest of the night I've got to put up with this, and this guy is going to be in my chest and he's going to be after me every second, and they don't like it. They don't like it.''

"Sometimes I think guys are concerned with being accepted by the All-Stars,'' Bowen says. "They don't want to create any controversy.''
To illustrate his point, Bowen briefly acts out both parts of a skit in which the All-Star scorer has been fouled rather violently by the no-name defender. He even deepens his voice for dramatic effect.

"Hey man, what were you doing?'' the All-Star complains threateningly.
"Oh, I'm sorry,'' responds the meek defender. "I want to make sure we stay friends through the year.''
(Curtain.)

"At this point right here it's not about being friends,'' Bowen goes on, in his normal voice. "It's about me getting the job done, and them [the scorers] doing their best to get the job done as well. I know Kobe night in and night out is going to compete to the best of his ability against me whether they're up 20 or down 20, and vice versa with me.

"I think more of the guys I guard who used to have big problems with me, they're starting to see that 'that's just the way he is,' " adds Bowen, referring to himself. "Off the court it's different; we can sit and have a conversation. But on the court I have a job to do and I would be doing my team, my organization and myself and those who are following behind me a disservice if I just let you do whatever it is you want to do.''

 

[elindholm]

It's pretty funny how he completely ignores the actual charge. He's not in the crosshairs because of his tough defense. Playing tough defense and trying to hurt people are two different things. Bowen does both, and conveniently "confesses" to only the former in a lame attempt to distract us from his track record with the latter.

 

[az1965]

So let me ask... Is Bowen the only real and true defender in the league? How come other defensive players are not being accused the same way as Bowen has been? Playing tough defense and being a cheapshot, dirty artist two separate things.

 

[The Man In Black]

Bowen isn't the only guy that the NBA brings in or calls.

You guys remember when Caparkaba when down due to Fortson. Broken wrist right?

Other guys will get calls like Reggie Evans. With Bruce the complaint is that the offensive player can't get his "space" and that he is being "disrespected". Do you guys think that your team is "entitled" to an easier basket or easier shot just because they play a style that garners good ratings?

You only hear about it because your team is playing his team. Or the guys that he covers are ALL-STAR players who feel that they need to whine about it to the media. Kobe Bryant just calls him the player that defends him best.

Right now the only guys who exemplify this mental fortitude is Steve Nash and Raja Bell. If the Suns go on to lose this series, it won't be because of these 2 players effort or preparation.