Scary prediction about our next GM

[Errntknght]

I don't mind an owner thats careful with money. I was quite upset with the C's for the amount they gave Marbs - it was nice of Isaiah to bail us out on that one but you can't depend on that happening every time. Like most people I thought Sarver should have gone the extra five mil for JJ but I could certainly understand the concern with what he'd shown up till then.

For the most part the freest spenders and the most parsimonious don't do well and Sarver, so far, appears to be in the middle ranks. Saving a million here and there by keeping the bench short is somewhat bothersome but they did pick up Skita. I certainly can't say they dumped anyone that I'd seen demonstrate that he belonged in league. I sort of thought Aaron Williams would be a decent pickup but that was just a guess because I haven't seen him play in a couple of years.

By the way, Louis doesn't strike me as being very 'Cubby like' - I spotted the real thing when he poked his nose in here some months back. I didn't say anything in a thread but I warned the board controllers to keep an eye on him.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

If BC doesn't come back, it will be more about their inability to work with each other than the money.

So it is more of Sarver being an egocentric controlling owner than him being a penny pinching one.

 

[Errntknght]

Heck, he is the owner so he is in control. I always thought JC was extremely egocentric - avoiding hiring coaches who were known to be strong personalities or who wanted a voice in the acquisition of players. Putting his son in a job he wasn't qualified for... even overpaying Marbury fit with that.

 

[slinslin]

If BC doesn't come back, it will be more about their inability to work with each other than the money.

So it is more of Sarver being an egocentric controlling owner than him being a penny pinching one.

Or it might be that someone bought a team for 400M$ and wants to get his guys involved rather and doesn't mind letting someone go who is getting all the media attention because he is the son of the previous owner.
If not for this talk about Colangelo going to Toronto most casual NBA fans would probably still think this is a Colangelo franchise.

 

[carrrnuttt]

P.S. Hey Louis--aren't you Cubby in disguise? The "Louis" over at phxsuns.net turned out to be Cubby, and you seem to have the same shtick...

Not a chance. Cubby, whose best-known incarnation to me was Mike Spisak, was never as coherent as this Louis.

I don't know about that. "Louis" was pretty coherent at phxsuns.net. They only found out via an IP check (probably did it for all the new registrants), I would presume. Not that I am accusing anyone, but one here wouldn't be bad.

 

[Chaplin]

If BC doesn't come back, it will be more about their inability to work with each other than the money.

So it is more of Sarver being an egocentric controlling owner than him being a penny pinching one.

Surprised to hear this coming from you, Andy. Where's your evidence of this? An extra 2 million dollars and complete control can be awfully enticing.

 

[Wally]

Surprised to hear this coming from you, Andy. Where's your evidence of this? An extra 2 million dollars and complete control can be awfully enticing.

Wasn't there an article that indicated Sarver had matched the money or something close? I'll look to see if I can find it & come back & edit this post......................

Edit.....
Can't find it - maybe I was dreaming. Could have sworn I saw something.

I agree with George though, I don't think it's going to be a money issue - it's more about controll & personality differences.

 

[George O'Brien]

This is not going to be about money, it will be about control. If BC comes back, it will be because Sarver has decided to give him more control than BC feels he has now. The money and contract issue will communicate his willingness to let BC run the team.

If Sarver relents, it will be because his advisors have told him the truth. Sarver doesn't know enough to run the team on his own and he's not like Cuban who can just buy his way out of his mistakes.

If their relationship is irreparable, then it will be necessary to move quickly. It is not already time to get started at evaluating possible draft picks.

 

[Louis]

Here's an article from the AZ Republic...

Colangelo decision coming by Tuesday

Paul Coro
The Arizona Republic
Feb. 27, 2006 12:00 AM
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]
Suns President and General Manager Bryan Colangelo's decision to stay in Phoenix or to take a Toronto Raptors executive position must be made today or Tuesday.

Those close to the situation on both sides wonder why he would not go, considering that Toronto is willing to give him more money (more than $3 million a year and possibly an ownership stake), job security (a four- or five-year contract) and more autonomy with basketball decisions than Suns Managing Partner Robert Sarver allows.

Colangelo entered Sunday without a decision, leaving those affected to believe he is wrangling with finances and/or emotional bonds to Phoenix. Others tied to the team can't imagine that he would stay, given how his relationship with his boss and adversary, Sarver, has soured.

They talked Thursday and Friday in heated and civil tones about their differences - personal, professional and financial. The onus is now on Colangelo to decide.

Both sides must wrestle with the impact on Jerry Colangelo, Suns chief executive officer and chairman, who has another season in that salaried position before the franchise sale is complete. He would remain paid as chairman until at least 2012 under the stipulations of the original agreement, which also was supposed to give him final say on any Suns management committee stalemate.

Jerry Colangelo has long-term ties to Toronto executives, particularly one with interim GM Wayne Embry that nearly spans his only son's life.

Sunday, NBA columnists from San Francisco to San Antonio to New York criticized Sarver for not responding with a pay bump.

Just as Mike D'Antoni remains one of the lowest-paid coaches for this season and next until a two-year extension starts, Bryan Colangelo earns about $1 million annually to be among the lowest-paid general managers. He also has a Suns ownership stake that he must sell if he chooses to leave.[/FONT]

[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/0227suns0227.html[/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]There it is again in black and white (and one word red). [/FONT]

Either way, if he leaves by Tuesday, so be it. This situation needs to be resolved ASAP for better or worse.

Quite frankly, I wouldn't be opposed to BC wanting to leave, it's the way both he and Sarver are handling this during the season of a potential WCF run.

Unfortunately, though, the replacement will be a yes-man for Sarver that will allow Sarver (uneducated in the school of basketball) to make key decisions for the Suns.

During a time in which the Suns window of oppurtunity to win a championship is slowly shutting.

 

[Gaddabout]

Unfortunately, though, the replacement will be a yes-man for Sarver that will allow Sarver (uneducated in the school of basketball) to make key decisions for the Suns.

But Sarver is already in control. He's either approved or denied every deal so far. He was behind the whole JJ thing. The difference will be whether or not the next GM will be as savvy to salvage talent and picks and BC has been the last two years in the face of intense financial scrutiny.

One rumor that hasn't been reported suggests BC was told to get rid of some salaries this off-season because Sarver refuses to pay salary tax -- even for a championship-caliber team. Sarver, the rumor states, is taking a hard line at maintaining long-term financial grounding over short-term success. We're not talking Clipper-like status here, but the rumors about Marion being on the trading block probably had as much to do with this as anything (and by logic, it would never have been Marion for Garnett). I was told it's not about profitability (the team would be profitable even if it payed a few million in salary tax) as much as it's about Sarver's pride at wanting to prove he can be successful while being fiscally conscience. He wants to be seen as shrewd and successful. However, the lack of sellouts early in the year created a lot of tension between ownership and the front office.

I would not be shocked at all if Marion is traded this summer for two or three lesser contracts.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I can't really blame Sarver for not wanting to hand over control of the team he just bought to the son of the guy he bought the team from.

 

[Chaplin]

If Kiki isn't retained by Denver this summer, would he be a possible replacement?

 

[hafey]

I'm becoming more convinced Kiki isn't a very good GM and is overrated.

 

[elindholm]

But Sarver is already in control. He's either approved or denied every deal so far.

But who sets them up? Isn't it the GM who gets on the phone and says, "Okay, you get Joe Johnson, but we have to get Diaw and these picks with this protection"? Signing off on the deal is the easy part.

I'm not too worried about the rest of this season, because the Suns don't have much in the way of moves to make. They have to add a big man (and, ideally, another PG), but that input is going to come mainly from D'Antoni anyway, because he will have the best informed opinion about who will fit. But other than that, this is a time of the season when GMs don't do much anyway. Isn't it?

 

[BillsCarnage]

If Kiki isn't retained by Denver this summer, would he be a possible replacement?

Oh he11 no. Kiki hasn't exactly assembled a top notch team. Take out the Melo pick (no that was rocket science to figure out) but what has he done??

It'll be interesting to see if a new gm would keep this team intact.

 

[fordronken]

I don't like Kiki as a GM at all.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

David Morway over Kiki any day

 

[Folster]

Oh he11 no. Kiki hasn't exactly assembled a top notch team. Take out the Melo pick (no that was rocket science to figure out) but what has he done??

He swindled New York and got Camby and Nene for a broken McDyess. Everyone swindles New York though.

 

[hafey]

But to choose Nene, he passed on another young PF.....was it Chris Wilcox or Jered Jefferies or somthing?

 

[Folster]

But to choose Nene, he passed on another young PF.....was it Chris Wilcox or Jered Jefferies or somthing?

Nobody's perfect. If he would have picked Amare he would have a gold statue in front of the Pepsi Center and all of the people in the land of Denver would worship the great Kiki.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Kiki also paid big money to Andre Miller instead of Gilbert Arenas that summer. Not looking like a great decision if you ask me.

Then he vastly overpaid Martin, and gave away 3 first round picks to do it.

The Melo pick wasn't even his first choice. He was very public about wanting Darko, and even seemed dissapointed that he was left with Carmelo.


The best thing Kiki did was become the first GM to completely blow up a team in 1 season after recognizing that they weren't going anywhere. Actually, Jordan might have been first - but he didn't get the Wizards far under the cap IIRC - he just dumped the old big 3.

 

[fordronken]

But to choose Nene, he passed on another young PF.....was it Chris Wilcox or Jered Jefferies or somthing?

He passed on Amare TWICE!

Who has that Tskitishvilli guy now?

 

[Folster]

Kiki also paid big money to Andre Miller instead of Gilbert Arenas that summer. Not looking like a great decision if you ask me.

That looks like a bad decision now, but I recall a lot of posters coveting Miller especially when he was with Cleveland. I think Kiki had a decent plan and brought in good players. It just never materialized the way he imagined. Kind of like the Suns and Marbs, or Kidd and Penny.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

That looks like a bad decision now, but I recall a lot of posters coveting Miller especially when he was with Cleveland. I think Kiki had a decent plan and brought in good players. It just never materialized the way he imagined. Kind of like the Suns and Marbs, or Kidd and Penny.

Very true. He definitely brought the team from a laughing stock to respectable. Of course, 50 win teams aren't really THAT hard to assemble if you can start from scratch and dont get hit by a devestating (and expensive) injury. There are far worse GMs out there who instead of making 3-4 mistakes over a couple years make 3-4 mistakes a season.

I just agree with some posters who say that his reputation seems to be better than it should be. Of course, the Kiki bandwagon slowed down a lot last season, so maybe it is where it should be now?

 

[George O'Brien]

Very true. He definitely brought the team from a laughing stock to respectable. Of course, 50 win teams aren't really THAT hard to assemble if you can start from scratch and dont get hit by a devestating (and expensive) injury. There are far worse GMs out there who instead of making 3-4 mistakes over a couple years make 3-4 mistakes a season.

I just agree with some posters who say that his reputation seems to be better than it should be. Of course, the Kiki bandwagon slowed down a lot last season, so maybe it is where it should be now?

Kiki's inability to get the Nuggets a solid outside shooter despire having Nene as trade bait makes you wonder.