Since I Promised My Round 1 Preferred Selection

[Chopper0080]

My impression of Pugh is that he's probably really good technically, with also a high football IQ, but only average in terms of physicality, and declining in that this last area.

We have so many other roster issues to deal with, that while it's possible you could upgrade this position, maybe instead opt for continuity here, and spend our FA and draft capital on other positions that are surely weaker than LG.

If we could persuade him to restructure his deal, that would be even better.

If you acquire two good OGs and one of the supplant's Pugh, great, move on from him then? Until that time comes, you are just creating anothoer hole that Keim will be unable to fill in the draft or will overpay a player who will not be able to justify the money he is getting aka Pugh/Kennard/Phillips/Watt.

 

[Chopper0080]

To follow up some more.


That Packers-Niners game pretty much confirmed me being cool with going WR in round 1.

One team had two dynamite receiving options in Deebo-Kittle while the other just had Adams. We just seen who won & who lost(& the one that lost, keeps losing in heartbreaking fashion each & every year).

Hopkins and Ertz?

 

[DVontel]

Hopkins and Ertz?

Ertz isn’t even getting separation from you or me. He’s complimentary. Not dominant & hasn’t been in a while.

 

[Chopper0080]

Ertz isn’t even getting separation from you or me. He’s complimentary. Not dominant & hasn’t been in a while.

Then we probably should be prepared to lose him because my guess is that he will ask for a salary of someone who is a #2 option.

 

[juza76]

Ertz isn’t even getting separation from you or me. He’s complimentary. Not dominant & hasn’t been in a while.

And even yards after the catch
Its just a reliable target, like the last Fitzgerald

 

[Chopper0080]

The biggest failure of the Keim era is probably his inability to have our cap dollars result in top end players. His drafting has been crap but the draft is hard.

Of our top 8 contract hits this year.
#2 - DJ Humphries
#5 - Justin Pugh
#6 - Jordan Phillips
#7 - Devon Kennard
#8 - Jordan Hicks

None of those players is anywhere close to being considered dominant.

Next year?
DJ - 19 mil
Pugh - 12 mil
Phillips - 13 mil
Kennard - 9 mil
Hicks - 9 mil
add Watt - 15.9 mil

Just crazy how many players we are paying large dollars and causing us to lose value while our conference is paying Aaron Donald, Cooper Kupp, Jalen Ramsey, Trent Williams, Nick Bosa, and George Kittle.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Drafting 23rd we are not going to get the "highest ranked" player at any position. But reat assured whoever we select Keim will tell us he's the guy they wanted all along and he was shocked to still see him on the board.

Would be if Jameson Williams falls because of his knee.

 

[Harry]

My problem with going WR in round 1 is you’ll have to get lucky to find a pass rusher to replace Jones unless you’re going to re-sign Jones at the cost of most of the Cards‘ cap space. There are affordable WRs in FA and for trade. I don‘t see an affordable edge anywhere but the draft.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

My problem with going WR in round 1 is you’ll have to get lucky to find a pass rusher to replace Jones unless you’re going to re-sign Jones at the cost of most of the Cards‘ cap space. There are affordable WRs in FA and for trade. I don‘t see an affordable edge anywhere but the draft.

I think it's pretty clear that Keim faces a very, very challenging off-season.

It's time to put up, or shut up for Keim, Kingsbury, and Joseph. It's not hard to imagine all three unemployed by the end of next season.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

My problem with going WR in round 1 is you’ll have to get lucky to find a pass rusher to replace Jones unless you’re going to re-sign Jones at the cost of most of the Cards‘ cap space. There are affordable WRs in FA and for trade. I don‘t see an affordable edge anywhere but the draft.

We aren’t seeking “affordable” if we are drafting WR in round 1. We are seeking top end weapon and successor to dhop. Those guys don’t tend to be readily available often. On occasion? Sure. Dhop and amari Cooper come to mind. But not often. And those guys aren’t “affordable.” Same can be said for passrusher. You can find affordable guys like golden. And occasionally some high end guys become available (chandler jones, or Khalil Mack as examples that match/exceed amari/dhop). The truth is, other than QB, if you’re willing to spend you can get almost any position high end guys in trade at about the same rate (tackle - Trent Williams, center - Hudson, tight end - ertz, see above for wide receiver and passrusher, defensive tackle - suh, and I could go on). You want affordable guys? Again you can find it for all positions in the free agent market. But if you truly want to land a top tier player at any position the premium draft picks of first and second round are (or should be) your primary currency.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The biggest failure of the Keim era is probably his inability to have our cap dollars result in top end players. His drafting has been crap but the draft is hard.

Of our top 8 contract hits this year.
#2 - DJ Humphries
#5 - Justin Pugh
#6 - Jordan Phillips
#7 - Devon Kennard
#8 - Jordan Hicks

None of those players is anywhere close to being considered dominant.

Next year?
DJ - 19 mil
Pugh - 12 mil
Phillips - 13 mil
Kennard - 9 mil
Hicks - 9 mil
add Watt - 15.9 mil

Just crazy how many players we are paying large dollars and causing us to lose value while our conference is paying Aaron Donald, Cooper Kupp, Jalen Ramsey, Trent Williams, Nick Bosa, and George Kittle.

My God that list...

 

[TheCardFan]

Ertz isn’t even getting separation from you or me. He’s complimentary. Not dominant & hasn’t been in a while.

Agreed but he doesn't need to be dominant (like Kittle/Kelce) to be a great asset for this offense/for Kyler. He just needs to get open in the middle (which he does regularly) and Kyler needs to use him WAY more on 3rd and short (vs those damn 20-40 yard low percentage throws to the tight sidelines).

It has to be a reasonable contract for us but I think losing Ertz would be a huge loss for an offense lacking weapons already.

 

[Harry]

My God that list...

You guys have hit on the major flaw in Keim’s draft; the cap impact. Successful teams tend to succeed because impact draft picks are affordable and leave cap space to target critical free agents. Keim has drafted medium quality picks which means there isn’t typically enough cap space to fill critical needs.

When Ouchie says he wants a round 1 WR, he would be committing the Cards to signing a FA edge. That is unless you think the Cards can win without a pass rush. He mentions Golden, who is far from a dominant rusher and a weak run defender. Keep in mind he wanted to play for the Cards, a rare occurrence. I’m sure the Cards could get a good receiver either via trade or FA. I’m not sure they could sign one of the few decent edges available. There are always receivers to be had.

 

[Russ Smith]

I like Pickens from Georgia in the 3rd round if he's there

Yeah I like him 2 he's a first round talent who won't go in teh first round because he's coming off injury and didn't get the chance in college to show how good he was on a running team

 

[Russ Smith]

Apparently one of the more intriguing WR's in this draft chose not to enter the draft, Bru McCoy. USC then TExas, then back to USC, started opposite Drake London, looked like a future star then got charged with domestic violence. DA eventually didn't pursue it but USC refused to reinstate him and he recently entered the transfer portal. 21 years old very talented kid was a 5 star as both a WR and an edge rusher. Ironically the original reason he left USC for Texas is Kliff left USC and Mccoy felt "betrayed".

of course the reason he's not in the draft is he knows teams don't want to deal with him right now because of the domestic violence allegations but he will likely end up playing for someone in the NFL at some point.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I never worry about cap space. It can be manipulated to make the necessary adjustments.

If the Cards go the veteran route, I’d go after Michael Thomas full bore. People forget how good he is. Him and Hopkins on the outside. Now we’re talking.

Another WR I like in the draft is David Bell from Purdue. Don’t know his speed but he’s pretty damn good.

 

[Chopper0080]

You guys have hit on the major flaw in Keim’s draft; the cap impact. Successful teams tend to succeed because impact draft picks are affordable and leave cap space to target critical free agents. Keim has drafted medium quality picks which means there isn’t typically enough cap space to fill critical needs.

When Ouchie says he wants a round 1 WR, he would be committing the Cards to signing a FA edge. That is unless you think the Cards can win without a pass rush. He mentions Golden, who is far from a dominant rusher and a weak run defender. Keep in mind he wanted to play for the Cards, a rare occurrence. I’m sure the Cards could get a good receiver either via trade or FA. I’m not sure they could sign one of the few decent edges available. There are always receivers to be had.

After what I saw from the defense and our history with front 7 defensive players, I am not drafting an EDGE in round 1. To be frank, I am telling Vance to figure out how to make what we have given him work.

 

[Chopper0080]

I never worry about cap space. It can be manipulated to make the necessary adjustments.

If the Cards go the veteran route, I’d go after Michael Thomas full bore. People forget how good he is. Him and Hopkins on the outside. Now we’re talking.

Another WR I like in the draft is David Bell from Purdue. Don’t know his speed but he’s pretty damn good.

Calvin Ridley makes sense because of his ability to separate as Kyler has not shown the ability to throw players open or anticipate breaks.

 

[Chopper0080]

Two players I like who may be available. Charles Cross and Kenyon Green. Cross has a very high ceiling and would give us the ability to move on from spending 18 mil on an above average LT. Green would provide a little bit of immediate help as he would provide a physical interior blocker that we lack. Linderbaum would be awesome but I think he will be gone and it would be more forward thinking than we are capable of.

 

[DVontel]

After what I saw from the defense and our history with front 7 defensive players, I am not drafting an EDGE in round 1. To be frank, I am telling Vance to figure out how to make what we have given him work.

We have only drafted once EDGE since Keim became the GM. Well, really 0 since he got moved to ILB for some reason. I don’t think that should prevent us from drafting one in the first this year.

 

[overseascardfan]

We have only drafted once EDGE since Keim became the GM. Well, really 0 since he got moved to ILB for some reason. I don’t think that should prevent us from drafting one in the first this year.

The caveat being a guy like Jermaine Johnson or Drake Jackson being there at #23. If they are both gone and you see a good CB on the board then that should be the pick.

 

[Stout]

I think it's pretty clear that Keim faces a very, very challenging off-season.

It's time to put up, or shut up for Keim, Kingsbury, and Joseph. It's not hard to imagine all three unemployed by the end of next season.

It will be immensely challenging, so he should not get a chance to run it. He has been giving many years to put up or shut up, and you hear nary a peep out of him.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You guys have hit on the major flaw in Keim’s draft; the cap impact. Successful teams tend to succeed because impact draft picks are affordable and leave cap space to target critical free agents. Keim has drafted medium quality picks which means there isn’t typically enough cap space to fill critical needs.

When Ouchie says he wants a round 1 WR, he would be committing the Cards to signing a FA edge. That is unless you think the Cards can win without a pass rush. He mentions Golden, who is far from a dominant rusher and a weak run defender. Keep in mind he wanted to play for the Cards, a rare occurrence. I’m sure the Cards could get a good receiver either via trade or FA. I’m not sure they could sign one of the few decent edges available. There are always receivers to be had.

To be fair, I clearly said I wanted receiver, passrusher, or olinemen in no particular order.

I also think your post here completely misrepresents my point. My point is I don’t think it’s any more or less possible to get a top player at any position other than QB using trades or free agency. I don’t think the position matters much as I indicated naming top end players that were available via trade. So what’s the difference if we trade for hop or a Mack or a Trent Williams to get top talent at that position? I brought up golden to point out that you can get a mid-level passrusher via free agency the same way you can get a mid-level receiver (say an AJ Green) in free agency. They are equivalent players. If you want to prove otherwise let’s see some examples.

 

[Ohcrap75]

Georgia intentionally took him out on 3rd down because his job was to stop the run on 1st and 2nd down. Saban came out publicly and admitted as such. Not because of conditioning.

Some sites have him rated as high as a top 10 prospect. Picking him up at 23 isn't exactly a reach.

Besides, not being able to play on 3rd down is pointless if the Cards can't stop the run on 1st and 2nd. In the past few weeks, teams aren't even GETTING to 3rd down against our defense.

Saban wasn’t his coach

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Saban wasn’t his coach

You are right.