Somers on Fitz/Cards 3/7

[ajcardfan]

Cards, Fitzgerald near crossroads
Kent Somers
The Arizona Republic
Mar. 7, 2008 12:00 AM

Larry Fitzgerald says he doesn't want to leave Arizona. The Cardinals say they don't want him to go.

That, however, is an awful small plot of common ground in negotiations between two sides that seem to agree on little else.

The restructuring of Fitzgerald's contract appears no closer to fruition than it was a month ago, and the rumblings of frustration are growing within the organization.





Without a contract agreement, a day of reckoning is coming for the Cardinals.

They are going to face the prospect of trading Fitzgerald or losing him a year from now, when they might have to cut him rather than pay his 2009 salary of $17.4 million.

So far, both sides are saying all the right things. The Cardinals insist Fitzgerald will play for them in 2008, even at a salary of $14.6 million. Fitzgerald's agent, Eugene Parker, said team officials have reassured him that Fitzgerald is going nowhere, even if a new deal isn't reached.

That hasn't prevented other teams from trying to trade for him. The Eagles have talked to the Cardinals about acquiring Fitzgerald, with cornerback Lito Sheppard and receiver Reggie Brown rumored to be part of the offer.

The Cardinals have little interest in either player, and they are not eager to part with Fitzgerald, who made two Pro Bowls in his first four seasons.

Sheppard also has been to the Pro Bowl twice, but there are questions about his durability and he's unhappy with his contract. The Cardinals aren't eager to trade for someone else's problem.

It's hard to tell what would pique the Cardinals' interest at this point. Their primary desire is to keep Fitzgerald for several more years, even though that would cost them dearly.

But they've known for years that they could face this situation. It's the price teams pay for picking high in the draft. Fitzgerald was the third overall pick in 2004, and he signed a deal laden with incentives that would pay him handsomely if he became an elite player.

Included in that rookie contract were clauses that would bump his 2008 salary by $10 million should he chosen for two Pro Bowls in his first four years, and by $11 million in 2009 for other achievements.

Those clauses were designed to get the two parties back to the bargaining table after four years. Now, Parker is seeking another four-year deal that would pay Fitzgerald between $25 million and $30 million in guarantees.

Parker's motive is to get Fitzgerald, 24, a third lucrative contract before the receiver turns 30.

The Cardinals would prefer six years at a similar level of guaranteed money, because they abhor the idea of going through all of this again in three or four years.

Fitzgerald holds most of the leverage in negotiations, although the Cardinals are trying to appeal to his professed desire to win.

If Fitzgerald is serious about that, team officials say he should accept a restructuring, creating additional cap space that would allow to team to attract free agents and to keep key players.

Parker won't address the Cardinals cap concerns directly, but Fitzgerald said in a recent radio interview that he doesn't think his present contract prevents the Cardinals from being active in free agency.

The impact of the Fitzgerald situation reverberates throughout the organization. It calls into question Fitzgerald's sincerity and commitment to winning, Rod Graves' acumen as a general manager and owner Bill Bidwill's willingness to write a check with a lot of numbers to the left of the decimal point.

The answers to at least some of those questions will come in the next few weeks.

 

[imaCafan]

So why not give him a 4 year deal, $28 million SB and salaries of 1.5, 2.5, 4 and 8 million. Deal is 4 years, $42 million. Cap hit this year $8.5 million. Now what is wrong with something similar to that? Then space would be freed up to sign, ummm, errrr, uhhhh, well I'm sure someone's out there, like maybe Naole? I know, we'd be doing this all over again in 4 years, but a good GM aught to be able to handle that, don't ya think????

 

[football karma]

"The Cardinals have little interest in either player, and they are not eager to part with Fitzgerald, who made two Pro Bowls in his first four seasons.

Sheppard also has been to the Pro Bowl twice, but there are questions about his durability and he's unhappy with his contract. The Cardinals aren't eager to trade for someone else's problem."

most interesting part of the whole deal

 

[Stout]

That hasn't prevented other teams from trying to trade for him. The Eagles have talked to the Cardinals about acquiring Fitzgerald, with cornerback Lito Sheppard and receiver Reggie Brown rumored to be part of the offer.

Parker won't address the Cardinals cap concerns directly, but Fitzgerald said in a recent radio interview that he doesn't think his present contract prevents the Cardinals from being active in free agency.

First off, if the Eagles are ponying up Brown and Sheppard, and are willing to add their first, we should do it. Brown makes a nice 2nd receiver, we'd be set at CB, and we'd be stacked in the draft.

Second, Fitz is either incredibly stupid or he's purposefully lying to try to look better. I haven't become embroiled in this 'he said, she said' situation, but come on. Fitz doesn't think he's keeping the Cards from being active in FA? With a nearly 17 million dollar cap hit? What a jerk. If you don't want to admit your contract is a problem for the team then DON'T COMMENT.

 

[joko4]

It has always boiled down to, you cannot afford to keep two all pro medium speed wr's. Obviously, we our now on countdown on which one stays and who goes. Who do you want?
How old is Q?

 

[stewdog1]

These rookie contracts need to be redone in the next collective bargaining agreement. It needs to be fixed ASAP.

 

[football karma]

First off, if the Eagles are ponying up Brown and Sheppard, and are willing to add their first, we should do it. Brown makes a nice 2nd receiver, we'd be set at CB, and we'd be stacked in the draft.

I dont know Stout

I have posted my concerns about Sheppard elsewhere -- but they apply to Brown as well --

Clearly the Eagles have concluded that Brown and Sheppard arent Championship contending pieces -- if they were, why would they spend the offseason paying huge dollars to upgrade both positions?

The Eagles are trying to pawn off spare pieces to get a guy who is one of the best at his position, and potentially could get better over the next four years.

IMO, if the Cards do the trade they should get draft picks and several of them.

 

[DaisyCutter]

First off, if the Eagles are ponying up Brown and Sheppard, and are willing to add their first, we should do it. Brown makes a nice 2nd receiver, we'd be set at CB, and we'd be stacked in the draft.

Second, Fitz is either incredibly stupid or he's purposefully lying to try to look better. I haven't become embroiled in this 'he said, she said' situation, but come on. Fitz doesn't think he's keeping the Cards from being active in FA? With a nearly 17 million dollar cap hit? What a jerk. If you don't want to admit your contract is a problem for the team then DON'T COMMENT.

The Cards weren't going to go after the FAs that you wanted, anyway, Stout. His salary might have kept them from being active in FA they way that you wanted, but it didn't keep them from being active in FA the way THEY wanted.

If the Cards want a longer contract, then they need to up the guaranteed money. $35 million guaranteed on a six-year contract would probably get it done. But they can't decide on guaranteed money and then say, "Well, we're going to want to tack on two more years on this deal. Hope that's okay."

This is the second time that a local paper has backhandedly questioned the "acumen" of Rod Graves. We haven't seen that before.

 

[football karma]

This is the second time that a local paper has backhandedly questioned the "acumen" of Rod Graves. We haven't seen that before.

you know, a really top notch GM would have dealt with this prior to this offseason.

Last year would have been the time to deal with it. Prior to Larry earning the extra $5mm in salary. Three years of uncertainty on injury, etc. The leverage would have been much more equal.

Its a little 20/20 hindsight, but at the same time, per Denny's quote -- they knew the day they signed the deal that there was a decent possibility that years 4 and 5 of his deal would be cap killers.

As of last offseason, Larry had already made the Pro Bowl once. Once a player gets there once, going again is much, much more likely.

 

[DaisyCutter]

you know, a really top notch GM would have dealt with this prior to this offseason.

Last year would have been the time to deal with it. Prior to Larry earning the extra $5mm in salary. Three years of uncertainty on injury, etc. The leverage would have been much more equal.

Its a little 20/20 hindsight, but at the same time, per Denny's quote -- they knew the day they signed the deal that there was a decent possibility that years 4 and 5 of his deal would be cap killers.

As of last offseason, Larry had already made the Pro Bowl once. Once a player gets there once, going again is much, much more likely.

I really don't worry about all of that this much. It's pretty much water under the bridge, and not worth revisiting. But.

For a long time the local papers mainly just accepted Rod Graves' management of the team as a fait accompli. They liked him as a person, and were able to give him the benefit of the doubt (IMO). But read the Bordow article from last week again, and then look at stuff at the end of this one.

Maybe it's because Graves is finally carrying the GM tag, and has to take the heat that comes with it. But Rod Graves has never been under the scrutiny in the press that he's gotten on this board. The Bordow article said "Don't blame the Cards," but if you read it, it seemed to say "Blame Graves". It was just interesting to see.

 

[studiovx]

"Parker's motive is to get Fitzgerald, 24, a third lucrative contract before the receiver turns 30. "

"The Cardinals would prefer six years at a similar level of guaranteed money, because they abhor the idea of going through all of this again in three or four years."

"Fitzgerald holds most of the leverage in negotiations, although the Cardinals are trying to appeal to his professed desire to win "(which is lame – the Cards professed to trying to win for years – They never split from their "principles" – Shoe’s on the other foot now).

"If Fitzgerald is serious about that, team officials say he should accept a restructuring, creating additional cap space that would allow to team to attract free agents and to keep key players."
(which is lame – the Cards professed to trying to win for years – They never split from their "principles" – Shoe’s on the other foot now).

"Parker won't address the Cardinals cap concerns directly, but Fitzgerald said in a recent radio interview that he doesn't think his present contract prevents the Cardinals from being active in free agency".(Who’s he kidding?!)

"The impact of the Fitzgerald situation reverberates throughout the organization. It calls into question Fitzgerald's sincerity and commitment to winning" (Yes) "Rod Graves' acumen as a general manager " (Yes) "and owner Bill Bidwill's willingness to write a check with a lot of numbers to the left of the decimal point" (It’s BS to make this one about Bidwill. He’s willing to make the guy the highest paid receiver in the league).

A friend of mine had another take on it which may be partially true. If they had not shot themselves in the foot in SOOOO many games last season, made the playoffs with the schedule they had and gotten a sniff, perhaps people would be falling over themselves to restructure.

 

[jl1]

First off, if the Eagles are ponying up Brown and Sheppard, and are willing to add their first, we should do it. Brown makes a nice 2nd receiver, we'd be set at CB, and we'd be stacked in the draft.

Second, Fitz is either incredibly stupid or he's purposefully lying to try to look better. I haven't become embroiled in this 'he said, she said' situation, but come on. Fitz doesn't think he's keeping the Cards from being active in FA? With a nearly 17 million dollar cap hit? What a jerk. If you don't want to admit your contract is a problem for the team then DON'T COMMENT.

LMAO. The Eagles will not be giving up a Pro Bowl cornerback, a 1st round pick and a starting WR for Fitzgerald. I love the over inflated value fans of teams put on their players. There is very little likelihood that any deal the Eagles have proposed includes Reggie Brown - they would take an $8m cap hit from such a deal and then would add on whatever salary for Fitzgerald. Unlike other teams, they don't abuse their cap like that.

The reason why they went after Samuel was to give them flexibility to make a deal to get a top WR. If they would have been able to snag Moss though, they would have happily kept Sheppard.

 

[slanidrac16]

So why not give him a 4 year deal, $28 million SB and salaries of 1.5, 2.5, 4 and 8 million. Deal is 4 years, $42 million. Cap hit this year $8.5 million. Now what is wrong with something similar to that? Then space would be freed up to sign, ummm, errrr, uhhhh, well I'm sure someone's out there, like maybe Naole? I know, we'd be doing this all over again in 4 years, but a good GM aught to be able to handle that, don't ya think????

The problem with your scenario is this. Fitz will make 30m plus over the next 2 years. So basically your proposal would pay him 12m over the last 2 years, not enough with the position Fitz is in.
Even if he plays this year for the 16m and renegotiates next year He would make around 40m in guarantees (2008 salary and new contract signing bonus).

I think for this to get done the Cards are going to have to come up with about 30 to 35 m guarantees on a 5 year deal. Add a base salary of 1,1,2,3,9mil. Botttom line 5 years 51 mil with 35 guaranteeed.
Cap hit:
2008-8m
09---8m
10---9m
11---10m
12---14m at which time he gets cut , traded or renegotiates a new deal.

Looks like a lot , but but 2010 it will be very reasonable if he is playing at the same level of performance.

Down side? Fitz signs a new contract , suffers a career ending injury and the Cards eat 7m of dead cap space for the next 5 years.

Thus, the problem.

 

[Mulli]

Who cares if you have to go through it again in a few years? This is professional sports, that is what teams and players do these days.

 

[DaisyCutter]

A friend of mine had another take on it which may be partially true. If they had not shot themselves in the foot in SOOOO many games last season, made the playoffs with the schedule they had and gotten a sniff, perhaps people would be falling over themselves to restructure.

I think there's a lot of that there. I think that if Fitz actually believed that Graves would be smart with the money, he'd give up some of it. But I think it's harder to say that when Graves largely mismanaged the Cap last season, which probably ended up in the Cards missing the playoffs.

I believe Fitz when he says that he'd like to help the team, but it's hard to say that he trusts the guy who purportedly would be doing the roster improvements.

 

[DaisyCutter]

The problem with your scenario is this. Fitz will make 30m plus over the next 2 years. So basically your proposal would pay him 12m over the last 2 years, not enough with the position Fitz is in.
Even if he plays this year for the 16m and renegotiates next year He would make around 40m in guarantees (2008 salary and new contract signing bonus).

I think for this to get done the Cards are going to have to come up with about 30 to 35 m guarantees on a 5 year deal. Add a base salary of 1,1,2,3,9mil. Botttom line 5 years 51 mil with 35 guaranteeed.
Cap hit:
2008-8m
09---8m
10---9m
11---10m
12---14m at which time he gets cut , traded or renegotiates a new deal.

Looks like a lot , but but 2010 it will be very reasonable if he is playing at the same level of performance.

Down side? Fitz signs a new contract , suffers a career ending injury and the Cards eat 7m of dead cap space for the next 5 years.

Thus, the problem.

I don't think you need to even cut it that fine. The Cards are kind of stuck with Fitz's contract number in 2008. There's no one that they're going to sign that they're going to need an extra $6 million in cap space to cover. I think that when Fitz gets re-negotiated, he'll get an $8-10 million roster bonus for 2008, but then his cap number will quickly reduce in 2009-2011 (or whenever). It's a good idea to move as much money into this season as possible, because there's not much out there that you can use to improve your team at this point.

 

[Skkorpion]

This was a good article by Kent Somers and was clearly labelled "Analysis" or "Opinion," don't remember which, in the paper this morning.

In the end, if Fitz does not wish to be here, for whatever reason, we'll just have to deal with it and trade him this year or next.

 

[NuttinButTDs]

From PFT - for what it is worth

.....
Somers also writes that Fitzgerald's agent, Eugene Parker, presently is pushing for a four-year deal that would pay Fitzgerald between $25 million and $30 million in guaranteed money.

Given that the Cardinals have created a situation in which Fitzgerald is due to make more than $31 million over the next two seasons, his willingness to take guaranteed money south of $30 million represents a significant concession, on the surface. But to tie that kind of money to a four-year contract creates a huge per-year load on the salary cap, making it not much different than a six-year deal with $37 million to $45 million in guaranteed money.

In this situation the true motives of the various parties will only be discerned by scrutinizing the details. Is this about Fitzgerald being fair, or is it about the player and his agent turning the screws on an organization that gambled and lost regarding the huge-money escalators that Fitzgerald's performance has triggered?

By asking for a four-year deal with that much money guaranteed, we're starting to think it's the latter.

There has been speculation and rumor about a trade that would send Fitzgerald to the Eagles. Though the Cardinals by all appearances have demanded too much in return for Fitzgerald, the team is in a real bind on this one.

To be sure, it's a mess that the team created. And whether Fitzgerald does anything aimed at genuinely helping the team get out of this situation will be proof positive on whether his image of being a team-first guy is real, or whether it's a bunch of self-serving Eddie Haskell bullcrap.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

So why not give him a 4 year deal, $28 million SB and salaries of 1.5, 2.5, 4 and 8 million. Deal is 4 years, $42 million. Cap hit this year $8.5 million. Now what is wrong with something similar to that? Then space would be freed up to sign, ummm, errrr, uhhhh, well I'm sure someone's out there, like maybe Naole? I know, we'd be doing this all over again in 4 years, but a good GM aught to be able to handle that, don't ya think????

I second that.

Why not give him the 4 year deal? In four years a lot can happen. In four years we could be in a better situation to be a run first type team. In four years Leinart might be good enough to carry the passing attack by his own.

That is wierd that the Cardinals need to have Fitzgerald for 7 years. Why agree on a 4 year contract and get back to this situation four years from now?

Strange.

BTW: Stop smiling abomb.

 

[jmt]

The economy lost 63,000 jobs last month, the most in five years, and we are debating whether Fitz is worth $10-15 million a year!?! Let's just enjoy the spring. . .

 

[joeshmo]

I second that.

Why not give him the 4 year deal? In four years a lot can happen. In four years we could be in a better situation to be a run first type team. In four years Leinart might be good enough to carry the passing attack by his own.

That is wierd that the Cardinals need to have Fitzgerald for 7 years. Why agree on a 4 year contract and get back to this situation four years from now?

Plus not to mention in 4 years there is either going to be a lock out in 2010 or a new CBA which will again raise the cap considerably and make the supposed cap hit the last year or two not that big of a deal anyways.

We are just going to have to concede to the 4 year deal I think. If we do I think that Parker will concede on some of the money and/or structure concidering he will be getting his wish for yet another contract before the age of 29 under a new larger CBA.

 

[Lomax to Green 84]

Plus not to mention in 4 years there is either going to be a lock out in 2010 or a new CBA which will again raise the cap considerably and make the supposed cap hit the last year or two not that big of a deal anyways.

We are just going to have to concede to the 4 year deal I think. If we do I think that Parker will concede on some of the money and/or structure concidering he will be getting his wish for yet another contract before the age of 29 under a new larger CBA.

But don't we have to consider what message this sends to other stars on this team? What is Drew Rosenhaus going to say next offseason when he wants more money for Anquan Boldin? I just think the team needs to take a stand and if it isn't working with Fitz, he needs to be moved. No team in the NFL can handle two mega contacts at the same position and that is what we are heading toward if the Cards cave on Fitz.

I love Fitzgerald, but this is crazy. Boldin and Fitz are great, but how great? I want to see more wins than losses before committing that ridiculous amount of money to anyone on this team. I don't care who they are or what position they play.

 

[slanidrac16]

I'm getting to the point where I just don't give a rats butt anymore. He is here this year and I'm not going to worry about 2009 until this time next year.
One of three things are going to happen.
1. Nothing. Fitz gets paid what he gets paid. Most probable.
2. The 2 parties agree to an extension and everybody is happy. Not as probable.
3. He gets traded. Least probable and VERY unlikely.

I'm moving on.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'm getting to the point where I just don't give a rats butt anymore. He is here this year and I'm not going to worry about 2009 until this time next year.
One of three things are going to happen.
1. Nothing. Fitz gets paid what he gets paid. Most probable.
2. The 2 parties agree to an extension and everybody is happy. Not as probable.
3. He gets traded. Least probable and VERY unlikely.

I'm moving on.

I know people in your shoes. They just don't come into the Cards forum anymore. Its too much.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

But don't we have to consider what message this sends to other stars on this team? What is Drew Rosenhaus going to say next offseason when he wants more money for Anquan Boldin? I just think the team needs to take a stand and if it isn't working with Fitz, he needs to be moved. No team in the NFL can handle two mega contacts at the same position and that is what we are heading toward if the Cards cave on Fitz.

I love Fitzgerald, but this is crazy. Boldin and Fitz are great, but how great? I want to see more wins than losses before committing that ridiculous amount of money to anyone on this team. I don't care who they are or what position they play.

Those are great points, and good post. A post that I agree with.

What I have in bold I want to comment on:

I think it is safe to assume that every NFL team in the league has those concerns. We you pay one guy this, the others on the team see it, and thus we it is their time for a pay raise it comes into question.

But as I said ALL NFL teams have this problem. As much as I hate to say it, Graves (*shudder*) will have to deal with this situation (Boldin's) no matter what happens with Fitzgerald.

It will happen when we pay Dansby, it will happen when it is time to redo Lutui's deal, etc., etc.

The Cardinals must always keep in mind the ripple effect each signing causes, but in the same breath they must understand that this is the way it goes in the NFL. Especially if you want to start playing with the "Big Boys"

ASUDude has a great post on why the Fitzgerald is "out of the norm" numbers wise, and it must be abnormal since it is front page material on NFL.com

But what you gonna do? It is a catch 22 situation.

I have written above that a four year deal should be fine when dealing with Fitzgerald. If the Cardinals haven't made a push for a ring in the next four years it is not going to happen with this current era of players. Thus it would be a good time for Fitzgerald to move on anyway. I can live with letting a 29 year old Fitzgerald go. The 4 years we get out of him now will be PRIME years too.