SportingNews.com: Suns Sign Dragic

[AceP]

There r something u can tell about a player pretty accurately in workout, while something else u can never find out unless put him in real action.

For the least, defence is one thing we can have fate on Dragic. He is physically gifted and mentally tough plus committed in defence. In real action, he had excellent performance guarding Tony Parker in European Championship.

No matter how good he already is, playmaking is a tough thing to grasp in NBA for European players. I hope Nash can guide him through that.

 

[shazaam6]

When I hear Kerr say "we like Dragic and are working hard to get him over here this year." Now it looks like they are willing to pay luxury tax to get it done. Something they seemed reluctant to do. I am excited that they like the guy enough to do this to get him, so I think, they think, he will fit well with the team.

I think your comments, which are all facts; late second rounder that no one else seemed to talk about, plays back-up for his current team so why get so excited etc.. sound negative in that context.

I get your point. I'm hoping Kerr is right. Sounds like you don't give Kerr's opinions as much weight as I do maybe.

After watching Nash not have a reliable back up for four years, I am not too particular who they sign as much as they better sign someone. Getting a guy they target as maybe replacing Nash in a few years, gets me even more interested in him.

 

[Cheesebeef]

When I hear Kerr say "we like Dragic and are working hard to get him over here this year." Now it looks like they are willing to pay luxury tax to get it done. Something they seemed reluctant to do. I am excited that they like the guy enough to do this to get him, so I think, they think, he will fit well with the team.

I think your comments, which are all facts; late second rounder that no one else seemed to talk about, plays back-up for his current team so why get so excited etc.. sound negative in that context.

I get your point. I'm hoping Kerr is right. Sounds like you don't give Kerr's opinions as much weight as I do maybe.

i think your last sentence accurately sums up the reason for the difference in excitement between the two us (and between me and probably a majority of the board). But don't get me wrong, I'm certainly hope Kerr's right, but my expectations are just really muted for this team and it's decisions at this point.

 

[arwillan]

There r something u can tell about a player pretty accurately in workout, while something else u can never find out unless put him in real action.

For the least, defence is one thing we can have fate on Dragic. He is physically gifted and mentally tough plus committed in defence. In real action, he had excellent performance guarding Tony Parker in European Championship.

No matter how good he already is, playmaking is a tough thing to grasp in NBA for European players. I hope Nash can guide him through that.

One defensive performance on parker doesn't make a good defender any good. Diaw guarded him well for a game. One game is one game.

 

[AceP]

One defensive performance on parker doesn't make a good defender any good. Diaw guarded him well for a game. One game is one game.

I have to agree with u on that. Put all hope on Dragic to fill the backup PG role is risky, and unwise. But obviously we r back to the budget issue ...

 

[shazaam6]

i think your last sentence accurately sums up the reason for the difference in excitement between the two us (and between me and probably a majority of the board). But don't get me wrong, I'm certainly hope Kerr's right, but my expectations are just really muted for this team and it's decisions at this point.

You are saving your emotional energy. I understand.
I am getting on the Suns hype rollercoaster early yet again. One of these times it will be the right one.

I was on the Diamondbacks coaster during the championship season and for them to win it all when I was following them from very early that particular year. I was into the day to day hitting streaks and HR's etc . Randy Johnson and Curt Shilling winning almost every game. Hoping they would keep winning. And they did through 9/11. It was so sweet, Gonzo's hit against their impossible to hit, closer when it looked like we would lose. Championships are unbelievable.

Suns are due now. They have the guys to do it.

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[dodie53]

i hope Dragic is the NBA live 09 for the PSP

 

[Cheesebeef]

You are saving your emotional energy. I understand.
I am getting on the Suns hype rollercoaster early yet again. One of these times it will be the right one.

I was on the Diamondbacks coaster during the championship season and for them to win it all when I was following them from very early that particular year. I was into the day to day hitting streaks and HR's etc . Randy Johnson and Curt Shilling winning almost every game. Hoping they would keep winning. And they did through 9/11. It was so sweet, Gonzo's hit against their impossible to hit, closer when it looked like we would lose. Championships are unbelievable.

I was at every home game of the World Series. No one needs to tell me how incredible that feeling was. That team gave me reason to believe though. They spent as much money as they could and had the two most dominating pitchers in the game. This team cares more about the almighty dollar and has gotten old... and that happened a year ago. Now, we're even older and more injury prone. IMO, "due" has nothing to do with what's gonna happen.

 

[shazaam6]

You sound much more positive now.

 

[mojorizen7]

I don't think it's as much about Dragic the player as it is about signing a backup PG.

Exactly. Its a possibilty that Dragic is the PG of the future here. He may wind up a bust but it's possible that he could turn out to be Nashs' heir apparent or at least a solid starter for a long time.
Was Tyrone Lue the future? No.
Was Jason Williams the future? No.
Was Chris Duhon the future? Maybe but probably not.
Like Cheesebeef said...the SUNS are old and tired.
Its time to rely on young unproven kids to contribute IMO.
The title window is shut IMO. Its much easier for me to get excited about a kid like Dragic at backup point than an old veteran bricklayer like Williams or a mighty mouse guy like Lue who we know doesn't do a whole lot for ya.
If we don't start taking chances with younger talent where is this team gonna be in 3 yrs?
All the cap space in the world isn't going to buy us a championship caliber starting 5 if we dont start to at least build something now.

 

[leclerc]

I think he got drafted so low mostly because of the contract situation and lack of workouts in the U.S., and I'm willing to bet he gets more PT than the low 1st round PGs on their rookie contracts.

There's many 2nd rounders who turned out great so I don't worry about it. Didn't someone also say it was a very good rookie crop this year?

I'd be really excited if we got him signed.

 

[Irish]

I think he got drafted so low mostly because of the contract situation and lack of workouts in the U.S., and I'm willing to bet he gets more PT than the low 1st round PGs on their rookie contracts.

There's many 2nd rounders who turned out great so I don't worry about it. Didn't someone also say it was a very good rookie crop this year?

I'd be really excited if we got him signed.

NBA history is simply loaded with examples of great players who were generally overlooked. This year's USA team has two guys taken in the second round. Clearly the Suns were convinced that SOMEBODY was going to figure out what Dragic had to offer and were shopping the entire first half of the 2nd round to move up.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Goran-Dragic-1025/

AT A GLANCE - Goran Dragic

Strengths:

• Excellent size for PG
• Left-handed
• Solid athlete (especially for European prospect)
• Quick first step
• Toughness
• Can create own shot
• Finishing around basket
• Solid perimeter defender
• Ability to defend both guard spots
• Gets team extra possessions
• Excellent in passing lanes
• High-level European experience

2008 Reebok Eurocamp in Treviso, Days Three and Four
June 10, 2008
- Like Batum, Dragic made a lone appearance here in Treviso after finishing off his regular season in Slovenia. In his one game, he managed to leave a very strong impression, one that could very well have pushed his name back into the second round, possibly into the mid-portion of it even.

Dragic played spectacular defense on whoever he was guarding, mainly Rudy Mbemba, who’s terrific speed did not faze him in the least bit. He got right into his man’s grill on every possession of the game, fighting through screens admirably, showing excellent length and lateral quickness, and getting his hands on countless number of balls. It got to the point that players were just afraid to put the ball on the floor when Dragic was in the vicinity, as more often than not he would find a way to poke it away and bust up plays. He got his team into transition time after time, and made very good decisions once there, finishing strong and intelligently around the basket and getting to the line seven times.

As a point guard, Dragic did a better job than we anticipated based on the up and down season he had. He showed a lot more creativity than we’ve given him credit for in the past, making good reads and finding cutters slashing to the rim or shooters spotting up on the wing after slashing to the basket himself.

From what I can tell, he was viewed as just an average player up to about a year ago. His overall game improved dramatically, but not everyone noticed. What the Suns found (or think they found) was that his ball handling and shooting was underrated. It is my understanding that they looked at videos of all his games.

Could the Suns have been "fooled"? You would think that Kerr, who played with some of the finest PG's in the NBA and Porter who was once one of the finest to ever play the position, could spot a guy who can't play. They certainly are clear that Barbosa is not really a PG and don't sugar coat how far Strawberry is from being ready to be a PG.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Could the Suns have been "fooled"? You would think that Kerr, who played with some of the finest PG's in the NBA and Porter who was once one of the finest to ever play the position, could spot a guy who can't play.

uh, who were the some of the "finest PGs in the NBA" Kerr played with? Avery Johnson? I don't think i've ever heard anyone claim he was one of the finest PGs in the NBA. Hell, most of his career, people claimed he was the weak link in Spurs teams that consistently underachieved. He won a title in a complete sham of a year, but never came close at any other time in his otherwise pedestrian career. A rookie Tony Parker who was routinely benched in favor of Speedy Claxton? Uh, absolutely no one on the four Bulls teams he played on? A completely over the hill Porter on the Spurs? I guess he played with Mark Price who was a good PG, but one of the finest in the NBA? That's a bit of a stretch and the "Terry Porter was once one of the finest to ever play the position" comment is just... well, Georgian. Porter was a good PG, but holy cow is that statement seemingly way over the top.

Even if Kerr had played with some of the all-time greats at PG (which he never did), that doesn't mean he automatically knows how to spot talent.

 

[nowagimp]

uh, who were the some of the "finest PGs in the NBA" Kerr played with? Avery Johnson? I don't think i've ever heard anyone claim he was one of the finest PGs in the NBA. Hell, most of his career, people claimed he was the weak link in Spurs teams that consistently underachieved. He won a title in a complete sham of a year, but never came close at any other time in his otherwise pedestrian career. A rookie Tony Parker who was routinely benched in favor of Speedy Claxton? Uh, absolutely no one on the four Bulls teams he played on? A completely over the hill Porter on the Spurs? I guess he played with Mark Price who was a good PG, but one of the finest in the NBA? That's a bit of a stretch and the "Terry Porter was once one of the finest to ever play the position" comment is just... well, Georgian. Porter was a good PG, but holy cow is that statement seemingly way over the top.

Even if Kerr had played with some of the all-time greats at PG (which he never did), that doesn't mean he automatically knows how to spot talent.

Yeah cheese, that torpedo hit the boiler room, USS Irish sinking fast. I suppose he was relying on his memory for the "Kerr played with great PG's statement".

 

[scXfreakX]

Well, I don't even know what to believe. This is such a back and forth topic that I'm starting to feel dizzy. Anyways, I feel that this is definitely good to get him signed earlier if we plan on making him the future PG which it obviously seems will be the case. However, whether he is NBA ready yet is a whole different story. Relying on a 22 year old foreign PG with no NBA experience as a backup PG will be difficult, but having a lot of veterans on this team is definitely a helping factor.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's not how much you pay the player but how good is the player. Where he is selected in the draft does not make a bit of difference unless one is getting into talking about the probability of success.

Pervis Ellison anyone?

 

[jandaman]

Happy bout this!

I think Dragic has the potential to be Udrih-level (last season version) straight away with minutes.

And be a legit bench threath by his second season... and beyond that?.

Who knows.

 

[Irish]

I never could figure out if Michael Jordan or Scotty Pippen was "really" the point guard with the Bulls. Like it really matters.

How good was Porter? From 1996 97 to 1990-91 he averaged over 8 assists per game and is still the all time Blazer assist leader. He was a career 38.3% three point shooter and averaged over 39.5% his last five seasons. He was a career 12.2 ppg scorer but much higher in his Blazer period where he took his team to the Finals twice and was twice selected to the All Star team.

One of the all time greatest? Perhaps not, but he was an outstanding play maker, shooter, and leader. Here is from a piece dated Aug 6, 2008

http://www.blazersedge.com/2008/8/6/588375/the-2008-schedule-honors-t

To refresh, on June 4 we talked with then-COO Mike Golub who informed Blazersedge that upper management was seriously discussing Terry Porter's jersey retirement.

Quoteth Golub:

We are looking very hard at that. And we're trying to decide the right time, but absolutely. Terry is one of the greatest Trail Blazers both on and off the court, he is just a total class act, one of the best to ever wear the uniform. Yes, we agree with that sentiment very strongly and we are talking about it really seriously. We are trying to figure out when is the right time to act on it.
​

He also noted that retiring a player's jersey...

...is about doing the right thing and creating a special night for the people involved and for the fans and I think our fans want to see special things. They want to see a new drama every day, they want to see a new story unfold.
​

 

[Cheesebeef]

I never could figure out if Michael Jordan or Scotty Pippen was "really" the point guard with the Bulls. Like it really matters.

so Kerr learned a lot about PGs by playing with guys who played in a system specifically designed to be PG-less system, while no one would ever say either one of them were PGs? That's not to say they didn't create offense, but to say Kerr could know if Dragic could play PG or not partly because he played with Pippen and Jordan just seems, well, completely out of left field.

How good was Porter? From 1996 97 to 1990-91 he averaged over 8 assists per game and is still the all time Blazer assist leader. He was a career 38.3% three point shooter and averaged over 39.5% his last five seasons. He was a career 12.2 ppg scorer but much higher in his Blazer period where he took his team to the Finals twice and was twice selected to the All Star team.

One of the all time greatest? Perhaps not, but he was an outstanding play maker, shooter, and leader... TEN YEARS PRIOR TO KERR PLAYING WITH HIM

there ya go George. That makes your comment accurate in regards to the great PGs Kerr played with. Yes, he played with Porter, who was a very good PG a full decade before Kerr ever played with him and was a complete and utter non-factor by the time he did play with him. I'm sure he learned a lot from watching him on the bench for the most part.

"Perhaps not"? Oye gevault.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Kevin Johnson is potentially a hall of fame pg.
Mark Price was considered one of the best pg's in the league in his day.
Ron Harper, one of the most underrated players of all time (imo) played pg for the Bulls.
Avery Johnson--I didn't think he was that great, but he set others up to be great.
Terry Porter was a fantastic pg. He was a leader, scored in a timely fashion, was incredibly tough and played great D.

Thats a pretty good list of pg's right there.

Maybe a little overstatement, but not much.

 

[cly2tw]

Is Dragic signed or not?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Kevin Johnson is potentially a hall of fame pg.

no he's not. But he was a very good PG who Kerr got almost no time whatsoever playing with due to injuries (limiting him to just 26 games the only year he played with him) and the fact that Kerr never saw the light of day really even when he was healthy.

Mark Price was considered one of the best pg's in the league in his day.

I gave Mark Price his due. He was a very good PG and Kerr actually got a little more playing time on his team. But still, one of the finest in the NBA? Like I said, a little bit of a stretch, but I can bend a little on this one. So, there's ONE.

Ron Harper, one of the most underrated players of all time (imo) played pg for the Bulls.

No one played PG for the Bulls because there is no PG position in the triangle. Honestly, if you think Kerr learned a lot from watching Harper play the point, well, I don't know what to tell you.

Avery Johnson--I didn't think he was that great, but he set others up to be great.

he was a mediocre PG who played on a bajillion teams.

Terry Porter was a fantastic pg. He was a leader, scored in a timely fashion, was incredibly tough and played great D.

too bad Kerr never played with that Terry Porter (the Porter of the mid-80's to early 90's), or are you telling me that the 37 year-old Porter that Kerr played with was the same Terry Porter who was all those things you listed above. And even in his heyday, calling Porter one of "the finest to ever play the game" is just beyond ridiculous.

Thats a pretty good list of pg's right there.

Maybe a little overstatement, but not much.

that's basically Kerr playing with Mark Price and a bunch of has-beens(37 year-old Porter) and average PGs (career journeyman Avery Johnson) and never-were (a broken down Ron Harper as a "PG"). If you consider that a pretty good list of of PGs, I don't know what to tell you.

 

[mojorizen7]

Why does Kerr have to have played alongside HOF PG's in order to justify his eye for talent?
Or is this just a personal credibility attack on a fellow SUNS fan?
Sheesh Cheese, give Irish a break why don't you. Whats your agenda here?

 

[shazaam6]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Kerr

What could Kerr possibly know about NBA talent and Championships...

 

[Joe Mama]

i hope Dragic is the NBA live 09 for the PSP

Any roster changes will update immediately in the game as long as you are able to connect to the Internet.

The reason I want them to get Dragic in a Phoenix Suns uniform this season is that I don't want him to have a good season in Europe. I don't want the Phoenix Suns to get into a bidding war. I would like the Phoenix Suns to get him under contract for a few years.

I don't know if he'll ever be as good as they think he will. I would be perfectly happy if he was a solid backup. Even if he's a mild contributor I wouldn't consider him a bust.

Joe