Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Episode VII)

[Dback Jon]

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Using a Star Trek pic on a Star Wars thread reminds me of this pic I saw yesterday:

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[PortlandCardFan]

I ask..why not? A ton of time has passed since the last film and it's logical they would have upgraded their equipment. I think it would incredibly stupid to use the old models and I would doubt the could hold onto the galaxy with antiquated ships no?

I feel JJ Abrams changes stuff just to do so... It's a me thing... All good point by the way.

 

[ozzfloyd]

I ask..why not? A ton of time has passed since the last film and it's logical they would have upgraded their equipment. I think it would incredibly stupid to use the old models and I would doubt the could hold onto the galaxy with antiquated ships no?

Well, it's a 30 year time gap. A huge portion of US Air Force fighters are older than that and still in service.

 

[Covert Rain]

Well, it's a 30 year time gap. A huge portion of US Air Force fighters are older than that and still in service.

A huge portion has been upgraded as well. We have new fighters, new bombers, new helicopters etc. How formidable do you think we would look if our entire arsenal was 30 years old? I am not saying every single thing in the move needs to be upgraded. I will put money on it that it doesn't happen. That would be the equivalent of what you pointed out.

 

[puckhead]

Discussion-provoking article on which Ep. IV should go into the National Film Registry.

http://www.soundonsight.org/a-new-n...?hq_e=el&hq_m=2920051&hq_l=20&hq_v=287a947b49

My favorite part is George's own words to congress when the colorization fad was getting hot.

Lucas (circa 1988) believed that “American works of art belong to the American public; they are part of our cultural history.” Lucas makes an impassioned plea for the protection of cultural artifacts, a position that directly contradicts his future actions: “People who alter or destroy works of art and our cultural heritage for profit or as an exercise of power are barbarians, and if the laws of the United States continue to condone this behavior, history will surely classify us as a barbaric society.” Lucas implored for the preservation of original prints of films. “In the future,” he presciently cautions, “it will become even easier for old negatives to become lost and be ‘replaced’ by new altered negatives. This would be a great loss to our society. Our cultural history must not be allowed to be rewritten.”

 

[ozzfloyd]

A huge portion has been upgraded as well. We have new fighters, new bombers, new helicopters etc. How formidable do you think we would look if our entire arsenal was 30 years old? I am not saying every single thing in the move needs to be upgraded. I will put money on it that it doesn't happen. That would be the equivalent of what you pointed out.

The VAST majority of our flying arsenal is over 30 years old. F-16, A-10, F-15, F-18 B1, B52, Apache, Comanche, etc. are all early 80s and before.


Why would we not assume that the X Wing was upgraded? It's quite likely that the X-Wing or upgraded variant would still be a ubiquitous workhorse fighter craft.

 

[Covert Rain]

The VAST majority of our flying arsenal is over 30 years old. F-16, A-10, F-15, F-18 B1, B52, Apache, Comanche, etc. are all early 80s and before.


Why would we not assume that the X Wing was upgraded? It's quite likely that the X-Wing or upgraded variant would still be a ubiquitous workhorse fighter craft.

Again...why would you assume it's not upgraded? It's expected that some of the ships would have been upgraded over time. It would be ridiculous otherwise.

Keep in mind I am not saying that the old ones wouldn't be in service. That picture doesn't indicate that either. I would expect that in the movie you will see a good combination of classic and new. It's how it should be.

 

[Chaplin]

Again...why would you assume it's not upgraded? It's expected that some of the ships would have been upgraded over time. It would be ridiculous otherwise.

Keep in mind I am not saying that the old ones wouldn't be in service. That picture doesn't indicate that either. I would expect that in the movie you will see a good combination of classic and new. It's how it should be.

At the risk of taking all this MUCH too seriously, who's to say we've seen the entire breadth of the rebel fleet in IV through VI?

 

[ozzfloyd]

Again...why would you assume it's not upgraded? It's expected that some of the ships would have been upgraded over time. It would be ridiculous otherwise.

Keep in mind I am not saying that the old ones wouldn't be in service. That picture doesn't indicate that either. I would expect that in the movie you will see a good combination of classic and new. It's how it should be.

I'm totally not following you. I am assuming nothing. Yes, some fighters would be upgraded. So what? My point is that most of our fighting aircraft are more than 30 years old, so seeing 30+ year old craft in the new movies is not at all the unrealistic proposition that your initial post seemed to state.

 

[Covert Rain]

At the risk of taking all this MUCH too seriously, who's to say we've seen the entire breadth of the rebel fleet in IV through VI?

I doubt we have.

I'm totally not following you. I am assuming nothing. Yes, some fighters would be upgraded. So what? My point is that most of our fighting aircraft are more than 30 years old, so seeing 30+ year old craft in the new movies is not at all the unrealistic proposition that your initial post seemed to state.

My initial response did indicate it would be dumb to show old models but I since clarified my position. What I would find totally unrealistic is that EVERY ship in the fleet is still sporting the same design 30 years later. That would be ridiculous. Maybe you missed this:

"I would expect that in the movie you will see a good combination of classic and new. It's how it should be."

So, even though you find it plausible they could still have the old X-wing in the new movies, I find it equally plausible it could be upgraded. Therefore, I don't have a problem with it. Again, I would expect to see both classic ships and newer designed ones in the movie together which is very realistic. We could even see "classic" X-wings fighting besides newer designs.

 

[UncleChris]

One of the new models for Episode VII:

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Boy, am I old.....

 

[BillsCarnage]

New Storm/Snow troopers

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[Brian in Mesa]

 

[Covert Rain]

New Storm/Snow troopers

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Not sure what I think about the last one but the other new design is very cool.

 

[Stout]

Meh.

 

[crisper57]

Love the new designs! Love the snow trooper!

 

[Zeno]

A couple of new set photos from an Old RAF nuke base, you can see a couple of the new X- Wings and a partial Millenium Falcon...

 

[Cheesebeef]

A couple of new set photos from an Old RAF nuke base, you can see a couple of the new X- Wings and a partial Millenium Falcon...

what I really like about the above is it looks like they're going back to PRACTICAL EFFECTS/SETS.

The prequel trilogy never looked... real. And yes, I know it's entire made up planets and the like, but you could tell those planets, sets, everything about them were CGI creations.

 

[Zeno]

what I really like about the above is it looks like they're going back to PRACTICAL EFFECTS/SETS.

The prequel trilogy never looked... real. And yes, I know it's entire made up planets and the like, but you could tell those planets, sets, everything about them were CGI creations.

They did say they were going to make a return to practical effects and it looks like they are staying true to their word.

I just hope this movie lives up to the hope my inner SW fan has for it. A return of the magic...I am a big enough fan that I didn't HATE the prequels but it could have been so much better with just a little more effort.

 

[Covert Rain]

They did say they were going to make a return to practical effects and it looks like they are staying true to their word.

I just hope this movie lives up to the hope my inner SW fan has for it. A return of the magic...I am a big enough fan that I didn't HATE the prequels but it could have been so much better with just a little more effort.

I read the same as well. I didn't have as much a problem with it by the 2nd and 3rd films. Appears they made much improvement there but it was still too much for me. I thought the 1st film was atrocious in it's use. In fact, the entire Gungan fight was so cartoonish if feels like it should have been part of one of the recent CGI kids cartoons.

So glad they are sticking too that. It makes it feel more real. I definitely think there is a place for digital FX but not when it becomes a bigger character than anything else in the film.

 

[Shaggy]

You guys think this will be even bigger then the first prequel when it came out? You think it will out do the box offices numbers?

 

[Cheesebeef]

You guys think this will be even bigger then the first prequel when it came out? You think it will out do the box offices numbers?

i think it all depends on the marketing. if the trailers are out of this world and it looks like we're going to get Han Solo/Luke and Leia back, maybe. But I think those prequels took such a giant dump on Star Wars' good name, that it'll be SUPER tough to hit The Phantom Menace total (which I think is at 410).

 

[Shaggy]

I just think there are far to many die hard sw fans out there that with the original characters in it, even if the trailers are not out-of this world, it will destroy the box office numbers of the prequels.

 

[Covert Rain]

i think it all depends on the marketing. if the trailers are out of this world and it looks like we're going to get Han Solo/Luke and Leia back, maybe. But I think those prequels took such a giant dump on Star Wars' good name, that it'll be SUPER tough to hit The Phantom Menace total (which I think is at 410).

Although I do I agree the second trilogy wasn't as good as the first I don't think it took a dump on Star Wars. Considering how much they made despite the first one, the legions of new fans in made in kids, it's hard to say it took a dump on Star Wars.

Despite most of us that grew up on the trilogy there are millions of kids that love the new trilogy. For me it's a love hate thing. There are a ton of cool things that I loved about the new trilogy and a bunch of things I hate. I can see how fans that grew up on the original might have issues but with the younger generation?

I think with all of the original fans and the ton of new fans it made in younger generations, there is ZERO chance this new movie is not a hit. Massive hit? Well that remains to be seen.

Original fans have been clamoring for the stories after Jedi for as long as I can remember. The millions of new fans I think are much like we were growing up on the originals. They want more.

I think they have both generations hook line and sinker for at least the first film. It would have to be some sort of massive massive bomb to get people to jump ship. Even then.....with this franchise? Land a big director and I bet people are back on board.

 

[CardsFan88]

JJ Abrams successfully rebooted the Star Trek series. He could do very much the same thing with this. They both are very similar in that they have a huge already created universe to draw from.

The CGI was more of a Lucas dream to do this, which in a sense wasn't too far off, but now we've been there and done that and it's been copied a million times, so on and so forth. It was idealistic which is great, but in practice his dream doesn't work out so well.

I remember reading a comment about how Lucas was so proud of the world they created in Phantom Menace, and being ahead of the curve with his digital world. He then says he saw comparable things cropping up, and in video games, only a year later. That awe factor, simply wasn't there despite all the revolutionary things being done. People were already on his heels and it simply didn't have the same effect as the first lasers and explosions on screen.

CGI has a place, but like many have correctly stated, it needs to be at the right level. Clearly there was too much in the prequel trilogy. Though I agree the 2nd and 3rd were better, it just didn't have the same feel because everything was a green screen.

The original trilogy was heavily successful with kids and teens when it came out. So was the prequel trilogy. But for different reasons. Either way, the kids that were five years old when Phantom Menace came out will be old enough to buy beer when VII comes out.

I think the older generation will welcome a return to the more real settings, and thanks for the post about that, because that's amazing news to me. I was only five when Return of the Jedi came out, but I did see the 2nd and 3rd in the theater (2nd one in a dollar theater), and it seemed like forever from the time I saw Star Wars on HBO to getting to watch those two. I just loved that feel of the real sets, and the CGI just didn't do it for me. There were a few nice or interesting scenes, but it lacked the realness, and always felt like it was missing something.

The older generation, which I will include myself and anyone older, most likely would love a return to that more real setting. I'm fine with keeping some awe inspiring vista CGI, but the actual areas where they are engaging in the movie, would be better served being real.

Meanwhile the younger ones, the prequel kids, they are now adults, and don't need something so fake, and so I think they too would enjoy a change back to the more real setting. I still liked the prequel, and after watching them all dozens of times or more they grow on you. But it's clearly not the same.

The kids of today will still like it I'm sure, but they can get CGI in a hundred flavors these days, so it wouldn't have the same draw.

I think Lucas screwed up with the prequel trilogy, otherwise it would have been much bigger. But that's all gone now. Even he said they did A New Hope because it was the better story and better starting point. He just was confined to making the prequel which wasn't as good a story because people wanted more and that was the logical place to go.

Not just that but there were some serious book to movie translation problems which is why Lucas thought about making the trilogy into like 50 or 75 smaller serial movies. Which basically became the Clone Wars cartoon. The movies had to skip all that, and it didn't help the story much having these huge gaps. Plus it didn't have the cast we all loved, but they managed to find a way to put C-3PO and R2D2 in there, even if it didn't make too much sense, and to fit it in they had to wipe 3PO's mind at the end.

So worse story plus Lucas's CGI dream brought it down from lofty heights. Plus the fact they were no longer amazingly ahead of everyone else. It took most of Hollywood until the late 80's, early 90's to catch up with ILM. They were just a decade plus ahead of everyone and it showed.

This new trilogy has so much more going for it.
-It doesn't have the CGI mandate
-It has the main characters from the original cast
-It has a story that can be made good, because they can make it good, rather then trying to finish a series of books, of which the prequel were the poorer ones
-It has JJ and others trying to recreate a much better, more authentic feeling, probably a bit darker
-Probably be more PG-13 then PG
-They story isn't going to revolve around a ~8 year old boy
-That 8 year old boy is the guy you loved to hate and will eventually become Darth Vader
-Thus the surprise factor wasn't there (Star Wars wowed and surprised, prequel trilogy completely lacked that) but VII has it
-Any other mandate from Lucas is scrapped and can be looked at with fresh eyes and updated

I don't think it's going to be Star Wars good or make that kind of money (which adjusted for real inflation or the fact that ticket prices are 10-15x higher would result in the '77 version pulling in close to double digit billions), and let's face it-movies don't stay in theaters for 2-3 years anymore, but I think it's got a great chance to be really far up there and with the probably $12-16 movie price tickets in late 2015, and more for the upscale and possible 3D and 4D movie theaters, it's going to rake in a bunch of money.

It'll probably break the launch records, like many movies do, but stay viable for longer then many movies do nowadays. I.E. not fall of a cliff so easily like many other movies.

You now have a movie that can reach people ages 2-90+. Few movies have that appeal. But lots of 40-50 year old's loved Star Wars, and many of those still alive will want to see this and all the way down the line. My dad was 44 when it came out and it was his favorite movie.

I think what we're going to find out though, is how much people stayed away from the prequel because of all the bad word of mouth, because Lucas really screwed up, and was trying to play a bad hand and people knew it. That now has a chance to be fixed, and CGI was one of those main things. Along with 'Me So annoying cartoon character blatantly shoved into the film'.

As a kid from the original trilogy I can say for a fact that I liked the story, setting, ambiance, and all that as a 2 1/2-5 year old of a movie that the story was written for a higher aged audience, but it simply resonated with the kids. Of course I had a high school reading level as a five year old so, maybe I was a bit different. They didn't need to go to such lengths to introduce kids elements into the prequel, but I can understand it after so many kids loved Star Wars and the main character in Phantom Meance being so young. With the original trilogy, kids were just naturally drawn to the movie. The lasers, explosions, and all the crazy alien characters didn't hurt either. But they weren't geared to kids. Kids just latched on naturally because it was a perfect and natural blend. The prequel was successful with kids because it was so blatant. But either way they're all adults now and should like this turn back to something more real.

Anyways, can't wait.