Stoudemire agrees to five-year deal with Knicks

[elindholm]

Nash would still have been a great player but his exposure was greatly enhanced by Amare and that contributed considerably to his consecutive MVP awards.

Half of which he earned when Stoudemire wasn't playing...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

amare will get his numbers, though i suspect his fg % will decline and it will be more difficult to get his numbers. those of you that think nash "made" amare are nuts.

nash will also get his numbers, but again it'll be more difficult as he won't have the supreme athlete cutting to the hoop any longer.

they're both terrific offensive players. why can't some of you see that they're both talented?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Half of which he earned when Stoudemire wasn't playing...

That's true, and I did fail to consider that point, but there is another way to look at it. The Nash to Amare combo raised his public profile to the point that his being able to excel the next year minus Amare became an even more impressive feat. ESPN, FOX Sports, NBA Channel all made a living out of showing the Nash to Amare plays in 04/05 and it led to Nash being talked about as one of the league greats.

I think Nash actually played his best ever during his second MVP season without Stat but I just don't think it would have received the recognition it deserved had it not been for the previous highlight year with Amare.

Steve

 

[TJ]

amare will get his numbers, though i suspect his fg % will decline and it will be more difficult to get his numbers. those of you that think nash "made" amare are nuts.

nash will also get his numbers, but again it'll be more difficult as he won't have the supreme athlete cutting to the hoop any longer.

they're both terrific offensive players. why can't some of you see that they're both talented?

I dont think anyone rationally thinks Nash created Stat like he was Frankenstein, but he certainly upped his game with the P&R. What Amare did do which was mutually exclusive to Nash is develop a jump shot, which will only benefit him.

Like I said above, this will be a good barometer to see how much Nash effected his game.

 

[82CardsGrad]

amare will get his numbers, though i suspect his fg % will decline and it will be more difficult to get his numbers. those of you that think nash "made" amare are nuts.

nash will also get his numbers, but again it'll be more difficult as he won't have the supreme athlete cutting to the hoop any longer.

they're both terrific offensive players. why can't some of you see that they're both talented?

Not sure about all that... Yes, Amare will still be a solid offensive threat, but I can see his PPG going down without Nash. The Knicks don't have anyone close (sans LeBron) to Nash in terms of someone being able to read defenses and pass the ball. Amare has ZERO back-to-the-basket game. None... Which means he will have to rely more than ever before on his jump shot... which is good, but not nearly consistent enough to produce 20 PPG.
Now, if the Knicks do land LeBron, all bets are off... I can then see Amare equalling and perhaps surpassing his production during his Suns tenure.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Not sure about all that... Yes, Amare will still be a solid offensive threat, but I can see his PPG going down without Nash. The Knicks don't have anyone close (sans LeBron) to Nash in terms of someone being able to read defenses and pass the ball. Amare has ZERO back-to-the-basket game. None... Which means he will have to rely more than ever before on his jump shot... which is good, but not nearly consistent enough to produce 20 PPG.
Now, if the Knicks do land LeBron, all bets are off... I can then see Amare equalling and perhaps surpassing his production during his Suns tenure.

I'm pretty sure that there will be other NBA level players on the Knicks. They'll be able to get the ball across half court and they'll be able to pass the ball to Amare. If he's the only true star he'll probably get twice as many possessions, shoot 5 to 10 percent lower and still raise his average by several points.

He's one of the two or three best in the league at drawing fouls and he has a great face-the-basket game as long as he stays within his range. And he has a back to the basket game, it involves turning around and using his facing-the-basket moves.

Steve

 

[devilalum]

And this is relevant to what? Look at your statement that Nash has averaged the same number of assists his entire career and then look at how much lower his assist rate was with Dallas.
Steve

Yes you are correct, Nash has not averaged 11 assists every year. My point was that Nash would have got his assists regardless because he's a great point guard. Skiles set the single game assist record playing for a mediocre team. 05-06 is the only example of Nash playing at his highest level without Amare and he still had a great year especially with much of the offense going through Diaw.

 

[SunsTzu]

Amare has ZERO back-to-the-basket game. None... Which means he will have to rely more than ever before on his jump shot... which is good, but not nearly consistent enough to produce 20 PPG.

You do realize he averaged 20ppg his 2nd year out of highschool without any jumper and only a developing JJ as a real play maker. He may not have a back to the basket game but he scores very well out of the post through face ups and his jumper is as consistent as any elite PF not named Dirk.

I'd bet money on him get 20ppg as long as he stays healthy.

 

[devilalum]

You do realize he averaged 20ppg his 2nd year out of highschool without any jumper and only a developing JJ as a real play maker. He may not have a back to the basket game but he scores very well out of the post through face ups and his jumper is as consistent as any elite PF not named Dirk.

I'd bet money on him get 20ppg as long as he stays healthy.

That Amare was spectacular and might have been the greatest PF of all time but that Amare is dead.

RIP

 

[Covert Rain]

That Amare was spectacular and might have been the greatest PF of all time but that Amare is dead.

RIP

Yes but the Amare that actually has a jumper (18 foot is almost money), Amare who is better at the free throw line, Amare who is 10 times better at the pick and roll, who scores 20+ per night and who is considered one of the best finishers still....... is very much alive.

Your acting like he is not still not one of the best scoring PFs in the entire league. I miss his sick hops and just pure athleticism. However, I think that forced him to work on other parts of his offensive game which did get better.

 

[devilalum]

Yes but the Amare that actually has a jumper (18 foot is almost money), Amare who is better at the free throw line, Amare who is 10 times better at the pick and roll, who scores 20+ per night and who is considered one of the best finishers still....... is very much alive.

Your acting like he is not still not one of the best scoring PFs in the entire league.

That's what I'm sayin. If he still had the pre-kneedrill explosiveness and all that he would be the greatest PF ever. Do you remember that pic of him blocking Duncan's shot with his hand above the box?

 

[mojorizen7]

He's one of the two or three best in the league at drawing fouls and he has a great face-the-basket game as long as he stays within his range. And he has a back to the basket game, it involves turning around and using his facing-the-basket moves.

Steve

Awesome...just awesome.

 

[The_Matrix]

Amare has a back to the basket game, it involves turning around and using his facing-the-basket moves.
Steve

Wait a sec... I mean.... but... actually... you know what Steve, you are 100% correct.

 

[Irish]

In 2003-04, Amare shot roughly 47%. When he plyed with Nash the following year, his 2004-05 average jumped to 55%. IMHO, weak guard play can make even a good inside guy look rather average. Amare is very talented but has never been a quality back to the basket player nor a "make his own shot" shooter.

If LeBron does not join the Knicks, I would expect Amae to have a rough season.

 

[tobiazz]

We are getting the big TPE for Stoudemire. That's a useful chip to have lying around. We only had to give up a 2nd rounder rather than a 1st.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67972/20100708/suns_will_s&t_amare_for_$165m_trade_exception/

 

[tobiazz]

Oh, no. According to this story, Amare's recruitment of LeBron did not go well. LeBron not going to NY (if he doesn't) cannot be pegged on Amare, but the NY fans might despise Amare now.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_a...onversation_with_lebron_did_not_go_very_well/

 

[joshstmarie]

We are getting the big TPE for Stoudemire. That's a useful chip to have lying around. We only had to give up a 2nd rounder rather than a 1st.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_a...uns_will_s&t_amare_for_$165m_trade_exception/

oh wow, so its actually official. Wonder what (if anything) sarver has in mind. At least we get to pipe dream about players that would improve the suns for another few weeks.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

That article says we may be getting David Lee. Someone try to clear this all up please....

 

[Mainstreet]

Here is a link to a Paul Coro article at azcentral dated 7-8-10 that indicates the Suns will do a sign and trade with Amare for a TE.

The Suns will use Amar'e Stoudemire's official departure today to make a pair of sign-and-trade deals with New York and Chicago, netting the Suns a $16.5 million trade exception from the Knicks and using part of that for Hakim Warrick's acquisition, according to Stoudemire's agent, Happy Walters.

Walters said the trade exception the Suns are receiving in return for first signing Stoudemire to his five-year, $99.7 million contract with New York is for $16.5 million, equivalent to Stoudemire's first-year salary. That means the Suns would not be getting a player, like free agent David Lee in return.

However, if LeBron James picks New York today, the Suns could still have a chance at Lee. Even then, Phoenix is hesitant to give Lee a contract averaging about $13 million annually like he wants. By comparison, Steve Nash will make $10.3 million this season.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaulCoro/88449

 

[joshstmarie]

I think 13 a year is a pretty fair price for Lee, especially with boozer signing for 16.

 

[tobiazz]

That article says we may be getting David Lee. Someone try to clear this all up please....

All it means is that we could get a player in that price range. If Sarver were just planning on letting the TPE expire, he would have had little reason to acquire one, so it seems the Suns want some flexibility in that regard. If the Suns are doing well mid-way through the season, they may want to trade for a $10M player on a team that is in the cellar.

 

[tobiazz]

I think 13 a year is a pretty fair price for Lee, especially with boozer signing for 16.

Somewhere, it was stated that Sarver liked Lee at $10M, not $12-15M. I'm sure some team is willing to give him ~$13-14M, so he will not be on the Suns. Otherwise, it probably would have been a S&T for Lee.

Either GS gets Lee in S&T or NJ signs Lee in an attempt to steal NY fans.

BTW: $13M would be about 2/3's the price of Amare so that definitely sounds reasonable.

 

[Louis]

What did the Suns do with the last big trade exception they had?

 

[Mainstreet]

What did the Suns do with the last big trade exception they had?

I don't think anyone would argue that a TE is better than Lee or another player. The last TE (or at least the majority of it) went into Sarver's pocket.

 

[SunsTzu]

What did the Suns do with the last big trade exception they had?

The last big trade exception was acquired in th KT trade. There was no way they Suns were going to use it because if they were willing to pay that luxury tax they would have just kept him.