Suns, Eric Bledsoe Far Apart In Talks

[AzStevenCal]

Since no other team can offer Bledsoe more than about 4/65 why is he demanding 5/85 from the Suns?

If the Suns could go back in time they should have told everybody they would NOT match even a medium sized contract then matched whatever offer he received.

Going out of their way to tell everybody they would match seems to have been a really bad move. All it did was piss everybody off.

JCSunsfan has been saying the same thing but who would believe this? When have you ever heard a franchise say that about one of their upcoming RFA's? I really doubt there's a GM in the league that's gullible enough to take that statement at face value. Maybe they should have just kept quiet but I'm fine with their approach, it's pretty much the industry standard. And, so far, there's no reason to believe it's not working. We're all frustrated because we want things to happen on our timetable but the real world doesn't always work that way.

Steve

 

[devilalum]

JCSunsfan has been saying the same thing but who would believe this? When have you ever heard a franchise say that about one of their upcoming RFA's? I really doubt there's a GM in the league that's gullible enough to take that statement at face value. Maybe they should have just kept quiet but I'm fine with their approach, it's pretty much the industry standard. And, so far, there's no reason to believe it's not working. We're all frustrated because we want things to happen on our timetable but the real world doesn't always work that way.

Steve

Some say nothing. IMO that is the best approach.

 

[JCSunsfan]

JCSunsfan has been saying the same thing but who would believe this? When have you ever heard a franchise say that about one of their upcoming RFA's? I really doubt there's a GM in the league that's gullible enough to take that statement at face value. Maybe they should have just kept quiet but I'm fine with their approach, it's pretty much the industry standard. And, so far, there's no reason to believe it's not working. We're all frustrated because we want things to happen on our timetable but the real world doesn't always work that way.

Steve

Its hindsight. Who would have thought that a player would have such an inflated view of himself and discount so much the impact of injuries on his market value? In restrospect, it would have been the way to go, but I am not sure it would have been reasonable to expect the team would have known it.

In the end, the well-being of the team should be priority. I wonder if they could reach out, offer him 4/63 and call it a day. It's a risk on the team's part, but losing him for nothing is not good either.

 

[devilalum]

JCSunsfan has been saying the same thing but who would believe this? When have you ever heard a franchise say that about one of their upcoming RFA's? I really doubt there's a GM in the league that's gullible enough to take that statement at face value. Maybe they should have just kept quiet but I'm fine with their approach, it's pretty much the industry standard. And, so far, there's no reason to believe it's not working. We're all frustrated because we want things to happen on our timetable but the real world doesn't always work that way.

Steve

At least we got 850+ posts out of the posturing.

 

[devilalum]

Its hindsight. Who would have thought that a player would have such an inflated view of himself and discount so much the impact of injuries on his market value? In restrospect, it would have been the way to go, but I am not sure it would have been reasonable to expect the team would have known it.

Do you really think he has this inflated view of himself? He hasn't said a word publicly to back this up. Do you think him asking for 5/85 might just be some kind of ploy?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Some say nothing. IMO that is the best approach.

It could be. It's difficult to tell. We could still end up signing Bledsoe for 4/48 or 4/52 and that's surely a better deal than we would have had to match. Keep in mind that our saying we'd match any reasonable deal didn't matter much to Bledsoe's camp. They don't want a reasonable deal, they want the maximum. If it's the Suns that makes the deal, that's the 5 year max (80 plus) and if it's any other team it's the 4 year 63 million dollar max. Given those numbers, I don't see how we've changed the bidding dynamic all that much.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

Some say nothing. IMO that is the best approach.

It would be interesting to be a fly on the wall. The "we'll match any offer" thing sounds like a Sarver statement, not a McD statement.

Sarver did say in an interview with Gambo that he never said that. They did manage to let it out there, though. I do think alot of other teams just assumed that the Suns would match, given Bledsoe's potential, but did not make an offer because of his injury history. He was sort of in limbo--too good to sign for cheap, too much of a risk to go all out.

The Suns took that risk with Eric Gordon, and other teams did notice that they dodged a bullet when NOP matched.

 

[devilalum]

It could be. It's difficult to tell. We could still end up signing Bledsoe for 4/48 or 4/52 and that's surely a better deal than we would have had to match. Keep in mind that our saying we'd match any reasonable deal didn't matter much to Bledsoe's camp. They don't want a reasonable deal, they want the maximum. If it's the Suns that makes the deal, that's the 5 year max (80 plus) and if it's any other team it's the 4 year 63 million dollar max. Given those numbers, I don't see how we've changed the bidding dynamic all that much.

Steve

Do you really think they expect 5/85? The Suns are the only team on earth that can give him that much and they aren't biting. The more I think about it I think its BS. It just defies logic that he would really expect the Suns to max him out.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Its hindsight. Who would have thought that a player would have such an inflated view of himself and discount so much the impact of injuries on his market value? In restrospect, it would have been the way to go, but I am not sure it would have been reasonable to expect the team would have known it.

In the end, the well-being of the team should be priority. I wonder if they could reach out, offer him 4/63 and call it a day. It's a risk on the team's part, but losing him for nothing is not good either.

It's not hindsight, we were told this last October when the two sides couldn't reach an agreement. He was demanding a max deal before he'd ever even been a regular starter. Yes, it makes sense to us that his injury problem should drastically impact his demands but all you have to do is look at Curry to see the problem. Curry is a steal and everyone knows it. That contract reflects poorly on his agent and no one wants to give away dollars again like that guy did.

I still think the best thing to do is wait. Sarver has made it known that even though he feels their offer is fair, he's willing to negotiate from that point. Paul is waiting us out, trying to make us sweat and fold. I think we can get away with a phone call that says, come in with a reasonable offer and let's talk. But it would be a sign of weakness to start bidding against ourselves, IMO.

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

Do you really think they expect 5/85? The Suns are the only team on earth that can give him that much and they aren't biting. The more I think about it I think its BS. It just defies logic that he would really expect the Suns to max him out.

Me too. He hasn't earned it, there isn't a market for him at that kind of money and even with a spiraling Cap, it's questionable if he'll be worth it over the life of the deal. But if I had to choose between Hayward at that money or Bledsoe, it's no contest. If Eric gets passed by the medical staff, he's a much better investment than Hayward or even Parsons IMO. And I'm pretty sure that's how Paul is looking at it and representing it to his client.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

Me too. He hasn't earned it, there isn't a market for him at that kind of money and even with a spiraling Cap, it's questionable if he'll be worth it over the life of the deal. But if I had to choose between Hayward at that money or Bledsoe, it's no contest. If Eric gets passed by the medical staff, he's a much better investment than Hayward or even Parsons IMO. And I'm pretty sure that's how Paul is looking at it and representing it to his client.

Steve

But the medical issue is an unavoidable part of the equation, even if he passes med staff muster. His career will be shortened by this injury--no way around it.

 

[elindholm]

Going out of their way to tell everybody they would match seems to have been a really bad move. All it did was piss everybody off.

And save them money. In the end Bledsoe will take the $48/4, which is less than he could have gotten on a truly open market.

 

[AzStevenCal]

But the medical issue is an unavoidable part of the equation, even if he passes med staff muster. His career will be shortened by this injury--no way around it.

I'm not sure about this. I know that's likely the case if he'd lost the entire meniscus but I don't know what happens if it's a clean knee otherwise and just a small portion has been removed.

Steve

 

[overseascardfan]

If Bledsoe takes the $48M then cool. But if a S&T is going to happen I hope a trade rumor out there with LA for Julius Randle comes to fruition. Of course, I'm sure LA will insist on PHX taking either Jordan Hill or Steve Nash, hell it wouldn't surprise me if LA's offer doesn't include Randle.

PHX needs a stud PF, that is what any deal for Bledsoe should include, if he ends up being dealt.

 

[Phrazbit]

Wade had his ENTIRE meniscus removed, a much more serious operation, and he did so in college. It was nearly a decade before the long term effects started to hinder his ability to play. When talking about Bledsoe its a 4 (or 5) year contract, if you're worried about the long term wear and tear on his knee, thats a concern that should not pop up until several years after his next contract ends.

 

[Phrazbit]

If Bledsoe takes the $48M then cool. But if a S&T is going to happen I hope a trade rumor out there with LA for Julius Randle comes to fruition. Of course, I'm sure LA will insist on PHX taking either Jordan Hill or Steve Nash, hell it wouldn't surprise me if LA's offer doesn't include Randle.

PHX needs a stud PF, that is what any deal for Bledsoe should include, if he ends up being dealt.

Hill's contract was surprising but seeing as they JUST signed him to it I doubt they're desperate to dump it.

 

[elindholm]

Hill's contract was surprising but seeing as they JUST signed him to it I doubt they're desperate to dump it.

There's a rule anyway, isn't there? A player on a new FA contract can't be traded until December 15, or something like that?

 

[sunsfan88]

Wade had his ENTIRE meniscus removed, a much more serious operation, and he did so in college. It was nearly a decade before the long term effects started to hinder his ability to play. When talking about Bledsoe its a 4 (or 5) year contract, if you're worried about the long term wear and tear on his knee, thats a concern that should not pop up until several years after his next contract ends.

Wade is just an exception. I don't think it's fair to expect everyone else who has had their meniscus removed to have the same lack of discomfort that Wade has had.

And even then, Wade has had quite a few injury problems throughout his NBA career.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Wade is just an exception. I don't think it's fair to expect everyone else who has had their meniscus removed to have the same lack of discomfort that Wade has had.

And even then, Wade has had quite a few injury problems throughout his NBA career.

Maybe. But Eric didn't have his entire Meniscus removed, only a small portion of it.

Steve

 

[Phrazbit]

Wade is just an exception. I don't think it's fair to expect everyone else who has had their meniscus removed to have the same lack of discomfort that Wade has had.

And even then, Wade has had quite a few injury problems throughout his NBA career.

Well, Wade is actually one of the players people site as a bad-case scenario. Other prominent guys who have had similar such injuries.

Blake Griffin, Jeremy Lin, JR Smith, Russell Westbrook, Chris Paul.

All of them fully recovered.

The names people give as evidence that a meniscus can ruin a career, almost all those guys had much worse issues that were around before a meniscus injury. Such as Bynum and Brandon Roy, both with degenerative knee problems that had shown themselves before their meniscus injury. Gilbert Arenas is another name, but he refused to listen to his doctors and forced his way back before he was healthy and did much more severe damage the second time around.

 

[Chaz]

I still think Bennett can be a good player.
I was surprised to see him drafted number 1 but he was the player I would have picked in the top 5-10 in that draft.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Well, Wade is actually one of the players people site as a bad-case scenario. Other prominent guys who have had similar such injuries.

Blake Griffin, Jeremy Lin, JR Smith, Russell Westbrook, Chris Paul.

All of them fully recovered.

The names people give as evidence that a meniscus can ruin a career, almost all those guys had much worse issues that were around before a meniscus injury. Such as Bynum and Brandon Roy, both with degenerative knee problems that had shown themselves before their meniscus injury. Gilbert Arenas is another name, but he refused to listen to his doctors and forced his way back before he was healthy and did much more severe damage the second time around.

I know Bledsoe had part of his meniscus removed after trying to repair it failed. But no one has said how much. Does anyone have that information? It's obviously enough of a concern to keep teams away.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I know Bledsoe had part of his meniscus removed after trying to repair it failed. But no one has said how much. Does anyone have that information? It's obviously enough of a concern to keep teams away.

The following quote comes from NBCSports site, ProBasketballTalk:

According to the Arizona Republic on Monday Bledsoe had a small piece of his meniscus removed, which is a much less serious surgery than had been suggested previously.

As for it keeping teams away, I think there are several factors at play in addition to the injury concern. First off, he has a very small sample to be judged by. Secondly, while he has looked pretty good at times in our offense, it remains to be seen how effective he'd be in a traditional offense. Especially given how much he struggled as a fill-in starter for Paul.

Plus, it's hard to justify a large salary in addition to the outgoing assets it would take to acquire a player like Bledsoe. He's good but he's not Lebron or even Love. So, to me, it's no surprise that they aren't beating down his door. It's just a perfect example of the RFA process working the way the league intended it to. It's designed to help teams keep their rookie contract players.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

The following quote comes from NBCSports site, ProBasketballTalk:



As for it keeping teams away, I think there are several factors at play in addition to the injury concern. First off, he has a very small sample to be judged by. Secondly, while he has looked pretty good at times in our offense, it remains to be seen how effective he'd be in a traditional offense. Especially given how much he struggled as a fill-in starter for Paul.

Plus, it's hard to justify a large salary in addition to the outgoing assets it would take to acquire a player like Bledsoe. He's good but he's not Lebron or even Love. So, to me, it's no surprise that they aren't beating down his door. It's just a perfect example of the RFA process working the way the league intended it to. It's designed to help teams keep their rookie contract players.

Steve

It is also intended to keep the market from getting out of hand for young players with potential but yet unproven. Not that I am disagreeing with you, just adding.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It is also intended to keep the market from getting out of hand for young players with potential but yet unproven. Not that I am disagreeing with you, just adding.

Sure, I can see that. To a certain extent, it goes hand in hand with the point I made. the big market teams can afford to throw money at someone that hasn't quite proven himself yet whereas the rest of the league has to spend more prudently.

Steve