The Ayton Plan

[Big Al]

I guess I'm just not willing to say our window is open until we learn exactly what caused our collapse in the postseason. Unless it's a one time problem or something reasonably fixable, I just don't see us as real contenders.

So, if Durant solves the problem or if we can fix the problem without wholesale changes, adding Kevin would probably make us prohibitive favorites if all it cost us was DA. If that's the case, I'm all for it. But if not, I'd pass. Not that I think there's any real chance of it happening anyway.

Yeah. It never hurts to negotiate. Now it may have reached a point where it's similar to the Joe Johnson situation.

Sometimes I wonder about the Suns negotiating skills & general handling of situations before they get out of hand.

I see the Lakers signed Rasheed Wallace as an assistant coach. Rasheed could have probably given Ayton some toughness, an edge and a little attitude had the Suns had the foresight to get Ayton a big man mentor of this type. I knew Rasheed appeared to be a loose cannon at times but that was probably for show. I know many will defend Mark Byrant as a big man coach & mentor for Ayton but Byrant seems to be a sleep on the Suns bench always. Just saying help to give a players the tools to compete. We'll miss Ayton's rebounding, defense, upside that was improving each year. Patience & working with a talented big man is what the Suns don't seem to have. Sometimes you have to develop the diamond in the rough. When things unravel as they did in the playoffs the strong minded regroup & focus without being butt hurt. That's Manning up!

 

[Mainstreet]

Sometimes I wonder about the Suns negotiating skills & general handling of situations before they get out of hand.

I see the Lakers signed Rasheed Wallace as an assistant coach. Rasheed could have probably given Ayton some toughness, an edge and a little attitude had the Suns had the foresight to get Ayton a big man mentor of this type. I knew Rasheed appeared to be a loose cannon at times but that was probably for show. I know many will defend Mark Byrant as a big man coach & mentor for Ayton but Byrant seems to be a sleep on the Suns bench always. Just saying help to give a players the tools to compete. We'll miss Ayton's rebounding, defense, upside that was improving each year. Patience & working with a talented big man is what the Suns don't seem to have. Sometimes you have to develop the diamond in the rough. When things unravel as they did in the playoffs the strong minded regroup & focus without being butt hurt. That's Manning up!

I was concerned about how Ryan McDonough handled player personnel matters.

Now I'm beginning to wonder the same about James Jones especially when it comes to players that require more development.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Sometimes I wonder about the Suns negotiating skills & general handling of situations before they get out of hand.

I see the Lakers signed Rasheed Wallace as an assistant coach. Rasheed could have probably given Ayton some toughness, an edge and a little attitude had the Suns had the foresight to get Ayton a big man mentor of this type. I knew Rasheed appeared to be a loose cannon at times but that was probably for show. I know many will defend Mark Byrant as a big man coach & mentor for Ayton but Byrant seems to be a sleep on the Suns bench always. Just saying help to give a players the tools to compete. We'll miss Ayton's rebounding, defense, upside that was improving each year. Patience & working with a talented big man is what the Suns don't seem to have. Sometimes you have to develop the diamond in the rough. When things unravel as they did in the playoffs the strong minded regroup & focus without being butt hurt. That's Manning up!

I know I'm in a disappearing minority on this point but I really still believe we'll sign DA.

As for Bryant, it's tough to tell what impact he's having. Right now, it's a real challenge to simply accept that Monty is in control and knows what he's doing but for me he's earned a short grace period. So, for the moment, I'm trusting in him to either support Mark because he deserves that support or to replace him because he doesn't.

 

[GatorAZ]

Suns got Jackson Vroman out of the 2004 draft at #31.

So they didn’t punt on the draft, they shanked it.

 

[Mainstreet]

So they didn’t punt on the draft, they shanked it.

I guess that's another way of putting it. I'd say the Suns fumbled the snap.

 

[Mainstreet]

Gerald Bourguet writes a nice article on the facts of a sign-and-trade and how it works without all the speculation that goes with it.

5 things to know about Deandre Ayton’s restricted free agency - PHNX Sports

Deandre Ayton's impending free agency is hanging over the Phoenix Suns' head -- and the entire NBA offseason -- as one of the biggest stories of the summer.

www.gophnx.com

 

[Folster]

Suns got Jackson Vroman out of the 2004 draft at #31.

It's incredible to think that he passed away years ago and Iguodala is still playing and in the Finals.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's incredible to think that he passed away years ago and Iguodala is still playing and in the Finals.

I thought Vroman had a chance to be a solid role player in the NBA. Unfortunately it didn't work out that way. His early death was unfortunate.

 

[Big Al]

I know I'm in a disappearing minority on this point but I really still believe we'll sign DA.

As for Bryant, it's tough to tell what impact he's having. Right now, it's a real challenge to simply accept that Monty is in control and knows what he's doing but for me he's earned a short grace period. So, for the moment, I'm trusting in him to either support Mark because he deserves that support or to replace him because he doesn't.

I hope you are correct AzStevenCal with DA signing as I too have a faint hope that the Suns will retain his services but as a long time Suns follower I know their history of actions.
My grace period for Mark Bryant as a big man coach has ended and coach Monty has 2 consecutive short comings in the playoffs & gets only one more chance & you wonder who is in charge CP3 or Monty but that's only my opinion which means absolutely nothing as the Suns are making those decisions. We are on the sidelines observing only. It will be played out soon. Go Suns! Ya gotta to win that chip one of these days!

 

[Big Al]

I know I'm in a disappearing minority on this point but I really still believe we'll sign DA.

As for Bryant, it's tough to tell what impact he's having. Right now, it's a real challenge to simply accept that Monty is in control and knows what he's doing but for me he's earned a short grace period. So, for the moment, I'm trusting in him to either support Mark because he deserves that support or to replace him because he doesn't.

I hope you are correct AzStevenCal with DA signing as I too have a faint hope that the Suns will retain his services but as a long time Suns follower I know their history of actions.
My grace period for Mark Bryant as a big man coach has ended and coach Monty has 2 consecutive short comings in the playoffs & gets only one more chance but that's only my opinion which means absolutely nothing as the Suns are making those decisions. We are only on the sidelines observing only. It will be played out soon. Go Suns! Ya gotta to win that chip one of these days!!

 

[Big Al]

I know I'm in a disappearing minority on this point but I really still believe we'll sign DA.

As for Bryant, it's tough to tell what impact he's having. Right now, it's a real challenge to simply accept that Monty is in control and knows what he's doing but for me he's earned a short grace period. So, for the moment, I'm trusting in him to either support Mark because he deserves that support or to replace him because he doesn't.

Hope it runs its course well. We'Il be back as Suns followers hopefully.

 

[Yuma]

I keep reading that the Suns would be on the hook for $30 million per year because a team will offer the max. I have also been hearing Jon Gambadoro has said teams are calling to find out what is wrong with Ayton because they are reluctant to make a bid for Ayton. Also, some teams don't think Ayton is worth the max either. No one talks about the possibility that maybe Ayton will not be offered the max. Maybe it is not probable, but it is possible maybe he may not receive a max offer from another team. I am thinking if Ayton gets a reasonable offer from a team, perhaps we should match and keep him?

 

[AzStevenCal]

I keep reading that the Suns would be on the hook for $30 million per year because a team will offer the max. I have also been hearing Jon Gambadoro has said teams are calling to find out what is wrong with Ayton because they are reluctant to make a bid for Ayton. Also, some teams don't think Ayton is worth the max either. No one talks about the possibility that maybe Ayton will not be offered the max. Maybe it is not probable, but it is possible maybe he may not receive a max offer from another team. I am thinking if Ayton gets a reasonable offer from a team, perhaps we should match and keep him?

The best thing for us is if he'll sign a 5 year max with no player options. As long as we're not looking at a super max, he's worth the most we can give him or he soon will be as salaries increase - especially with the new TV deal coming up in 2 or 3 years. But yeah, matching is better than losing him.

 

[Hoop Head]

I keep reading that the Suns would be on the hook for $30 million per year because a team will offer the max. I have also been hearing Jon Gambadoro has said teams are calling to find out what is wrong with Ayton because they are reluctant to make a bid for Ayton. Also, some teams don't think Ayton is worth the max either. No one talks about the possibility that maybe Ayton will not be offered the max. Maybe it is not probable, but it is possible maybe he may not receive a max offer from another team. I am thinking if Ayton gets a reasonable offer from a team, perhaps we should match and keep him?

He's getting the max from somewhere. Of course there are questions of why the Suns haven't maxed him but there are teams like Detroit who have cap space and no one else in this FA class is worth big money. Cap space is used or lost in the NBA. It's better to gamble on Ayton than end up overpaying to keep someone like a Jerami Grant if you're the Pistons.

The idea he won't get the max is so small it's really not worth spending much time discussing, if any.

 

[Folster]

I keep reading that the Suns would be on the hook for $30 million per year because a team will offer the max. I have also been hearing Jon Gambadoro has said teams are calling to find out what is wrong with Ayton because they are reluctant to make a bid for Ayton. Also, some teams don't think Ayton is worth the max either. No one talks about the possibility that maybe Ayton will not be offered the max. Maybe it is not probable, but it is possible maybe he may not receive a max offer from another team. I am thinking if Ayton gets a reasonable offer from a team, perhaps we should match and keep him?

This is odd. I assume he means teams are calling the Suns and asking. That's like asking the car salesman what's wrong with the car he wants to sell you.

 

[overseascardfan]

I see another Eric Bledsoe contract situation on the horizon.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I see another Eric Bledsoe contract situation on the horizon.

Have you tried corrective lenses?

 

[overseascardfan]

Have you tried corrective lenses?

I mean that other teams may not offer Ayton a max deal so PHX has no competition but an extension gets done with PHX.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I mean that other teams may not offer Ayton a max deal so PHX has no competition but an extension gets done with PHX.

Aah, I misinterpreted that. Can I borrow your corrective lenses and maybe a brain cell?

 

[Big Al]

This is odd. I assume he means teams are calling the Suns and asking. That's like asking the car salesman what's wrong with the car he wants to sell you.

Yes it is!

 

[Big Al]

This is odd. I assume he means teams are calling the Suns and asking. That's like asking the car salesman what's wrong with the car he wants to sell you.

Yes it is

This is odd. I assume he means teams are calling the Suns and asking. That's like asking the car salesman what's wrong with the car he wants to sell you.

 

[TJ]

I keep reading that the Suns would be on the hook for $30 million per year because a team will offer the max. I have also been hearing Jon Gambadoro has said teams are calling to find out what is wrong with Ayton because they are reluctant to make a bid for Ayton. Also, some teams don't think Ayton is worth the max either. No one talks about the possibility that maybe Ayton will not be offered the max. Maybe it is not probable, but it is possible maybe he may not receive a max offer from another team. I am thinking if Ayton gets a reasonable offer from a team, perhaps we should match and keep him?

He’s getting a max. There’s a large market for his services

 

[Raindog]

Sometimes I wonder about the Suns negotiating skills & general handling of situations before they get out of hand.

I see the Lakers signed Rasheed Wallace as an assistant coach. Rasheed could have probably given Ayton some toughness, an edge and a little attitude had the Suns had the foresight to get Ayton a big man mentor of this type. I knew Rasheed appeared to be a loose cannon at times but that was probably for show. I know many will defend Mark Byrant as a big man coach & mentor for Ayton but Byrant seems to be a sleep on the Suns bench always. Just saying help to give a players the tools to compete. We'll miss Ayton's rebounding, defense, upside that was improving each year. Patience & working with a talented big man is what the Suns don't seem to have. Sometimes you have to develop the diamond in the rough. When things unravel as they did in the playoffs the strong minded regroup & focus without being butt hurt. That's Manning up!

Reading through the last few pages of posts in this thread, about the Suns post-millenial history of bungling contract negotiations, wasting draft capital, bad trades, and clownish front office personnel, and you know what strikes me most? Who is the single common thread through all of it? One single person: the idiot managing partner/owner Suns fans have been accursed with for the last (almost) 20 years.

Praying to whatever deity there may be that we will be rid of him soon.

 

[Big Al]

Reading through the last few pages of posts in this thread, about the Suns post-millenial history of bungling contract negotiations, wasting draft capital, bad trades, and clownish front office personnel, and you know what strikes me most? Who is the single common thread through all of it? One single person: the idiot managing partner/owner Suns fans have been accursed with for the last (almost) 20 years.

Praying to whatever deity there may be that we will be rid of him soon.

It would be interesting to see the Suns doing business without Robert Sarver's influence one day without a doubt if it's ever possible.

 

[Phrazbit]

Since it was brought up, this is what Joe Johnson netted us.



So that ended up being:

-Boris Diaw
-2008 #15: Robin Lopez (after narrowly missing out on the 2007 #4 pick) Rotten luck!
-2006 #21: Rajon Rondo who we traded with Brian Grant for a 2007 1st that ended up being #24 Rudy Fernandez who we traded with James Jones to Portland for cash.

TLDR: Diaw, Lopez and cash for Joe Johnson.

Had we kept Rondo it would've been a nice return and if we hit with the #4 it would have been amazing. God that pick selling era was miserable.

To be fair, Atlanta was incredible lucky in the lotto. That pick 2007 had something like 80% odds to fall to us between either 4-6 in the draft... they jumped up. Had they not jumped up most projections had us getting either Al Horford or Mike Conley.

Oof.