Thinking December 15th starts trades

[sunsfan88]

Beidrins/Ellis for Turk/Richardson - GS is struggling, Ellis cant play with Curry. They get an expiring SG and unload two of their largest contracts.

Lopez for Randolph. NY gets a C and Amare can play PF. Randolph steps in and gives us some front court presence.

Beidrins/Barron
Randolph/Frye
Hill/Warrick/Dudley
Ellis/Chill/Dudley
Nash/Dragic

Except for Nash/Hill this is a young team that would be fun to watch. We get some size up front that can actual rebound.

(put this together in 2 mins, so it probably isnt anywhere close to realistic)

I like this trade but GS wouldn't do it.

What are you talking about when you say Ellis can't play with Curry? You realize that they have the HIGHEST scoring back court in the NBA right?

Biedrins is the only quality big man they have, they wouldn't give him up just like that. And Ellis is making himself a name as a top 8 player right now so unless Carmelo Anthony is involved, I doubt he leaves Golden State.

 

[elindholm]

What about a trade like this?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25w7mov

For what possible reason would the Cavaliers want Turkoglu?

 

[AzStevenCal]

What about a trade like this?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25w7mov

We get rid of the WEAKEST center in the NBA who gets injured if a tissue falls on him, for a guy who can blossom given the playing time.

Plus we get Hickson who if anyone else remembers, almost became a Sun last February.

I wouldn't mind the deal for Phoenix but why would Cleveland want to pick up all that salary without actually improving their lineup?

Steve

 

[Michael]

Beidrins/Ellis for Turk/Richardson - GS is struggling, Ellis cant play with Curry. They get an expiring SG and unload two of their largest contracts.

Lopez for Randolph. NY gets a C and Amare can play PF. Randolph steps in and gives us some front court presence.

Beidrins/Barron
Randolph/Frye
Hill/Warrick/Dudley
Ellis/Chill/Dudley
Nash/Dragic

Except for Nash/Hill this is a young team that would be fun to watch. We get some size up front that can actual rebound.

(put this together in 2 mins, so it probably isnt anywhere close to realistic)

I don't think Ellis could play with Nash, either. JRich seems like a far better fit. He doesn't need the ball as frequently as Ellis, and he has a post-up game, too. Biedrins would be pretty nice to have, though.

 

[Errntknght]

Folster, I

'm not sure Speights helps us too much, but he's shown a lot more than Clark. Anybody know what the knock on him is? I assume, it's lack of defense which means he's a perfect fit.

I haven't watched him play so I can't speak about his D, but part of the problem he has is that Philly is doing pretty well going with smaller lineups. They have one their three centers (Hawes, Speights, Battie) on the floor only three quarters of the time. Their two PFs (Brand, Songaila) combine for even less.

Speights is the best rebounder among their centers by a small margin but he's the worst for fouls and TOs by a considerable margin (this year). None of them get to the line a significant amount. (In fact the team as whole doesn't get many FTs - about 5 less/game than Phoenix.) Anyway I take that to mean Speights is not much of an inside scorer. The minutes for the three centers through 22 games are: Hawes 404, Speights 244, Battie 167.

He'd probably be an improvement over Barron, whose fairly convincingly shown that his seven games with the Knicks last year were a fluke as far as rebounding goes - he's right at his pre-Knick level with us. Speights would score more though I would expect Barron to improve because he's at about half of his career FG%. On the basis of their career stats Speights is better pretty much across the board but not by a big margin - points is his biggest edge, 19.6 vs 13.4 per 40min. Hmmmm, he only takes 2.5 more shots per 40, so that is quite a significant scoring edge.

We might as well trade Clark for him because if Clark can't get playing time with the team desperate for bigs I don't see how he ever will. I still wish Gentry would have given Clark as good of an opportunity to prove something as he has Barron. I wouldn't really expect him to look better but I just hate to let a guy with the physical tools go without finding out for sure he can't contribute.

 

[Chaplin]

What about a trade like this?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=25w7mov

We get rid of the WEAKEST center in the NBA who gets injured if a tissue falls on him, for a guy who can blossom given the playing time.

Plus we get Hickson who if anyone else remembers, almost became a Sun last February.

It's funny what you say about Lopez, and yet assume Cleveland would take him? And take Hedo along with him??

 

[Mainstreet]

It's funny what you say about Lopez, and yet assume Cleveland would take him? And take Hedo along with him??

That's what is wrong with most home team fans trade proposals. They think the trading partner will give something good in return for players that may not help the other team. Although it hurts, most successful trades occur when both teams benefit. Can't expect something for nothing.

 

[Superbone]

For what possible reason would the Cavaliers want Turkoglu?

He's the LeBron of Turkey?

 

[mojorizen7]

Coro suggested the Suns may/should look at Marreese Speights who may be available. I don't know why he's not playing, but I certainly wouldn't mind trading a pick + Clark for him.

As far as Dec. 15th, that applies to Childress, Frye and Warrick. I don't think Childress has much trade value right now. He is making $6.5M this year, with four more years under contract. Trading Childress is not really an option.

Frye may hold some value, but he is actually contributing this season. He won't be traded nor should he. No point trading a big for a big, unless the big we'd be getting is super-talented.

Warrick has played well enough that his trade value might have gone up a bit. But he's about the only player we have who has been able to execute pick-and-rolls consistently. Trading a capable PF away when that's the position you are trying to fill is probably not a good idea. Warrick could still start later on when Lopez comes back and plays better.

So our trading options are very limited. No one is going to take Turkoglu off our hands and actually give us someone useful in return. The only options imo are to either trade Richardson for a high-salaried player like Dalembert, which obviously carries its risks, or to try to swap Clark + pick for a low salaried one like Anythony Randolph, Hickson, or Speights. It may not be enough to get those.

Good post Griff,but i don't get this part.
He shouldn't be traded because we'd just be trading a big for a big?
Frye is tall,but he's not a "big." If he were to be traded,i would want either:
a) a true big
b) a player who's versatile
c) a player who's tough
Frye is none of those things.
So if you meant that we shouldn't trade Frye for another tall,skinny,jump shooting softy then yeah....he shouldn't be traded. Unless of course the new tall,skinny jump shooting softy we'd be trading for comes as an expiring contract.

 

[sunsfan88]

For what possible reason would the Cavaliers want Turkoglu?

Because the Cavs lack a playmaker.

PHX was the wrong place for Turkoglu cause we already have many playmakers on this aka Nash, J-Rich etc.

With no possible "big time" free agents coming up in the next few off seasons and next year's draft looking dull since most underclass men not declare for the draft due to the CBA situation, the Cavs would be lacking a playmaker for a while or they can gamble on Turkoglu.

He needs a situation like Orlando where there are just spot up shooters around him (in CLE it'd be Mo Williams, Moon, Gibson etc) and a guy to clean up the boards (Varejou & Jamison)

Plus they get to trade away disgrutled JJ Hickson for some value. They get trade exceptions and draft picks also.

 

[sunsfan88]

I wouldn't mind the deal for Phoenix but why would Cleveland want to pick up all that salary without actually improving their lineup?

Steve

CHeck out above post.

And thank you for not being rude while questioning the trade

 

[sunsfan88]

It's funny what you say about Lopez, and yet assume Cleveland would take him? And take Hedo along with him??

First of all I never said Cleveland would want Lopez.

Secondly yea cause sometimes a new scenario is what is needed for someone to play well.


And besides, he'd be playing backup for Gasol in Memphis so there's no pressure of being a starting center.

Refer to above post for Hedo reference.

 

[Griffin]

I still disagree with that. The "useful" player would have to be overpaid and on a negative-value contract, but such a trade wouldn't be impossible, and it could potentially help the Suns.

For example, Orlando would probably accept Turkoglu/JRichardson/Warrick for Lewis/Gortat/QRichardson. It gets them out of Lewis's contract, which is much worse than Turkoglu's, and makes them more dynamic offensively. Do I like that trade for Phoenix, no, but it might not be a complete disaster.

I suppose if you package Turkoglu with other players then it's possible, but it would require the Suns to give up someone who has value and probably take less value in return. I don't think Turkoglu alone can be traded.

Good post Griff,but i don't get this part.
He shouldn't be traded because we'd just be trading a big for a big?
Frye is tall,but he's not a "big." If he were to be traded,i would want either:
a) a true big
b) a player who's versatile
c) a player who's tough
Frye is none of those things.
So if you meant that we shouldn't trade Frye for another tall,skinny,jump shooting softy then yeah....he shouldn't be traded. Unless of course the new tall,skinny jump shooting softy we'd be trading for comes as an expiring contract.

When I said "big" I meant the Phoenix Suns definition of big. Say what you will about Frye's lack of toughness, but he's actually been playing well for us this year and has been one of our more consistent players on both ends of the floor. So trading him for someone who may be traditionally big but hasn't proven he can start and play consistently well may be too risky, since we might end up with even fewer capable front-court players. I would much rather trade a wing in such a scenario.

 

[sunsfan88]

That's what is wrong with most home team fans trade proposals. They think the trading partner will give something good in return for players that may not help the other team. Although it hurts, most successful trades occur when both teams benefit. Can't expect something for nothing.

How about a trade like this? Makes sense for all 3 teams.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2e2dgzq

Orlando gets to get rid of Carter's contract and can welcome Turkoglu back along with J-Rich. Gives them TWO other scorers to compliment Howard. Of course taking Hedo is a risk but at least there's history between them and + they got rid of Carter's contract. Not to mention how good a player Richardson is.

Knicks get Lopez who played well along with Amare. They trade away a player just watching on the bench to get a player who can possibly make a huge impact. Also they get good depth at the PF position with Warrick backing up Amare.

Suns finally get a traditional PF. The guy was playing well with Golden State but he's getting no opportunity in NY because of Amare and we all know how much D'Antoni likes to use the bench. I don't have any doubt he can fit in perfectly with us. Then we get Gortat who is 10 times better than Lopez. He's a starting center anywhere in the NBA. One of the best mobile and defensive minded centers in basketball.

Then we can re-develop our bench from last season. Bass gets Lou's role and Pietrus gets Barbosa's role. Dragic, Dudley and Frye all continue to play the same role they had last season.

Only bad thing is that we get Carter but Nash can make him look good I think. He can drive and shoot 3s like J-Rich but is just very inconsistent. However everything can't be perfect so we acquire him.

PG: Nash, Dragic
SG: Carter, Pietrus
SF: Hill, Dudley, Childress
PF: Randolph, Bass, Clark
C: Gortat, Frye

^^^turns us into contenders.

 

[jagu]

Gortat Randolph frontcourt turns us into contenders? No way man. And we give up Hakim Warrick , Jrich, and Rolo? WTH? I hope your never the GM of the Suns.

 

[Superbone]

Gortat Randolph frontcourt turns us into contenders? No way man. And we give up Hakim Warrick , Jrich, and Rolo? WTH? I hope your never the GM of the Suns.

Odds are you're safe.

 

[sunsfan88]

Gortat Randolph frontcourt turns us into contenders? No way man. And we give up Hakim Warrick , Jrich, and Rolo? WTH? I hope your never the GM of the Suns.

We have no use for Warrick if we get Randolph. Losing J-Rich sucks but if thats whats needed to be successful, then gotta do it. And yea Lopez was only good due to the attention Amare attracted.

Gortat & Randolph frontcourt>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Barron & Frye

And please don't say Lopez will be starting with Frye. I am willing to bet you my next pay check that he gets injured within 2 weeks and then will be out for another month or so.

Even if he's healthy, he sucks.

 

[sunsfan88]

O yea and I'd rather have Bass than Warrick anyway.

Bass averages close to 11 pts and 6 boards and plays great defense.

Warrick averages 12 pts, 4 boards and is the worst defender on the team. (yes worse than Nash)

 

[sunsfan88]

I hope your never the GM of the Suns.

I'm glad your not either.

We'd probably be team made full of wings for the next 5-6 seasons if many on here made the decisions.

 

[Chaplin]

I'm glad your not either.

We'd probably be team made full of wings for the next 5-6 seasons if many on here made the decisions.

Huh? You consistently have such interesting comments. 95% of this board HATES that we have so many wings, so I'm not sure what exactly you're generalizing about.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Huh? You consistently have such interesting comments. 95% of this board HATES that we have so many wings, so I'm not sure what exactly you're generalizing about.

He was probably talking about me. I was planning on becoming GM and putting together a team of 12 Michael Jordans.

Steve

 

[BC867]

He was probably talking about me. I was planning on becoming GM and putting together a team of 12 Michael Jordans.

Steve

Nine Michael Jordans. Remember that the Bulls rotated three legitimate role-playing Centers in their lineup. 'Worked pretty well!

 

[Mulli]

He was probably talking about me. I was planning on becoming GM and putting together a team of 12 Michael Jordans.

Steve

I hope you have a team rule against "Hitler-like" mustaches.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I hope you have a team rule against "Hitler-like" mustaches.

No, I was gonna make them mandatory. I want to make sure my new team gets noticed and I'm not sure having 12 people that look and play exactly the same will get anyone's attention.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

Huh? You consistently have such interesting comments. 95% of this board HATES that we have so many wings, so I'm not sure what exactly you're generalizing about.

Yea that's exactly why everyone gets so butt hurt when talking about dealing one of the SFs.