Thomas NOT returning

[Cheesebeef]

okay - so who's next? Is this franchise going to mvoe quickly as the previous regime, making people it known to people how much they're valued by us, or are we going after EVERYONE looking for a Suns discount.

If anyone can recall, that ain't how we got Nash and it ain't how we got Bell.

 

[Billy Bob]

In Dantoni's system where everyone has the green light, I think we will find another diamond in the rough. Dantoni has a way of bringing out talent that others didn't think they had.

 

[Evil Ash]

Again reading the la times, the clippers have given cassell the two year deal he wants, but not at the money he wants. It'll be interesting to see if he takes it, i'm guessing he will.

Depends on if its over the value of the MLE. If it isn't I'm guessing he goes to the Lakers

I'm not at all worried how this move makes the clippers tougher, just worried as to how it effects our depth (not necessarily talent).

If you can get 2 decent players that are backups then, you've made up for it. We'll just have to see what happens now

 

[Nash]

12 mil for 3 yrs is the highest I would've been comfortable with for TT. Sigining him any longer would've been a big gamble considering his rep as a lazy guy, since he will be 33 then. We really cannot afford that kind of deadweight.

 

[sunsfn]

You win in the playoffs with veteran ballplayers. TT was a veteran that seems to play better in the playoffs. He is up and down during the year and the suns know that and D'Antoni even talked about it.
You can not win a championship without good players off the bench. (Miami heat!)

If Amare comes back healthy it will make a large difference how the suns do in the playoffs next year, but how about those games where Amare and KT pick up a couple fouls in the first quarter and you need to go to the bench. Or, someone gets injured!! That is when a guy like TT is really valuable. It is extremly hard to find a 6' 10" player with his skills that can play 20 minutes and do what he does. He is not afraid of anybody on the opposing team, and wants to take (and makes) the big shot if needed, and even though he does not always play great defense, he played some very good defense in the playoffs when needed. The part of TT that I will really miss other than his offense, is the way he protected Nash a few times with hard fouls and even a shove to another player just to let them know to leave him alone. I have not seen anyone of the suns do that for years, including Amare, and now TT will not be there for that toughness that he gave us in the later part of the season and the playoffs.
Do not underestimate TT when it comes to winning big games, I think the Suns just did.

 

[Covert Rain]

In Dantoni's system where everyone has the green light, I think we will find another diamond in the rough. Dantoni has a way of bringing out talent that others didn't think they had.

Thats a big if.

Depends on if its over the value of the MLE. If it isn't I'm guessing he goes to the Lakers



If you can get 2 decent players that are backups then, you've made up for it. We'll just have to see what happens now

That's another Big If.

Guys we need more then body's to round out this roster. We MUST get at least an impact player now that TT is not resigning.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Offer the full MLE to Zo.

We'll do to Miami what the Clips did to us.

Miami is saying, "we'd love to have you back Zo, but we can only offer the minimum."

We can say, "we love you Zo, and you can win a title here too."

 

[hsandhu]

Yeah, honestly 12 million over 3 years is about as high as I would've gone too.

And I would've assumed that would've got it done the way tim was talking, and I think the suns did too.

The difference is they are running the organization, so they should have known whether it could have gotten it done, before not taking shannon brown. They screwed up royally in that respect.

p.s: tim living in la probably had a significant amount to do with this too.

 

[Covert Rain]

Offer the full MLE to Zo.

We'll do to Miami what the Clips did to us.

Miami is saying, "we'd love to have you back Zo, but we can only offer the minimum."

We can say, "we love you Zo, and you can win a title here too."

Zo is old but I think he has more value then Brian Grant did last year. I like this move.

I would also like to see Eddie House back now. He knows the system.

 

[Evil Ash]

Thats a big if.






That's another Big If.

Guys we need more the body's to round out this roster. We MUST get at least an impact player now that TT is not resigning.

No we don't. I think people are massively overvalueing TT here.

Yes he helped us in the playoffs a great deal but he's well known for being lazy and what is needed from our bench is not nearly as much with Amare and KT coming back.

We need someone that will let Nash rest and play about 15 min at most and preferably a bigger player to help with our interior D.

We don't need scorers and we don't need superstars, we need decent bench players

 

[Covert Rain]

No we don't. I think people are massively overvalueing TT here.

Yes he helped us in the playoffs a great deal but he's well known for being lazy and what is needed from our bench is not nearly as much with Amare and KT coming back.

We need someone that will let Nash rest and play about 15 min at most and preferably a bigger player to help with our interior D.

We don't need scorers and we don't need superstars, we need decent bench players

He wasn't well known for being lazy for us. He was out of the rotation in Chicago. He had a huge impact in the playoffs.

I would say IF anything Tim Thomas would be a decent player off the bench. That is what he would have been. The Suns didn't have a problem with his work ethic did they?

I am not overstating TT. I am being real about what is out there in the Free agent market. Show me another free agent with his size and scoring ability that can come off the bench? There isn't one.

Having said that...I would like to see them try and Get RAD, ZO and bring back Eddie House.

 

[hsandhu]

What do people think about this. Sign Aaaron williams for cheap, just to give us a big body to throw on post players.

Then use all the remaining money for the best perimiter player you can get. Don't know who that is, but will look.

You then have a great 8 man rotation, with the 9th guy getting 10 mins a game.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Yeah, honestly 12 million over 3 years is about as high as I would've gone too.

And I would've assumed that would've got it done the way tim was talking, and I think the suns did too.

The difference is they are running the organization, so they should have known whether it could have gotten it done, before not taking shannon brown. They screwed up royally in that respect.

p.s: tim living in la probably had a significant amount to do with this too.

There is a moratorium in talking to their own FA's. I imagine they did talk to Tim, in the plane, locker room etc.

But they couldn't talk to the agent. And that agent is Arn Tellem, and its obvious he absolutely hates Sarver (remember the story about Sarver hanging up on him last year during the JJ negotiations).

Tim: I'm signing with the Suns.
Arn: No, you aren't son.
Tim: Why not? That's where I said I want to be!
Arn: The Clippers are offering you twice as much, you'll likely start, and you are going to get more playing time in Phoenix. BTW, don't you think you all would have beaten the Suns if you were on the Clips team?
Tim: Yeah, I guess. You're the boss.
Arn: (under breath) Teach you not to hang up on me, Sarver.

 

[hsandhu]

There is a moratorium in talking to their own FA's. I imagine they did talk to Tim, in the plane, locker room etc.

But they couldn't talk to the agent. And that agent is Arn Tellem, and its obvious he absolutely hates Sarver (remember the story about Sarver hanging up on him last year during the JJ negotiations).

Tim: I'm signing with the Suns.
Arn: No, you aren't son.
Tim: Why not? That's where I said I want to be!
Arn: The Clippers are offering you twice as much, you'll likely start, and you are going to get more playing time in Phoenix. BTW, don't you think you all would have beaten the Suns if you were on the Clips team?
Tim: Yeah, I guess. You're the boss.
Arn: (under breath) Teach you not to hang up on me, Sarver.

True, but the suns should've taken the tellem factor into account.

 

[Covert Rain]

Saver PO someone? PO a free agent? You don't say?!

 

[Evil Ash]

He wasn't well known for being lazy for us. He was out of the rotation in Chicago. He had a huge impact in the playoffs.

How many games did he play for us? Also notice it was a contract year for him...

He's pretty much useless in the regular season but a good player in the playoffs

I would say IF anything Tim Thomas would be a decent player off the bench. That is what he would have been. The Suns didn't have a problem with his work ethic did they?

Coach admitted he'd have to adjust due to TT's work ethic during the regular season. He shows up for the playoffs but thats about it. Having a good work ethic for a playoff run during a contract year doesn't show his true work ethic.

It shows that he shows up for the playoffs or that he's just trying to get paid. Losing him for the playoffs would hurt but losing him for the regular season does NOT.

I am not overstating TT. I am being real about what is out there in the Free agent market. Show me another free agent with his size and scoring ability that can come off the bench? There isn't one.

We don't need scoring. We need defense, rebounding, and somebody that will let Nash rest.

Having said that...I would like to see them try and Get RAD, ZO and bring back Eddie House.

Zo isn't coming here

 

[Goldfield]

Offer the full MLE to Zo.

We'll do to Miami what the Clips did to us.

Miami is saying, "we'd love to have you back Zo, but we can only offer the minimum."

We can say, "we love you Zo, and you can win a title here too."

I would LOVE that....

 

[Cheesebeef]

There is a moratorium in talking to their own FA's. I imagine they did talk to Tim, in the plane, locker room etc.

But they couldn't talk to the agent. And that agent is Arn Tellem, and its obvious he absolutely hates Sarver (remember the story about Sarver hanging up on him last year during the JJ negotiations).

Tim: I'm signing with the Suns.
Arn: No, you aren't son.
Tim: Why not? That's where I said I want to be!
Arn: The Clippers are offering you twice as much, you'll likely start, and you are going to get more playing time in Phoenix. BTW, don't you think you all would have beaten the Suns if you were on the Clips team?
Tim: Yeah, I guess. You're the boss.
Arn: (under breath) Teach you not to hang up on me, Sarver.

wow - the above is simply the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Ever think SARVER may be the problem here if he's hanging up on people, letting FA walk, doing chicken dances, basically saying BC did mean squat to the organization, prancing out Amare as our #1 pick this year. IF we all think he's a boob out in the open, what kind of guy do you think he is behind clsoed doors?

 

[JCSunsfan]

True, but the suns should've taken the tellem factor into account.

I agree.

This is a big loss, no matter how you look at it. We have injury issues in our front court. Thomas was the insurance policy to get us through the season. He mattered alot to the front office, or they would have taken draft picks.

I am usually a "cup half full" type. But this one is hard.

Looks to me like this is going to be Sarver's MO. Always trying to win on a dime. They better give Diaw a good offer now.

Water under the bridge. Time to move forward.

 

[Goldfield]

No we don't. I think people are massively overvalueing TT here.

Yes he helped us in the playoffs a great deal but he's well known for being lazy and what is needed from our bench is not nearly as much with Amare and KT coming back.

We need someone that will let Nash rest and play about 15 min at most and preferably a bigger player to help with our interior D.

We don't need scorers and we don't need superstars, we need decent bench players

Joel Przybilla & Bobby Jackson Are Ideal....

 

[Covert Rain]

How many games did he play for us? Also notice it was a contract year for him...

He's pretty much useless in the regular season but a good player in the playoffs



Coach admitted he'd have to adjust due to TT's work ethic during the regular season. He shows up for the playoffs but thats about it. Having a good work ethic for a playoff run during a contract year doesn't show his true work ethic.

It shows that he shows up for the playoffs or that he's just trying to get paid. Losing him for the playoffs would hurt but losing him for the regular season does NOT.



We don't need scoring. We need defense, rebounding, and somebody that will let Nash rest.



Zo isn't coming here

OMG. Useless? He is far from useless in the regular season. He might turn it up a gear in the playoffs. However, TT was also rumoured to be unhappy there. That has alot to do with it. Doesn't make it right.

However, TT was still a big body coming off the bench. Yes we need defense and rebounding. However, if you can't find that in free agency then at the very least you need to keep the players that can make an impact.

 

[Evil Ash]

Joel Przybilla & Bobby Jackson Are Ideal....

Ideal, yes. Realistic, no.

Big men are at a premium and Pryzbilla had a very good year last year so he'll get the MLE from somebody

 

[Cheesebeef]

yeah - the TT is usless comment is just completely full of crap. He's a consistent 11 points per game scorer in about 30 minutes per game and then his game ALWAYS elevates in the playoffs, contract year or not. But hey, what's the big deal. We can now look for the next guy who will take the Suns discount (although we really haven't shown ANYONE HAS EVER TAKEN THAT DISCOUNT).

 

[JCSunsfan]

wow - the above is simply the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Ever think SARVER may be the problem here if he's hanging up on people, letting FA walk, doing chicken dances, basically saying BC did mean squat to the organization, prancing out Amare as our #1 pick this year. IF we all think he's a boob out in the open, what kind of guy do you think he is behind clsoed doors?

I think that was my point. Of course, I don't think much of Tellem either. Sarver said Tellem was dropping F-bombs on him so he hung up.

Pretty childish on both their parts.

I guess that Sarver is finding out that negotiations in the sports world are a little bit different than negotiations in the banking world.

 

[Covert Rain]

yeah - the TT is usless comment is just completely full of crap. He's a consistent 11 points per game scorer in about 30 minutes per game and then his game ALWAYS elevates in the playoffs, contract year or not. But hey, what's the big deal. We can now look for the next guy who will take the Suns discount (although we really haven't shown ANYONE HAS EVER TAKEN THAT DISCOUNT).

The days of the Suns drawing people here for nothing are gone. Sarver has PO enough free agents and their Agents that I don't think it's a forgone conclusion anymore.

JC not owning the team anymore is a big impact. Even the national media is saying Sarver is a business man first. So if the national media sees him as cheap (whether that is totally accurate or not), how do you think the rest of the leagues players see him?