Trade Stanton - Barkley new #2

[cardncubfan]

Good post. Confirms what many of us have been saying.

The list also has RG III ahead of Palmer. Would you rather have him over Palmer?

 

[devilalum]

But he's got the best sideline touchdown dance in the game.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Anyone taking too much stock in the 4th preseason game is fooling themselves. Barkley had his best preseason game as a Cardinal and that is encouraging as he may develop into a potential backup QB someday. To put all of our eggs into the Barkley basket as our only backup at QB is lunacy.

 

[Redneck Voodoo]

I would estimate about a third of the leagues current #2's would be an upgrade over Stanton. I would take any of these #2's right now over Stanton:
Garapollo
Prescott
Glennon
Kap (yea I said it)
McCarron
Nassib
Weeden
McCown (yes, I would bring back McCown at #2)

If you mean what Card's #2, that isn't a valid argument to me. In recent (AZ Cards) history the Cards haven't even had a quality starting QB outside of Warner and Palmer. Part of the reason for success we've had in recent history was having a quality QB that could run an offense. Of course a quality coach, GM and all that has brought for both sides of the ball in the BA era is huge, but if you have second rate QB who is concerned with the #2. The reason everyone is concerned with our #2 is because we have a lot to lose... we have a QB who is effective more often than not but an amazing team as a whole. If you have an ineffective QB (can't move the ball, turns the ball over) it makes it extremely difficult to win games and near impossible to win in the post season. We have a team that can go very far and it doesn't rely on a QB putting up 4,500+ yds. I believe that with our D and run game we could still go far with consistent but average QB play (game manager), which Stanton won't deliver.

We have a lot to lose if Palmer is lost since we don't have a quality backup. Palmer is getting older and Palmer getting injured is a real possibility. Remember, Palmer is good but no Brady or Rodgers.

The other reason a #2 is so important is the same reason... Palmer is getting older, he has one more year left on his contract, so quite possibly just one more season left with us, but an injury can end that any time. Stanton is not the future, he will never be our #1. If we're going to use the excuse to keep Stanton around that our playbook is so hard and takes soooo long to master, then that same logic should dictate we should already have our future #1 sitting in the #2 slot and being groomed to learn the system.

That list above are not all people I believe could be our future, I'm just saying I think all of them are better than Stanton. What I would have liked to see was the Cards to draft a prospect and try to build them up. I was hoping for Cardale Jones to get picked up by us since I thought he was the best QB for the value as a prospect pick in the 4th or 5th round. They didn't, and right now Barkley is the only option we really have available at the moment to try progress that position. Trust me, I'm surprised I'm even lobbying for Barkley because I thought it was another pointless QB move on their part. But contrasting Stanton's performance again I'm ready to put some development into almost anyone else. I'm not saying cut Stanton, just either let someone compete for the position and/or bring in someone who is actually going to be developed in earnest to see if they can be our future #1.

He showed progress, so let's try in earnest to see what's what. Each preseason we see flashes of potential from new QBs and utter crap from Stanton and instead of looking to upgrade the guy that is playing terrible we cut loose the guy that outplayed him. Have you ever seen Stanton outplay the lower QBs in the last couple preseasons... no. We had this same debate last preseason and thank goodness we didn't need Stanton or I guarantee you would be singing a different tune. We barely squeaked by on many of those wins with CP.

If we keep going down the road of bringing in camp arms with no real intention of ever trying improve beyond Stanton we never will. All that will happen is that we keep Stanton and if we do bring in someone who plays well they likely won't clear waivers and we will never get a chance to develop them. If we are lucky they go on PS but never get meaningful reps. Either way odds are we will have a perpetual Lindley for our #3 until Stanton becomes our #1 because we didn't work towards upgrading that deficit and our Lindley-like #3 becomes our #2.

Since they are never going to look to replace Stanton the only way we will ever get our next starter is for the Cards to carry 3 QBs on active roster, draft an unknown quantity and start them, or trade for a retread and hope that we get lucky for a third time and they get have a resurgence in the valley. The last option barely ever works, so having it work again seems a lot less likely than having the luxury to develop prospects over the next two years while we do have a starter.

Oh well, fingers cross again Palmer doesn't get hurt. Why even bother carrying two QBs on the roster if we're going to use the premise that the season is always lost anyways when a #1 QB is lost and we're not using the #2 spot to develop our future #1.

I'm not trying to argue with you, I was just curious who's #2 you would prefer. I would even agree with a couple of your choices but, Kap? McCarron? Freaking Weeden? C'Mon Man!

 

[BigRedRage]

Anyone taking too much stock in the 4th preseason game is fooling themselves. Barkley had his best preseason game as a Cardinal and that is encouraging as he may develop into a potential backup QB someday. To put all of our eggs into the Barkley basket as our only backup at QB is lunacy.

I just like his accuracy and i dont think accuracy has anything to do with level of competition.

 

[DVontel]

I'm not trying to argue with you, I was just curious who's #2 you would prefer. I would even agree with a couple of your choices but, Kap? McCarron? Freaking Weeden? C'Mon Man!

Nassib is the worst one on that list.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I just like his accuracy and i dont think accuracy has anything to do with level of competition.

I've watched Barkley at training camp and during the preseason games. His accuracy has been all over the place. The reason the Cardinals had so much success last night is that they were winning the battle in the trenches on both sides of the ball.

On offense I was very encouraged by the play of Boehm and Toner. I also thought that Wetzel flashed some ability. These guys were blasting the Broncos backups off the line of scrimmage the entire game. Barkley had the luxury of that dominate running game which had the Bronco D on their heels the entire game. With that said Barkley made some great throws but he also has a few questionable throws. Right now I think he is destined for the practice squad.

 

[Buckybird]

Let's be honest here, BA ain't getting rid of Stanton!!!

With that said, I've got a Jake Plummer bobble head that passes better lol

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Accuracy matters though

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

It certainly matter, but in this offense with this running game.....not as much as other teams.

Stanton has concerns going into the offseason, but Barkley looked HORRIBLE, worse than Stanton, in every game he played except last night.

 

[BigRedRage]

I've watched Barkley at training camp and during the preseason games. His accuracy has been all over the place. The reason the Cardinals had so much success last night is that they were winning the battle in the trenches on both sides of the ball.

On offense I was very encouraged by the play of Boehm and Toner. I also thought that Wetzel flashed some ability. These guys were blasting the Broncos backups off the line of scrimmage the entire game. Barkley had the luxury of that dominate running game which had the Bronco D on their heels the entire game. With that said Barkley made some great throws but he also has a few questionable throws. Right now I think he is destined for the practice squad.

When I was watching Boehm, I thought he was playing very well. I wonder if it is just the mental thing keeping AQ as the starter.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I think you're spoiled with the Card's success. Scud couldn't hold Stanton's jock, bro.

Scud is currently the backup in Carolina by the way. Maybe that will offer something so we can keep back up QB talent relative to the rest of the league.

 

[MadCardDisease]

When I was watching Boehm, I thought he was playing very well. I wonder if it is just the mental thing keeping AQ as the starter.

Yeah I remember reading that Boehm was struggling early on in camp. So I think the coaches decided to go with Shipley early on. However I have seen nothing but improvement from Boehm throughout this preseason. I've keyed on him at training camp and during the preseason games. Everything I have seen from him and from Toner as well has me very excited for both of their futures with this team.

 

[jmt]

This thread is nonsense. Stanton is the backup and we are hosed if Palmer goes down.

 

[crisper57]

I am fascinated to see if Barkley can get through waivers. It would totally suck to have traded for him and to not get anything in return when he leaves the team.

 

[Paso Fino]

The standard against which Barkley seems to be measured is perfection. He has played better during the preseason than either Stanton OR Palmer. I don't know what more could be expected from a new QB candidate.

 

[Mitch]

The standard against which Barkley seems to be measured is perfection. He has played better during the preseason than either Stanton OR Palmer. I don't know what more could be expected from a new QB candidate.

I agree with you. Keim did a good job trading for him. BA likes Stanton even though Stanton the last two pre-seasons has stunk and has never run the offense the way Barkley did last night.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

The thing with Barkley is that he is just now finishing his 1st year in BA's offense...and it seems that the light is finally coming on...especially the last couple of pre-season games. Heck, even a seasoned vet like Palmer needed 1/2 a season, or more, to get really comfortable in BA's offense. Stanton has had how many years in the offense? He still stares down receivers and doesn't visually use the entire field...and I don't think he ever looks comfortable in the pocket. At lease Barkley is showing growth and is looking more the part.

 

[daves]

Going by that list Tebow, Manziel, DA, Sanchez, Clipboard Jesus, & Geno are all better than Stanton. I don't believe the list. I believe the eyeball test & none of those guys are better options.

My eyeball test tells me that Stanton has lost it. He can't execute the most basic throws. He would be a huge liability and turnover machine if called to start.

I might take DA and Sanchez ahead of Stanton. I barfed a little when i mentioned DA but that's how low Stanton has sunk (and DA did go 2-0 with a 105 passer rating the last two times he was called upon to start). Frankly, watching Stanton try to play reminds me almost exactly of watching SCUD.

Sanchez is a turnover machine... well, so is Stanton. At least Sanchez, in his last two years (10 games) as a starter, managed an 86.6 rating. Stanton is at 73.4 with the Cardinals (8 starts), 63.1 before that.

Whitehurst probably IS better than Stanton. That's how bad Stanton is!! Whitehurst started 5 games for an atrocious Titans team in 2014 and put up an 87.4 rating!

RGIII wouldn't be a fit in this offense, or maybe any NFL offense, but even in his awful last two years, he put up numbers in the mid 80's. Who knows whether he'll ever live up to the potential of his amazing 20TD, 5 INT, 7 rushing TD rookie of the year season, but at least he's got potential. Stanton has zero potential.

And for every guy on that list who you want to say is worse than Stanton, there are probably two young guys like AJ McCarron, Dak Prescott, Jimmy Garoppolo, Chase Daniel, Hoyer, Landry Jones, Trevor Siemian, and Paxton Lynch who are arguably already better than Stanton and at least have the potential to improve (and in some cases, be a QBOF).

I don't think anyone would trade even a 7th for Stanton, and i don't even know whether Barkley is an upgrade... but at least he has the potential to be... and at this point, putting Stanton in a game is a recipe for disaster.

...dbs

 

[daves]

The list also has RG III ahead of Palmer. Would you rather have him over Palmer?

Yes, because what i said was that list was the end-all, be-all, definitive definition of who's the best QB the Cardinals, for now and for always.

Come on dude, the list was just a quick way to show how many QBs are out there who have experience in the league who have done better than Stanton. There are a few guys who are listed ahead of Stanton who are not as good as Stanton, at least not in BA's offense. But there are probably dozens of young guys who don't meet the criteria (min 200 attempts) who are better or just as good and with a lot more potential to improve.

For those who think Stanton is one of the best backup QBs in the league, there are enough legit names on that list to show that he's one of the worst.

...dbs

 

[ARZCardinals]

SOOOOO Glad many of you aren't the Cardinals GM!!!!
Barkley was going against players that are cut today....when he played against 2nd and 3rd string....HE STUNK!!!! STUNK!!!
Did you NOT notice yesterdays game was based on a running offense....and again the players he played against 99% won't ever see a regular season game. Putting 1 penny of thought into 'a quality game' based on the 4th preseason game is beyond ignorant.
Stanton, while no world beater can keep this team alive if Palmer gets injured.
Chances of a qb going through a full season healthy are about 25%. You MUST have a backup on the roster to take over....and god forbid it's Barkley.
I'm not trading Stanton for anything less that a 2 and a 4....or a 1...which are both very unlikely.
This team is too good to ride without insurance.

 

[Paso Fino]

The Cardinals are delaying until tomorrow to name their final cuts. It would not surprise me if there was a discussion going on between BA and SK about Barkley. BA seems to have a strong sense of loyalty to Stanton that may color is judgment. SK is more skills and business motivated. SK traded a 7th for Barkley and has an investment in him. Also, posters have said that Stanton's compensation is above 2 million. All things considered, I think SK has the better side of the discussion.

 

[MadCardDisease]

The Cardinals are delaying until tomorrow to name their final cuts. It would not surprise me if there was a discussion going on between BA and SK about Barkley. BA seems to have a strong sense of loyalty to Stanton that may color is judgment. SK is more skills and business motivated. SK traded a 7th for Barkley and has an investment in him. Also, posters have said that Stanton's compensation is above 2 million. All things considered, I think SK has the better side of the discussion.

They are delaying their cuts as they work possible trades to bring in help at CB.

Stanton is going no where.

 

[Jetstream Green]

My thoughts are like this. Stanton is a decent backup and that is it but he is getting up there in age. Barkley is the backup of the future in the very least and that cannot be lessen in importance, because he is smart and can throw an accurate ball but what holds him back seems his reaction time... I doubt Barkley would clear waivers and I would hold onto all three

 

[Proximo]

The Cardinals are delaying until tomorrow to name their final cuts. It would not surprise me if there was a discussion going on between BA and SK about Barkley. BA seems to have a strong sense of loyalty to Stanton that may color is judgment. SK is more skills and business motivated. SK traded a 7th for Barkley and has an investment in him. Also, posters have said that Stanton's compensation is above 2 million. All things considered, I think SK has the better side of the discussion.

This is ridiculous. They are not cutting stanton, a guy they just gave a multi year multi million dollar contract too, because of a couple of subpar preaseason performances. You might as well say they should cut palmer too, because he played nearly as bad.

Likewise I seriously doubt based on one performance they will overlook almost a year of practices and experience with barkley and decide to keep him. Based on reading between the lines they have not been pleased with him, and are looking to upgrade, so I would be very surprised if that one performance gets him a roster spot.

Also Keim is not going to overrule Arians on who he wants as his number 2 QB, that is the coaches decision. It would not shock me at all if we do pick up another qb, but nobody who will be available will be able to learn the system to become the number 2 at any time this season.

Like it or not Stanton is our number 2 for this year, barring him getting killed or disabled before the Season starts.

 

[TJ]

The Cardinals are delaying until tomorrow to name their final cuts. It would not surprise me if there was a discussion going on between BA and SK about Barkley. BA seems to have a strong sense of loyalty to Stanton that may color is judgment. SK is more skills and business motivated. SK traded a 7th for Barkley and has an investment in him. Also, posters have said that Stanton's compensation is above 2 million. All things considered, I think SK has the better side of the discussion.

If they're discussing Barkley, it's about whether or not to keep him on the active roster as QB3. It is well documented that Stanton is solidified as QB2; and it's pure insanity to create false narratives about the situation.

Also, Keim and Arians have a great relationship and I highly doubt that Keim is going to invoke some authority to get Stanton off the team; otherwise, why re-sign him for as much as he did?