Warner says Palmer is best fit for us

BurqueCardFan

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Sorry but you are flat out nuts. Getting a proven franchise QB the MOST important position on the field by far is in no way shape or form one step forward and two steps back. In fact it would be more like 10 steps forward and zero steps back. It's nit even debateable to be honest.

I would agree with you if we were trading for a guaranteed franchise QB like Rodgers, Rivers, Brady, Manning etc... But guys like Palmer and Kolb are not sure fire "franchise" QB's. Both have more questions than answers at this point in time.
 

chickenhead

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I guess the thing is, Beanie is not a surefire starting RB either. The reasonswe hesitate about trading him is his possible value, but that's the only reason Cincinnati would be interested. Williams is the key here.
 

seesred

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I've stated this before I'm in on getting Plamer to the desert. I still think Beanee has a lot in him to give. I would like to see him get a real shot this year. Palmer, the bean, Fitz, and a piece or two on the O-line and we have an offense.

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Chris_Sanders

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Palmer for a 3rd is marginally more appealing to me than Kolb for a 2nd. Palmer also has a huge contract, but the length is shorter. We'll still need to look for a qb of the future, but the cost is less. For those who watched him a lot, Palmer's play last year was pretty frightening, even considering the two stooges.

He threw for almost 4000 yards, had 26 TDs, and a QB rating of 83.

I do not think frightening means what you think it means.
 

JeffGollin

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The most telling thing about Warners comments was that they came in response to a question posed by Wiz who reached out for Kurt's opinion. It says a lot about the way the Cards are going about addressing the QB situation and suggests that the Cards are far from being close to doing any deals (otherwise why ask)?

None of these guys - Kolb, Palmer, McNabb or Bulger - come without flaws (otherwise they'd all have day jobs). We shouldn't expect to get Mr. Perfection from any of these guys.

Logically, what the Cards can hope for is an experienced veteran who can help put 27 - 30 points a game on the scoreboard without giving up many points or much field position due to fumbles, picks or sacks.

I'm not 100% sold that any of these four guys can fill that job description - and can only hope that Kolb brings more than his resume, McNabb has something left in his tank, Bulger can outrun most nose tackles or that Palmer will regain his mojo. None of that is certain.

I tend to favor Palmer a little bit, because he's a bit younger and has prototypical size and arm. What scares me, though, is an uncanny resemblance to Derek Anderson in that both followed really outstanding years with very sucky years. Anderson continued that pattern into this past season with the Cardinals and I'd have to be worried that Palmer might do the very same thing.

Assuming we have a reasonable shot at acquiring Palmer, the question I'd be asking scouts, former teammates (and Palmer) himself is: "Why should we expect him be different than Anderson and play better in AZ than he has recently in Cincy?"

 
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desertdawg

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The most telling thing about Warners comments was that they came in response to a question posed by Wiz who reached out for Kurt's opinion. It says a lot about the way the Cards are going about addressing the QB situation and suggests that the Cards are far from being close to doing any deals (otherwise why ask)?

None of these guys - Kolb, Palmer, McNabb or Bulger - come without flaws (otherwise they'd all have day jobs). We shouldn't expect to get Mr. Perfection from any of these guys.

Logically, what the Cards can hope for is an experienced veteran who can help put 27 - 30 points a game on the scoreboard without giving up many points or much field position due to fumbles, picks or sacks.

I'm not 100% sold that any of these four guys can fill that job description - and can only hope that Kolb brings more than his resume, McNabb has something left in his tank, Bulger can outrun most nose tackles or that Palmer will regain his mojo. None of that is certain.
+1
 

john h

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No one really knows how much serious interest there is in Kolb or what is real value on the trade market is. All we know is the hype that is being put out there and based on some of our post some of us are falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

It seems to me there is a real possibility we could enter August with no CBA. I am really not interested in a partial season. If we lose 3-5 games I just as soon miss the entire season and let the teams and players stew in their own juices. All these FA will be one year older and probably have less value. If the owners really are not getting what they consider a fair return on investment I could see them go all the way with this thing. There is no doubt the players are making a lot of money. That is hardly a question worth asking. Perhaps the retired guys pay needs to be looked at as I am not familiar with their situation.

If you missed an entire season then what would be the draft order? This years draft class would really take a hit as would their agents. Not knowing just what kind of class you drafted for real this year would also present a problem of sorts.
 

ASUCHRIS

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I do not think frightening means what you think it means.

Frightening - to instill complete and total confidence, right?

Look, I know he put up decent numbers last year, and he's probably my favorite option available. (As long as we don't have to give up more than a 2nd)

That being said, did you watch a lot of Bengals games last year? I know I did, and many others here did as well, and they have the same opinion I do; that he made some hellacious mistakes at the most inopportune times that cost the team games. Is there a perfect option on the QB market? Of course not. That being said, while Palmer put up great #'s last year, you cannot ignore his mistakes and the impact they had on games.
 

Arizona's Finest

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Frightening - to instill complete and total confidence, right?

Look, I know he put up decent numbers last year, and he's probably my favorite option available. (As long as we don't have to give up more than a 2nd)

That being said, did you watch a lot of Bengals games last year? I know I did, and many others here did as well, and they have the same opinion I do; that he made some hellacious mistakes at the most inopportune times that cost the team games. Is there a perfect option on the QB market? Of course not. That being said, while Palmer put up great #'s last year, you cannot ignore his mistakes and the impact they had on games.

I saw the same thing bud but I also saw multiple pieces in play that would lead to a bad play that you might interpret as a "bad decision" but really is much more then just that. Carson didn't get stupid overnight and anyone who knows anythign about him will tell you he is a student of the game and very intelligent.

Even the casual fan will tell you he had WR's running poor routes, bad blocking, missed blocks entirely, played in bad weather, and most importantly played in what looked like a 10 play vanilla offense.

Carson's issue is his accuracy isn't what it used to be, which was outerworldy when he was leaving USC and his first couple years.

I think thats an issue with his leg planting, not his decision making.

Its a calculated gamble but if you asked me anybody who would benefit more from a change of scenery and be able to be KW part Deux in terms of production, its Carson.
 

ASUCHRIS

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I saw the same thing bud but I also saw multiple pieces in play that would lead to a bad play that you might interpret as a "bad decision" but really is much more then just that. Carson didn't get stupid overnight and anyone who knows anythign about him will tell you he is a student of the game and very intelligent.

Even the casual fan will tell you he had WR's running poor routes, bad blocking, missed blocks entirely, played in bad weather, and most importantly played in what looked like a 10 play vanilla offense.

Carson's issue is his accuracy isn't what it used to be, which was outerworldy when he was leaving USC and his first couple years.

I think thats an issue with his leg planting, not his decision making.

Its a calculated gamble but if you asked me anybody who would benefit more from a change of scenery and be able to be KW part Deux in terms of production, its Carson.

We're definitely on the same page. All of the available options are a risk, but Carson is the mostly likely option to step in and do a "Warner-lite" impersonation. Further, getting Palmer out of the crap hole that is Cinci, avoiding Baltimore and Pittsburgh twice a year can't hurt. It was funny seeing clips last year of TO and Ocho gator arming and failing to run crisp routes that gives me hope that in our dome with our receivers he can make things happen.

While some are downplaying Warner's opinion, I think he has as good a grasp as to what the offense needs as anyone. The fact that he endorses Palmer is good enough for me.
 

TJ

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KW part Deux in terms of production, its Carson.

How much of this are you drinking? And what are you spiking it with?

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I agree a change in scenery would do him well and he would improve upon his numbers (which were not bad, just 20 ints makes them look bad); however, saying he is effectively KW V. 2.0 is a bit outrageous homie!

The bottom line is he is a significant improvement upon what we have here. I've said multiple times: get Kolb or Palmer in here and our offense is legit again. Hell, our o-line might be motivated to actually do something as well!!
 

AZCARDSFANATIC

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I agree a change in scenery would do him well and he would improve upon his numbers (which were not bad, just 20 ints makes them look bad); however, saying he is effectively KW V. 2.0 is a bit outrageous homie!
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Only outrageous after the fact. Who knew warner was going to be as good as he was when we signed him? He was brought in to back up Leinart. So not exactly cool aid. Prior to comig here and blowing up he was considered to be on the decline. Palmer is very similar to Warner.
 

Mulli

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Only outrageous after the fact. Who knew warner was going to be as good as he was when we signed him? He was brought in to back up Leinart. So not exactly cool aid. Prior to comig here and blowing up he was considered to be on the decline. Palmer is very similar to Warner.
Wait, what?
 

TJ

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Only outrageous after the fact. Who knew warner was going to be as good as he was when we signed him? He was brought in to back up Leinart. So not exactly cool aid. Prior to comig here and blowing up he was considered to be on the decline. Palmer is very similar to Warner.

Warner was brought in to compete w/ McCown in 2005 and won the starting job, while Leinart was still at USC. Warner was still the QB in 2006 when he was drafted until 4 games into the season when his fumblitis continued to haunt him.

The major differences are that Palmer is not in Warner's league and injury circumstances.

You are trying to compare a good QB to a HoFer. When you compare the most productive seasons for both, Warner averaged more TDs, more yards, more yards per attempt and fewer interceptions. And this is with both having two pro bowl receivers on their respective teams (Holt and Bruce - Ocho and Housh). Unless Palmer lights it up from this point forward on a consistent basis, he wont even be considered for the HoF. Not even in 40 years. Warner is a first or second ballot; easy.

As for injuries, the only major injury that Warner suffered was a torn tendon in his thumb (or something along those lines). Palmer had both major knee and Tommy John surgery; both of which carry lingering affects and have undoubtedly diminished his productiveness.

Dont get me wrong, he is a good QB and has the potential to do better in a dome atmosphere in an easier division, but he wont reach Warner's status. The only given is he is 4 times the QB Anderson is and ever was.
 
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None of these guys - Kolb, Palmer, McNabb or Bulger - come without flaws (otherwise they'd all have day jobs)
To be fair - unless Palmer retires or is traded he is still the starter in Cincy.

Orton
Kolb
Hassleback
McNabb
Bulger
Palmer
Are there any others?

Based upon this list there is no question whom I target for acquisition - Palmer. But the Cardinals will probably take the cheapest route...
 

moklerman

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Palmer had both major knee and Tommy John surgery;
I'll ask again because my Google research shows that he didn't have the surgery, he let it heal naturally. Did he actually have this surgery or not? Two different people have offered that he had surgery and I found the opposite.
 

AZCARDSFANATIC

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Warner was brought in to compete w/ McCown in 2005 and won the starting job, while Leinart was still at USC. Warner was still the QB in 2006 when he was drafted until 4 games into the season when his fumblitis continued to haunt him.

Damm crow pie tastes good, I think I need to read a bit more.
 

TJ

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I'll ask again because my Google research shows that he didn't have the surgery, he let it heal naturally. Did he actually have this surgery or not? Two different people have offered that he had surgery and I found the opposite.

He had the surgery.

Incidentally, I did research on Tommy John surgery last year for another athlete and Palmer's name came up as one of the players outside of baseball who had the procedure done.
 

Russ Smith

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He had the surgery.

Incidentally, I did research on Tommy John surgery last year for another athlete and Palmer's name came up as one of the players outside of baseball who had the procedure done.

I don't know because if you google it you find one story after another that says he chose to NOT have the surgery.

There's a bunch that says he may need it, or will have it, but I can't find one that says he actually had it, and there are a bunch that say he chose not to.
 

TJ

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I don't know because if you google it you find one story after another that says he chose to NOT have the surgery.

There's a bunch that says he may need it, or will have it, but I can't find one that says he actually had it, and there are a bunch that say he chose not to.

I still have the article which states it, but it's on another computer.

If I find it I'll post it

Just gotta trust me on this one (for once) ;)
 

Russ Smith

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I still have the article which states it, but it's on another computer.

If I find it I'll post it

Just gotta trust me on this one (for once) ;)

Oh believe me I have no idea what's true, it's just that when I google it all I get is articles saying he will have it, or ones saying he elected not to.
 

TJ

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Oh believe me I have no idea what's true, it's just that when I google it all I get is articles saying he will have it, or ones saying he elected not to.

FWIW, I recall getting the article from EBSCO....
 

moklerman

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I still have the article which states it, but it's on another computer.

If I find it I'll post it

Just gotta trust me on this one (for once) ;)
I'll certainly be interested. There's obviously plenty on is knee surgery out there and there's also information about the thumb surgery he had but everything else seems to indicate he specifically chose against elbow surgery:

http://www.aolnews.com/2009/07/17/carson-palmer-my-elbow-is-100-percent-no-ochocinco-in-my-house/
Carson Palmer: My Elbow Is 100 Percent, No Ochocinco in My House

Jul 17, 2009 – 8:30 PM

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LOS ANGELES -- Carson Palmer is certain about two things: Electing not to have invasive "Tommy John" reconstructive surgery on his damaged throwing elbow was a wise decision.

And the Bengals quarterback will not allow Twitter-loving, attention-grabbing wide receiver and teammate Chad Ochocinco to move into his Southern California home so that the two can do some male-bonding and work out in the backyard before Cincinnati's rookies and veterans report to training camp on July 30.

No way. Forget it.

"That was just a 'Tweet,''' Palmer said with a huge laugh. "I'm not sure where that came from. But the doors are locked, the alarm is on. And he's not getting past my attack dogs. We're good."

What is it with Ochocinco and that Twitter account, anyway? Not a minute goes by without Chad weighing in on his workouts, his mama, what he's eating and -- as Palmer found out – the receiver's travel plans, which at one point included bunking with Cincinnati's quarterback, his wife Shaelyn and their six-month-old twins.

"You know what? I think Chad's mind works faster than his hands [on Twitter],'' Palmer said during his appearance this week on a celebrity studded panel that featured him, Warren Moon, Joe Theismann and Trent Dilfer discussing the 2009 season as part of the L.A. Sports & Entertainment Commission's seventh-annual NFL 101/201 charity event.


Back at his old college playground, the L.A. Memorial Coliseum -- where he starred as a Heisman Trophy winner for USC -- Palmer was relaxed, laughing and absolutely pumped for the start of the 2009 NFL season.

"I'm great. I feel great. I'm 100 percent healthy, throwing, lifting, running all that stuff,'' said Palmer, who played in just four games in 2008 after opting to forgo reconstructive surgery to repair a partially torn ligament and tendon in his right elbow. Instead, Palmer chose to let the tissue damage heal with rest and rehabilitation.

And while he admitted his arm strength wasn't where he wanted it to be during a late June minicamp, Palmer told FanHouse this week he's now 100 percent physically, and confident in his belief that the elbow shouldn't hamper him in 2009.

"It's just a big weight off of my shoulders. I didn't know if I was going to have the 'Tommy John' surgery – I still wouldn't be able to throw, to this day, if I had had that,'' Palmer said. "I'm just thankful I didn't have to go through that. The doctors who said that it would heal were right and it did heal. So I've been throwing, just doing everything to get geared up for the season."

Palmer also shared more on Ochocinco, and his thoughts in general on how he thinks the Bengals' offense will fare this season.

Nancy Gay: "Chad seems committed this offseason to training hard and having a better season than 2008, when he caught only 53 passes and was unsuccessful in forcing a trade. You must be expecting big things from him this season."

Carson Palmer: "Oh yeah. I think he's going to be back to that 'leading the AFC in receiving yards' form. Last year was a down year for our organization and our entire team (4-11-1 record), not just Chad. He's got a lot to prove. He's got a lot of doubters. And that's what really fuels Chad and makes him work, makes him excel. So I'm really excited for Chad and for us this season."

Gay: "In your absence, the offense got a real boost from the addition of running back Cedric Benson. How much of a surprise was it to see him take off in Cincinnati?"

Palmer: "It was a very pleasant surprise. Cedric Benson was the No. 4 overall pick in the draft [by the Chicago Bears in 2005] for a reason. He's fast, explosive, strong -- he's everything you want in a tailback. The longer he was there, the longer he was in Cincinnati, the longer he had to get to know the playbook and the team, the better off he did. And now that he's had an entire offseason under his belt, he'll have a full training camp and have that opportunity to really grow and mesh with the team, he's going to have a huge year."

Gay: "How much better will the Bengals' offensive line be with the addition of first-round draft pick Andre Smith, who is expected to replace Levi Jones at left tackle?"

Palmer: "I think it's great. He's got a ton of potential. He's got to have a great training camp -- I'm not sure when he'll be in camp. But I'm just excited. He's a very physical player. He's really good for our conference as far as the run game is concerned, because he really specializes in the run game. He's going to be taught by one of the better offensive line coaches in the league, as far as pass blocking . So it's going to be a good year for Andre."

Gay: "The loss of wide receiver T.J. Houshmandzadeh -- that must be difficult for you and for everyone because of his production and his leadership. How do you replace a guy like that?"

Palmer: "It's impossible -- we're not looking to replace him. He caught 100 balls a year, he caught eight touchdowns a year. You can try to replace that, but as far as the chemistry standpoint, the leadership, the professionalism, we're not looking to replace that because we can't. We've got a bunch of guys who want to fill in for him and try to pick up where he left off. But (Houshmandzadeh) is a Pro Bowl player for a reason. You don't just all of a sudden just shuffle somebody in.

"We've got a lot of guys who have to pick up the slack from losing him."

Gay: "Have you had a chance to get in much work with free-agent addition Laveranues Coles in the offseason?"

Palmer: "Yeah, Laveranues was there all offseason. We had a chance to work together and get a lot of rhythm and timing going. And we have a lot of time to get that back throughout August."
 
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