Warriors + Cousins = the NBA HAS JUMPED THE SHARK

[SirStefan32]

The problem isn't the signing of Cousins, but the whole situation they have been able to manufacture over the past couple years. Under just about any other cap system they would not have been able to sign KD when they were already as talented as they are. KD would have either stayed in OKC or gone to another team that could realistically have found a way to fit him in. However the way the current cap works they were able to work some magic within the rules to find a way to make it work.

They cleared cap space by getting rid of two starters to be able to sign a free agent. Nothing wrong with that. Again- a free agent signed with a team that had means (cap space in Durant's case, mid-level exemption in Cousins' case.)

 

[Hoop Head]

I could see the league starting to block moves in way to keep the league competitive, we saw when they controlled the Hornets, a Paul trade block to Lakers. The NBA loves to cheat and award the larger media markets. The NBA would love that power

Those two deals can't exist in the same reality. Either the NBA rewards big markets or they don't. Blocking the Paul trade showed they didn't favor large markets. If they did, why block it?

 

[ozzfloyd]

I could see the league starting to block moves in way to keep the league competitive, we saw when they controlled the Hornets, a Paul trade block to Lakers. The NBA loves to cheat and award the larger media markets. The NBA would love that power

That was done as to not lower the value of the Hornets so they could get the best sale price. If they wanted to 'award the larger media markets' they surely wouldn't have nixed the CP to LAL deal...

 

[1tinsoldier]

There is nothing to fix. Free agent signed with a team. That's literally what happened.

literally, free agent signed and it doesn't violate NBA rules.
"there's nothing to fix" is just your opinion
society and sports rightly evolve
you wouldn't say there's "nothing to fix" if there was no lottery rule and the best players always went to NY & LA

don't be afraid of change or a few rules to keep some from gaming the system to unfair advantage

it could absolutely come crashing down in a short period

whether gaming the system backfires eventually or not is irrelevant
the Warriors exposed the flaw
it can and will be exploited again
and the NFL and others here have pointed out ways to fix it

enough whining about the Warriors being picked on

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

The problem isn't the signing of Cousins, but the whole situation they have been able to manufacture over the past couple years. Under just about any other cap system they would not have been able to sign KD when they were already as talented as they are. KD would have either stayed in OKC or gone to another team that could realistically have found a way to fit him in. However the way the current cap works they were able to work some magic within the rules to find a way to make it work.

What has happened with the Warriors is an anomaly and quite a bit of serendipitous timing for their franchise. Their drafting has been superb, but imagine if young Curry had no ankle issues and they had to fork out a much larger contract? Then the worst owner in NBA history sold the franchise to the current owners, then you had the TV deal and the new CBA. I give the Dubs a ton of credit for making it work and learning how to operate within the rules. But there was still a lot of luck. This team is a product of all of this, much of which was completely unforeseeable by the league and totally out of its control.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Those two deals can't exist in the same reality. Either the NBA rewards big markets or they don't. Blocking the Paul trade showed they didn't favor large markets. If they did, why block it?

Because the owners had the final say. But the owners would also reap, the benefits of say stopping Cousins from signing with the Warriors, but allowing him to go to the Lakers. It would be stopped for comptetive reasons, but also would help the leagues pocket at the same time. If you think the NBA wouldn't manipulate things to award the Cash cows Laker or Knicks for example, then your just being extremely short sited.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

They cleared cap space by getting rid of two starters to be able to sign a free agent. Nothing wrong with that. Again- a free agent signed with a team that had means (cap space in Durant's case, mid-level exemption in Cousins' case.)

If I am not mistaken they cleared enough to sign him and then their own free agents signed to go over the cap. That is what I meant by taking advantage of the rules to make it work. If the rules didn't allow this they would have had to not re-sign one of their top players in order to take on Durant.

Unless I am remembering the situation differently and all their top players were still under contract when Durant signed.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Because the owners had the final say. But the owners would also reap. The benefits of say stopping Cousins to sign with the Warriors, but allowing him to go to the Lakers. It would be stopped for comptetive reasons, but also help there own pocket. If you think the NBA wouldn't manipulate things to award the Cash cows Laker or Knicks for example, then your just being extremely short sited.

Can't compare a league owned team trading away that team's best asset for nothing. Additionally, crying Mark Cuban was a huge driving force in that semi-screw job of the Lakers. It all it was BS, but it certainly is not the same as a seriously injured FA becoming the victim of circumstance. Cousins made lemonade out of lemons, that is all.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

That was done as to not lower the value of the Hornets so they could get the best sale price. If they wanted to 'award the larger media markets' they surely wouldn't have nixed the CP to LAL deal...

Of course I was just using the only example of the league blocking a transaction. I am not saying it's the same thing at all.what I am saying is I could see the league starting to block moves like this to safe competitiveness. But once the league was allowed to do that, the NBA would become almost as scripted as WWE, if they started to have the power

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Can't compare a league owned team trading away that team's best asset for nothing. Additionally, crying Mark Cuban was a huge driving force in that semi-screw job of the Lakers. It all it was BS, but it certainly is not the same as a seriously injured FA becoming the victim of circumstance. Cousins made lemonade out of lemons, that is all.

Once again I wasn't saying it was the exact same thing, I was saying the league has showd it cab hop in and stop a transaction. It's just showing it's not out of the realm of possibility, they could start stopping transactions in a effort to keep the league more balanced. I am saying the NBA would manipulate things to make more money if ever given that opportunity if they were given a chance. Like they stopped the Paul trade to protect there financial interest.

I could see them stopping Cousins from Golden State but allowing him to be a Laker, I would never want the NBA to be able to manipulate itself, Lakers and Knicks would always benefit. Never the small market teams

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Once again I wasn't saying it was telling same thing, I was sitting the league stopping a transaction. It's just showing it's not out of the realm of possibility, they could start stopping transactions in a effort to keep the league more balanced. I am saying the NBA would manipulate things to make more money if ever given that opportunity

The only thing the NBA could do in the Cousins situation is to investigate whether or not there was any back-door handshake deals like Minny did with Joe Smith years ago. Otherwise, the league would be violating the CBA.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

The only thing the NBA could do in the Cousins situation is to investigate whether or not there was any back-door handshake deals like Minny did with Joe Smith years ago. Otherwise, the league would be violating the CBA.

I know now, I am saying in the future they will do something to try to stop this and a league stopping a transaction in the name of competition, I could see easily happen if the viewership stops dropping

 

[1tinsoldier]

The problem isn't the signing of Cousins, but the whole situation they have been able to manufacture over the past couple years.

indeed, the defense of Cousins is a distraction
he's not necessarily a weasel given his circumstances
(but we all know he probably is)
(and we all know Durant is definitively a weasel)
(and the Warriors are milking the weasels for their mutual benefit but it really isn't in consideration of the best interest of the company they work for or NBA fans in general)

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

I know now, I am saying in the future they will do something to try to stop this and a league stopping a transaction in the name of competition, I could see easily happen if the viewership stops dropping

I think that is way more complicated than would be effective to limit free agents like that ,otherwise, the designation is worthless. Again, even this occurrence with Cousins is an anomaly...he was inline to get $30 Million per year and then his Achilles busted. There really has been a lot of luck involved for the Warriors...I need some of their good karma in my life.

 

[mojorizen7]

All I can say is that if AD, PG and Westbrook decided to join Booker, there would be far less complaining about Super Teams on this board than there is now.

True, but that wouldn't change the current state of the NBA in terms of competitive parity...which has become a joke.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

indeed, the defense of Cousins is a distraction
he's not necessarily a weasel in his scenario (but we all know he probably is)

How is he weaseling? He was a diminished value FA that most teams were not willing to roll the dice on, so he dictated where his diminished value would be best served (he also called Boston). It makes since the burgeoning franchises would not be willing to risk their future on such an acquisition, but a team like the Warriors has absolutely nothing to lose in this scenario and can take a high risk and not have it kill them. It is not unlike very wealthy investors taking huge risks the average person couldn't , lest they lose everything.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

I think that is way more complicated than would be effective to limit free agents like that ,otherwise, the designation is worthless. Again, even this occurrence with Cousins is an anomaly...he was inline to get $30 Million per year and then his Achilles busted. There really has been a lot of luck involved for the Warriors...I need some of their good karma in my life.

Not as complicated as changing the salary structure of every team in the league, adding a hard cap and franchise tag and all the other stuff mentioned. Cousins was an anomaly, yes so they wouldn't block signing left and right, just the Cousins move. Which shows why I could see them easily implementing a system that allows a league vote or text league itself to block a transaction in a effort to keep the league competitive. If LeBron goes down or Harden, these could be the Globetrotters vs the Generals

 

[Russ Smith]

that does not refute me saying "Cousins could have gotten more than 5 mil from 29 other teams in the league"

...and more playing time to prove himself again

There were teams who could have paid more, there were not 29, and many of the ones who could have, chose not to.


ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski broke down Cousins' near-nonexistent market on SportsCenter (h/t Tommy Beer of NBC Sports):

"The injury played a big part in depressing the market for him, [alongside] the fact that there wasn't salary-cap space in a lot of places. But here's the reality that Cousins had to deal with, and now has to start rectifying in Golden State: his image. There were teams with space who did not want him in their locker room or organization."

 

[Russ Smith]

So all the Suns really have to do is stay the course - the "superteam" fad will run it's course, eventually ending in some kind of crisis for the teams that are following it. I fully expect the Warriors to end up as a wreck of a franchise sooner than anyone else seems to be expecting - there is a certain inevitability to it. Yes, they will have their four or so championships to look back on, but that is more a result of dumb luck than brilliant planning. The Superteam Heat have their two championships to look back on, but it may not be much solace for a fanbase that is now stuck with a team in perpetual mediocrity purgatory.

I'm not sure it will without a hard cap though. You have to realize this is not the NBA some of us grew up with because this is not the basketball some of us grew up with. We're in an era where kids grew up playing on superteams in AAU, in HS and in many cases(Duke and UK specifically) in college. the notion that it's somehow tainted or non competitive is lost on these guys because that's how it's been for them coming up in grassroots basketball now.

Another contributor is the advent of stars playing in USA basketball, that didn't used to be the case but it is now, and not just NBA stars it's all the way down to HS stars. So these guys are playing together, becoming friends, and making plans. Apparently Green and Durant became friends with Cousins that way, on USA basketball.

As Steve said the players had a chance to circumvent the Durant to Warriors move but they chose to take the huge caprise in the first year and that allowed Durant to end up a Warrior. I don't think the players really care they are making moves to maximize money. They believe that playing with other stars increases your chances to cash in marketing wise.

Ultimately they're going to need a hard cap.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

There were teams who could have paid more, there were not 29, and many of the ones who could have, chose not to.


ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski broke down Cousins' near-nonexistent market on SportsCenter (h/t Tommy Beer of NBC Sports):

"The injury played a big part in depressing the market for him, [alongside] the fact that there wasn't salary-cap space in a lot of places. But here's the reality that Cousins had to deal with, and now has to start rectifying in Golden State: his image. There were teams with space who did not want him in their locker room or organization."

The Warriors can be described with one quote:

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Russ Smith]

Not as complicated as changing the salary structure of every team in the league, adding a hard cap and franchise tag and all the other stuff mentioned. Cousins was an anomaly, yes so they wouldn't block signing left and right, just the Cousins move. Which shows why I could see them easily implementing a system that allows a league vote or text league itself to block a transaction in a effort to keep the league competitive. If LeBron goes down or Harden, these could be the Globetrotters vs the Generals

I get your point but I wish people would stop with the Generals and Globetrotters thing. The Generals are TRYING TO LOSE, the rest of the NBA is not.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

I get your point but I wish people would stop with the Generals and Globetrotters thing. The Generals are TRYING TO LOSE, the rest of the NBA is not.

With the Tanking they have in the NBA today, it isn't that crazy of a comparison, there are plenty of teams trying to lose

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

This was written 7 years ago and still holds water:

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/10/17/2496273/nba-lockout-competitive-balance-argument

The NBA has always been a league of dynasties, with few teams able to break through and challenge the hegemony of the dominant franchises.

A recap:

1950-1960: Minneapolis Lakers, four of 10 titles

1960-1970: Boston Celtics, nine of 10 titles

1980-1990: L.A. Lakers, five of 10 titles; Celtics three titles; Detroit Pistons, two titles

1990-2000: Chicago Bulls, six of 10 titles; Houston Rockets, two titles

2000-2010: Lakers, five of 10 titles; San Antonio Spurs, three titles

Those numbers, condensed: Over five separate decades, 74% of the NBA's titles have gone to six franchises. This while the NBA's grown from a 1950s sideshow to a 21st-century corporate juggernaut, where teams sell for hundreds of millions and players make tens of millions and everyone's living a life that would've seemed inconceivable sixty years ago.

So not only is parity a pipe dream that'll never come true, it's beside the point. There's never been any parity in the NBA, and the league's been growing steadily through the decades without it.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2018/7...-kevin-durant-sign-free-agent-2016-salary-cap

With no max deals on the table, Cousins had to look for one-year options to give himself the platform to showcase that his injury hasn’t ruined what we know him to be. Guess which team had a starting center position open and as close to a guaranteed title as ever?

(Hint: the team that actually used their 2016 cap space properly.)

Thus, the Warriors played the salary cap spike to perfection on both ends. When the market was at its most competitive, they won the prize. When the market was completely spent, they won again and bought low on a FIFTH star.

Warriors culture is real, and the braintrust behind it all won and won again. You couldn’t write this script. But if the NBA and the NBPA learned its lesson, you’ll never be able to again.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

The Warriors can be described with one quote:

You must be registered for see images attach

You mean like when they tried to trade Klay Thompson for Dwight Howard?

The Warriors are the luckiest franchise in NBA history. There's been about 30 flukish things that have allowed this dynasty to unfold most notably the once in a lifetime cap spike (it'd be like if there was a salary jump in 2004 and allowed the Lakers to add like Tracy McGrady to Shaq and Kobe) and the odd amount of injuries their playoff opponents seem to come down with.

This signing is laughable and will usher in a hard cap at which point the Warriors will be in their mid-30's and basically done so nothing lasts forever. We just have to deal with their insufferable bandwagoning fans until then.