Was the WR core grossly overrated?

[SoonerLou]

When the Hopkins trade happened I had only four concerns.

1. I didnt expect the offense to change much because whether its whether its Kliff or Kyler issue...we throw lots of short passes.

2. Deshaun Watson was incredible at extending the play and throwing downfield to Hopkins.

3 . The Texans offense despite having Hopkins was average when they didnt have downfield threat Will Fuller.

4. One of the key things to getting Hopkins the ball in space or downfield was under center/play action which put the defense in a bind.

Again Hopkins is great. However, there were things about Kliff's offense, Kyler's lack of stepping up/throwing on the run and supporting cast that had me concerned.


Now for the hard truth...

Larry is getting paid 11 million dollars.....and I'm not sure he's looked that good since the 1st half of last season. He was much smaller, more fluid and got downfield.

Maybe its the lack offseason, but he's moving like a snail and fear...he may be washed. In fairness to Larry shouldnt we put him outside and throw him some backshoulder fades?

Still...I fear he may be done..

Isabella: He's got the speed. However, for an NFL wr shouldnt he have tracked that ball down the sidelines with his hands? I fear he's still in the project stage.

Kirk: I know he's coming off an injury, but thats the problem. The injuries have taken away his twitch. He goes down so easily and doesnt really make that many plays after the catch.

KJ: Might be too slow. Gets open, but him and Kyler have terrible chemistry.

I remember people here sayin we had a top 2 WR core in the league. Sorry, but not even counting TE's Kansas City is far better. Because they are far more explosive (yes they have Mahomes..but every WR runs low 4.4)

I wanted Wirfs or Wills in the draft cause I figured maybe if we improve the we'd get guys downfield.

Watching Lamb and Jeudy (even Ruggs for a bit)...I can see why some here still wanted a WR.

 

[Shane]

Fitz is clearly shot he’s fallen off the cliff.... sucks but true

 

[slanidrac16]

When the Hopkins trade happened I had only three concerns.

1. I didnt expect the offense to change much because whether its whether its Kliff or Kyler issue...we throw lots of short passes.

2. Deshaun Watson was incredible at extending the play and throwing downfield to Hopkins.

3 . The Texans offense despite having Hopkins was average when they didnt have downfield threat Will Fuller.

4. One of the key things to getting Hopkins the ball in space or downfield was under center/play action which put the defense in a bind.

Again Hopkins is great. However, there were things about Kliff's offense, Kyler's lack of stepping up/throwing on the run and supporting cast that had me concerned.


Now for the hard truth...

Larry is getting paid 11 million dollars.....and I'm not sure he's looked that good since the 1st half of last season. He was much smaller, more fluid and got downfield.

Maybe its the lack offseason, but he's moving like a snail and fear...he may be washed. In fairness to Larry shouldnt we put him outside and throw him some backshoulder fades?

Still...I fear he may be done..

Isabella: He's got the speed. However, for an NFL wr shouldnt he have tracked that ball down the sidelines with his hands? I fear he's still in the project stage.

Kirk: I know he's coming off an injury, but thats the problem. The injuries have taken away his twitch. He goes down so easily and doesnt really make that many plays after the catch.

KJ: Might be too slow. Gets open, but him and Kyler have terrible chemistry.

I remember people here sayin we had a top 2 WR core in the league. Sorry, but not even counting TE's Kansas City is far better. Because they are far more explosive (yes they have Mahomes..but every WR runs low 4.4)

I wanted Wirfs or Wills in the draft cause I figured maybe if we improve the we'd get guys downfield.

Watching Lamb and Jeudy (even Ruggs for a bit)...I can see why some here still wanted a WR.

I agree with EVERTHING you said. However, we need to be taking shots downfield on early downs and not waiting until 3rd and 12.
As far as Fitz how can he do anything when he gets 2 balls his way and 1 of them is behind the line of scrimmage which is totally ridiculous?
If we have Hopkins streaking down one side, Issabella down the other side and someone crossing over the middle Kyler has to find the open guy.

in another post I mention how we should have Kyler under center for the reason you mention. Defenses have virtually stopped rushing him and forcing him to find a wr in flooded zones.

 

[Mainstreet]

I don't think Hopkins was 100% and he probably shouldn't have played.

 

[GatorAZ]

Half the teams in the league would take our weapons over their own. It’s on the HC/QB to feed them.

 

[AZCrazy]

If the opposing defense can get pressure with just four, then our passing game isn't going to be very fruitful.

 

[WindCardinal]

Sometimes it’s hard to tell if Fitzgerald is getting open or not because I never really see down the field. I know he was open on that long pass that Kyler threw high. I do know they need to stop throwing to him on screens. Use. Him. To. Block.

 

[kerouac9]

It depends on how you rated them. I think we expected Fitz to basically maintain or not decline much and Kirk to take the next step forward into being a star.

instead, we added a really, really good WR in the same group we had last year. I think if Kyler was playing as well as he did last year, this group wouldn’t look so washed.

 

[WindCardinal]

It depends on how you rated them. I think we expected Fitz to basically maintain or not decline much and Kirk to take the next step forward into being a star.

instead, we added a really, really good WR in the same group we had last year. I think if Kyler was playing as well as he did last year, this group wouldn’t look so washed.

I was on the get Ceedee Lamb train until Simmons was available.. but here early on I’m imagining If we had gone that route..

 

[BritCard]

No. I'm fine with our receivers. I honestly think Fitz and Kirk are capable of 1000 yards each.

This system give them very little to work with. Everything is quick and short. 99% of passes are to comebacks, outs or stationary receivers. There so little thrown in front of a receiver in motion so they can get more yardage or take it to the house.

Basic concepts such as slants and crossing routes don't exist.

Its a tough offense for a WR. So much of the yardage that's there for other receivers just isn't there for them the vast majority of the time.

They are surviving on a diet of scraps.

 

[WindCardinal]

No. I'm fine with our receivers. I honestly think Fitz and Kirk are capable of 1000 yards each.

This system give them very little to work with. Everything is quick and short. 99% of passes are to comebacks, outs or stationary receivers. There so little thrown in front of a receiver in motion so they can get more yardage or take it to the house.

Basic concepts such as slants and crossing routes don't exist.

Its a tough offense for a WR. So much of the yardage that's there for other receivers just isn't there for them the vast majority of the time.

They are surviving on a diet of scraps.

yeah, I just don’t see why they are doing that. Almost all of Hopkins catches are screens, comebacks, or quick outs. I’ll admit I haven’t paid much attention to the route trees of the other receivers, but I live off crossing routes in madden

 

[kerouac9]

No. I'm fine with our receivers. I honestly think Fitz and Kirk are capable of 1000 yards each.

This system give them very little to work with. Everything is quick and short. 99% of passes are to comebacks, outs or stationary receivers. There so little thrown in front of a receiver in motion so they can get more yardage or take it to the house.

Basic concepts such as slants and crossing routes don't exist.

Its a tough offense for a WR. So much of the yardage that's there for other receivers just isn't there for them the vast majority of the time.

They are surviving on a diet of scraps.

pretty much everything about this is wrong.

 

[DVontel]

Larry Fitzgerald hasn’t been a 1K receiver since 2017 but sure he’s still capable of it being 3 years older now

 

[Proximo]

Well I am of two minds on this.

No I don't think our receiving core is very good outside of Hopkins - however a good qb can still be very productive with avg and below avg receivers. Just refer to Brady for the last decade.

I think it is a combination of things - most of our receivers aren't great at getting wide open - which is part of the problem, but I think the bigger problem is either Kyler or Kingsbury or both are refusing to throw it down the field.

 

[BritCard]

pretty much everything about this is wrong.

But it's not. The percentage of passes short or behind the LOS and outside the hashes is far more than any other team. A full 25% of all our passes.

Very few passes are thrown with anticipation to a receiver in motion.

 

[SoonerLou]

It depends on how you rated them. I think we expected Fitz to basically maintain or not decline much and Kirk to take the next step forward into being a star.

instead, we added a really, really good WR in the same group we had last year. I think if Kyler was playing as well as he did last year, this group wouldn’t look so washed.

I think more of the problem that he's exactly the same as a passer.

Throw out the Lions game and he's been pretty much the same.

Last year we didnt throw for much vs. the Panthers either.

I was on the get Ceedee Lamb train until Simmons was available.. but here early on I’m imagining If we had gone that route..

We'd be throwing him screen passes

 

[kerouac9]

But it's not. The percentage of passes short or behind the LOS and outside the hashes is far more than any other team. A full 25% of all our passes.

Very few passes are thrown with anticipation to a receiver in motion.

Those are the passes being thrown, but those aren’t the passes IN THE OFFENSE.

Last weeks final pass to Keesean had Isabella running a crossing route underneath.

Today’s TD pass was an out-breaking route between the hashes (or near them).

Those bubble screens are supposed to open up the middle zones, but we don’t get to them because Fitz is washed and can’t get five yards downfield anymore.

 

[HairZach]

No. I'm fine with our receivers. I honestly think Fitz and Kirk are capable of 1000 yards each.

This system give them very little to work with. Everything is quick and short. 99% of passes are to comebacks, outs or stationary receivers. There so little thrown in front of a receiver in motion so they can get more yardage or take it to the house.

Basic concepts such as slants and crossing routes don't exist.

Its a tough offense for a WR. So much of the yardage that's there for other receivers just isn't there for them the vast majority of the time.

They are surviving on a diet of scraps.

I saw plenty of shallow crossing routes this game, but maybe you're talking about something different. After 3 picks vs. Detroit and a terrible first series Kyler reverted back into being Captain Checkdown. He was afraid of pushing the ball downfield and it showed. I haven't given up on the offense as a whole, but I am so done with those sideline WR screens to start each series. That play is so overused and I'm suspicious its being called solely as an easy completion to try and boost Kylers confidence.

 

[WindCardinal]

I saw plenty of shallow crossing routes this game, but maybe you're talking about something different. After 3 picks vs. Detroit and a terrible first series Kyler reverted back into being Captain Checkdown. He was afraid of pushing the ball downfield and it showed. I haven't given up on the offense as a whole, but I am so done with those sideline WR screens to start each series. That play is so overused and I'm suspicious its being called solely as an easy completion to try and boost Kylers confidence.

agreed on the screens. I recall seeing it at least 3 times. Isabella got 1 yard, Fitzgerald and Hopkins both got losses. I’m sure there were more then that though

 

[82CardsGrad]

What’s the next level after “grossly?

 

[Mainstreet]

No. I'm fine with our receivers. I honestly think Fitz and Kirk are capable of 1000 yards each.

This system give them very little to work with. Everything is quick and short. 99% of passes are to comebacks, outs or stationary receivers. There so little thrown in front of a receiver in motion so they can get more yardage or take it to the house.

Basic concepts such as slants and crossing routes don't exist.

Its a tough offense for a WR. So much of the yardage that's there for other receivers just isn't there for them the vast majority of the time.

They are surviving on a diet of scraps.

Honest question. Why would they do this unless Kyler can't handle more?

 

[dscher]

But it's not. The percentage of passes short or behind the LOS and outside the hashes is far more than any other team. A full 25% of all our passes.

Very few passes are thrown with anticipation to a receiver in motion.

No. Your opinion is wrong. Get it together.

 

[Chopper0080]

A QB is what elevates average WRs to above average WRs. Kyler isn't elevating this group right now. He isn't making the throws when they are there which is making those WRs look worse than they are even if they aren't great.

 

[Snoopdog323]

Fitz is washed up and should be gracefully shown the door at the end of the season. Isabella will be a WR4 with his hands. Need reliable And available WR2 and 3.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Meanwhile DK Metcalf is on pace for 64 receptions, 1600 yards and 12 TDS...