What is the plan?

[Mainstreet]

They can go over the cap to sign Oubre, which is important. I believe they'll have roughly $12 million in cap space before he's signed so they will need to clear some cap space to sign Russell, or anyone pricey, and then work out a deal with Oubre for his deal that would require him to wait until our other free agents sign so that way we can sign him to go over the cap and give him his money. A trade is almost a certainty if they don't stretch someone and it's unlikely they will stretch Tyler Johnson with how much Monty seems to like him.

It'll be an interesting offseason. Either we'll look like we did last year plus a rookie or two and some guys on very minimal deals or we'll replace a few rotation players and will look quite different with the exception of Booker, Ayton, and Bridges. I think everyone else could be moved for various reasons.

What I'm trying to figure out is where did all the cap space go. Yes, we have Booker on a max deal and Ayton as the #1 overall pick but everyone else is supposed to be on cheap deals so how are we so close to capped out?

Here is a breakdown of next year's salaries. The salary cap is projected to be around $109 million.

Here is the link to where I got the cap info, Spotrac.com

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Theoretically, if Oubre would wait, the Suns would be better off to sign Oubre after their other free agent signings. That's probably a lot to ask.

Of course if Oubre signs for around 14 million they can tweak their roster.

 

[Proximo]

You think the Lakers will offer him the max? I'm not so sure about that, especially if they draft Garland.

As for Utah, they won't have max cap space unless they rescind all of their free agents and that includes Favors, Korver, Rubio, Sefolosha, and Udoh. They can make the room but I've heard they want to move Mitchell to PG so they might go after a wing instead of Russell.

Those teams might offer the max though, it's not guaranteed. There is a chance we can get him below the max, that's all I was saying.

The lakers will throw money at the best player they can get, might be Kemba, but I think they would prefer Russell.

Utah has already been rumored to be after him.

I bet the clippers would try to sign him also.

 

[Proximo]

I would only do that if they threw in the #17 pick, and even then it would make me nervous. I really don't want to trade Josh Jackson. I think that with proper coaching (and I think Monty can be the guy to provide it, his infatuation with Tyler Johnson notwithstanding), Josh Jackson still has the potential to be another Scottie Pippen. I would much prefer for Warren to be the odd man out among the wings.

I really don’t get you. If you hate culver you should hate Jackson, yet for some reason you don’t.

If you believe Jackson can be coached up by monte, why don’t you think culver could be?

 

[Mainstreet]

I don’t think Oubre is going anywhere.

I think there is a reason Tyler Johnson has not yet picked up his option, and it’s because we are working on an extension.

That should give us 20 million, while keeping our cap hold on Oubre.

We would just need to dump warren or Jackson to be able to sign Russell, and probably could get randle without having to dump anyone.

But, I really doubt we can get both a quality pg and pf. Unless it’s randle and Dinwiddie through trade.

Do you have any thoughts on what Tyler's extension might look like? Maybe 3 years, 36 million.

 

[Hoop Head]

The lakers will throw money at the best player they can get, might be Kemba, but I think they would prefer Russell.

Utah has already been rumored to be after him.

I bet the clippers would try to sign him also.

The Lakers going after Russell and offering the max would highlight how idiotic that front office is since they gave him away to open up the cap space it required to sign... Russell? I can see why they'd be interested in the player he's become but the optics are terrible.

The Clippers going after him seems odd but they've made so many weird deals that ended up working out well for them that I don't think anyone could pinpoint their plans or how it would work out.

I know we won't be the only suitor for Russell but we have a slight advantage over some other teams since his best friend is here already and should take part in recruiting him, Booker. I'm not saying it's a done deal, far from it, but I'm not worried about the Lakers signing him away from the Suns, if the Suns pursue him.

 

[1Sun]

I really don’t get you. If you hate culver you should hate Jackson, yet for some reason you don’t.

If you believe Jackson can be coached up by monte, why don’t you think culver could be?

Because Jackson showed an unselfishness and composure in college and in a half season under Triano that I have never seen from Culver. Plus Jackson is two or three inches taller (depending on which measurement for Culver you believe) and therefore can play small forward.

 

[1Sun]

Do you have any thoughts on what Tyler's extension might look like? Maybe 3 years, 36 million.

That would be beyond ridiculous.

 

[Proximo]

Do you have any thoughts on what Tyler's extension might look like? Maybe 3 years, 36 million.

Probably 4 for 45 I would guess. We will have to overpay for it to make sense for him to take it.

 

[1Sun]

Probably 4 for 45 I would guess. We will have to overpay for it to make sense for him to take it.

Why in the world would the Suns do this to themselves?

 

[Proximo]

Because Jackson showed an unselfishness and composure in college and in a half season under Triano that I have never seen from Culver. Plus Jackson is two or three inches taller (depending on which measurement for Culver you believe) and therefore can play small forward.

So you don’t believe in combine measurements, that’s good to know. Culver can gain 30 pounds and easily be able to play small forward. Just like Mikal is doing right now.

Johnson has proven himself to be a dummy, with even lower basketball iq.

Just to be clear I am also not completely sold on getting rid of him either, mainly because his value is currently so low.

 

[1Sun]

So you don’t believe in combine measurements, that’s good to know. Culver can gain 30 pounds and easily be able to play small forward. Just like Mikal is doing right now.

Johnson has proven himself to be a dummy, with even lower basketball iq.

Just to be clear I am also not completely sold on getting rid of him either, mainly because his value is currently so low.

Jackson also has far more athleticism than Culver, to go along with his noticeable size advantage.

 

[Proximo]

Why in the world would the Suns do this to themselves?

Because our choices are use a draft pick / picks to trade him to free cap space, waive and stretch and have useless dead money on the cap, or save 10 million on the cap this year and still have a competent combo guard, with a much more tradeable contract for the future.

 

[Proximo]

Jackson also has far more athleticism than Culver, to go along with his noticeable size advantage.

1 inch of height is not a noticeable size advantage, and I would not describe his athleticism to be far greater, especially when you consider he misses like 30 percent of his dunk attempts.

 

[Mainstreet]

Probably 4 for 45 I would guess. We will have to overpay for it to make sense for him to take it.

Probably 4/40 as 1Sun suggested is the max I would go.

 

[1Sun]

Because our choices are use a draft pick / picks to trade him to free cap space, waive and stretch and have useless dead money on the cap, or save 10 million on the cap this year and still have a competent combo guard, with a much more tradeable contract for the future.

Then to me, the choice is a no-brainer. If we need the cap space, waive and stretch him (so we are not stuck with $10-15 million per year of dead money for 3-4 years, as opposed to $4-5 million per year). If we don't need the cap space, let him play out his last year here as a back-up to Booker.

He already doesn't deserve what he's making. Do you want to add three or four more years of paying him what he doesn't deserve, at the cost of filling the holes (at PG and PF, or at least at one of those two if the other, likely a PF, is filled with the temporary cap space we gain) we desperately need to fill???

One year of Tyler Johnson at the point is bad enough. Who in their right mind would keep him there for 3-4 years and tie up $45 million in cap space over four years to do so???

 

[1Sun]

Probably 4/40 as 1Sun suggested is the max I would go.

And even that is ridiculous. Johnson needs to be gone, not given another $21 million and have us be stuck with him for 4 years.

 

[1Sun]

1 inch of height is not a noticeable size advantage, and I would not describe his athleticism to be far greater, especially when you consider he misses like 30 percent of his dunk attempts.

Culver is 6'5 or 6'6". Jackson is 6'8".

And while he has been a horrible finisher of late, Jackson has a far quicker and superior first step to Culver.

IF he can get his head on straight (and that remains a big if), Jackson can fill the slasher role at the 3.

Culver really doesn't have much to offer at the NBA level. His ceiling is a smaller Rondae Hollis-Jefferson (while Jackson's ceiling remains Scottie Pippen or Kawhi Leonard). We need much more than a smaller RHJ.

 

[GatorAZ]

Tyler Johnson is solid and I’m okay with him for another season but there’s no point in extending him. It’s not like the NFL where a longer deal would change his cap hit.

 

[1Sun]

Tyler Johnson is solid and I’m okay with him for another season but there’s no point in extending him. It’s not like the NFL where a longer deal would change his cap hit.

The idea would be to get him to decline his player option in exchange for long term security. Still, I think it would be beyond foolish on the Suns' part to give this guy any more money than he is already being overpaid.

 

[GatorAZ]

The idea would be to get him to decline his player option in exchange for long term security. Still, I think it would be beyond foolish on the Suns' part to give this guy any more money than he is already being overpaid.

He’s going to get something from someone out there next summer so no point in turning down 19mil. Melton or Okobo next to take a significant leap by then.

 

[Hoop Head]

Tyler Johnson is solid and I’m okay with him for another season but there’s no point in extending him. It’s not like the NFL where a longer deal would change his cap hit.

Actually his cap hit could change. He has a player option for next season so talking extension with the front office could get him to opt out of his deal and sign a new contract that lowers his salary this coming season. He's on the books for about $19.5 million this next season right now but if he opts out and resigns a 4 year $40 million dollar deal then his cap hit will be cut in half.

The reason that is possible has to do with his player option so it's a scenario that makes sense to explore.

 

[1Sun]

Actually his cap hit could change. He has a player option for next season so talking extension with the front office could get him to opt out of his deal and sign a new contract that lowers his salary this coming season. He's on the books for about $19.5 million this next season right now but if he opts out and resigns a 4 year $40 million dollar deal then his cap hit will be cut in half.

The reason that is possible has to do with his player option so it's a scenario that makes sense to explore.

Only if you want to be stuck with a below average back-up shooting guard taking up $10 million a year in cap space for four more seasons...

 

[Proximo]

Then to me, the choice is a no-brainer. If we need the cap space, waive and stretch him (so we are not stuck with $10-15 million per year of dead money for 3-4 years, as opposed to $4-5 million per year). If we don't need the cap space, let him play out his last year here as a back-up to Booker.

He already doesn't deserve what he's making. Do you want to add three or four more years of paying him what he doesn't deserve, at the cost of filling the holes (at PG and PF, or at least at one of those two if the other, likely a PF, is filled with the temporary cap space we gain) we desperately need to fill???

One year of Tyler Johnson at the point is bad enough. Who in their right mind would keep him there for 3-4 years and tie up $45 million in cap space over four years to do so???

I think he is worth 8 to 9 million a year on the open market.

So for him it needs to be equivalent to 19 + 8 x 3 which is 43 million, and that’s if he wants to stay here.

I don’t have a problem keeping him at all, he can competently back up both guard spots. He still has at least 4 good years left in him, and overpaying him a little is better than dead money because it cant be traded, you are stuck with the dead money. To me that is not even a real option unless you are dealing with a total crap player that has near zero value.

I think best case is to use him in a sign and trade but his option must be picked up by the 16th. So without tampering you can’t even know if that is possible.

So really I think our real options are keep him at the 19 for a year or extend him, or wait till teams have struck out in free agency to dump him, but at that point what will be left to sign worth freeing the money.

I guess we could try to dump him for the 6th pick, but that assumes we need max space, which we only do for Russell or Tobias, and those are still long shots.

I think the extension is the best move if he would do it for less than 4 for 50.

 

[1Sun]

I think he is worth 8 to 9 million a year on the open market.

So for him it needs to be equivalent to 19 + 8 x 3 which is 43 million, and that’s if he wants to stay here.

I don’t have a problem keeping him at all, he can competently back up both guard spots. He still has at least 4 good years left in him, and overpaying him a little is better than dead money because it cant be traded, you are stuck with the dead money. To me that is not even a real option unless you are dealing with a total crap player that has near zero value.

I think best case is to use him in a sign and trade but his option must be picked up by the 16th. So without tampering you can’t even know if that is possible.

So really I think our real options are keep him at the 19 for a year or extend him, or wait till teams have struck out in free agency to dump him, but at that point what will be left to sign worth freeing the money.

I guess we could try to dump him for the 6th pick, but that assumes we need max space, which we only do for Russell or Tobias, and those are still long shots.

I think the extension is the best move if he would do it for less than 4 for 50.

Just realize that if he is extended, he becomes untradable, and instead of being stuck paying him $19 million for one year, the Suns are stuck paying him $40-50 million over four years. Warren was supposed to be tradeable at $14 million per season, and Johnson's expiring deal was supposed to be tradeable, and yet here we are.

Do you really want to compound this problem?

 

[Proximo]

Just realize that if he is extended, he becomes untradable, and instead of being stuck paying him $19 million for one year, the Suns are stuck paying him $40-50 million over four years. Warren was supposed to be tradeable at $14 million per season, and Johnson's expiring deal was supposed to be tradeable, and yet here we are.

Do you really want to compound this problem?

If randle or Russell is available, yes. Maybe even if it just means getting Beverley and Thad young.

Obviously if we strike out in free agency it would not be a good idea. But we supposedly know randle has interest.