2018-19 Season | Point Guard Discussion

[Yuma]

I just read the rumor on Dragic comes from John Gambadoro if that matters. Kyle Newport of Bleacher Report.

Also Dragic is 32 if that matters.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I could see Dragic here, not that I think its great, but he is a vet that would be a help. He is a starting level pg at least. He also knows Igor's system and can make sure they run it.

 

[Suns_fan69]

Dragic would be a stop-gap, but a stop gap might not be such a bad thing. Gives the Suns a chance to evaluate Okobo/Melton/Harrison/Canaan, though I suspect Miami will ask for one of the rookies in return.

Dragic's salary is a turnoff though, he's owed 18M this year and 19M on a player option for next season. He may opt out to find a longer deal, but I suspect that would be a bad financial move for him.

 

[SirStefan32]

Well, I'd like more defense (George Hill, for example) if we are going with a stop-gap point guard, but at this point, bring him in if he doesn't cost too much.

 

[Mainstreet]

I like Dragic as a stopgap PG going forward. Dragic and Booker in the back court should be dynamic. For me, it's the asking price. If the Suns can get him reasonably they can be competitive perhaps for the 8th playoff spot while they keep developing their youth.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I like Dragic as a stopgap PG going forward. Dragic and Booker in the back court should be dynamic. For me, it's the asking price. If the Suns can get him reasonably they can be competitive perhaps for the 8th playoff spot while they keep developing their youth.

The problem, to me, is that second year. If the Suns acquire Dragic, it is potentially instead of adding from the 2019 free agent point guard crop. At his age, that's an issue imho

 

[GatorAZ]

The problem, to me, is that second year. If the Suns acquire Dragic, it is potentially instead of adding from the 2019 free agent point guard crop. At his age, that's an issue imho

Yeah if he was 100% expiring it would be a no brainer depending on cost. I think they’ll settle on Milo or Bev.

 

[Phrazbit]

Miami played better when Tyler Johnson was running the point, so it isn't that surprising.

 

[Mainstreet]

The problem, to me, is that second year. If the Suns acquire Dragic, it is potentially instead of adding from the 2019 free agent point guard crop. At his age, that's an issue imho

The Suns would have to look at Dragic as filling that 2019 free agent need unless of course he opts out which gives the Suns money to spend. IMO, the key is not giving up too much for him. I'm not locked into Dragic at all but it's time for the Suns to get this show on the road.

 

[Suns_fan69]

Man, Miami's roster is a mess:https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/MIA.html

They've got one of the highest salaries for this year (Chris Bosh's 27M at least expires this year), with no real bona-fide star. Tyler Johnson is somehow making 19M and has a 15% trade kicker.

I suspect they'd want to try and dump salaries and / or pick up picks in any trade for Dragic. I'm sure Miami would love to dump Whiteside or Johnson but Phoenix just doesn't have the salaries to make either of those work.

 

[SirStefan32]

The problem, to me, is that second year. If the Suns acquire Dragic, it is potentially instead of adding from the 2019 free agent point guard crop. At his age, that's an issue imho

That is a very good point. If the Suns trade for Dragic, I think they are out of the 2019 market. The question is whether or not they believe in the young point guards they have- if they think Okobo, Harrison, Melton could be the long-term answer, it's not a big deal. If they don't, well, then Dragic doesn't make sense.

 

[Errntknght]

It takes a lot of energy to defend the way Harrison does on PGs and assuming the same for Melton you don't want either to be the starter. Recall that Bledsoe's D was quite average once her was playing starters minutes. Of course if the two of them split the time at PG equally, then they ought to have the energy to keep up the defensive pressure. That would be ideal from my perspective.
On the offensive end Melton was a good scorer in SL, which not much to go on, but if that holds up he'll be okay. We have a little more data on Harrison. We know his 3 pt shooting sucked last year (23%), but he doesn't take wide open threes - if he's open at the 3pt line he drives to the hoop. In fact he's quite good driving - overall FG% 48% and got to the FT fairly often (3.5 FTs/36). And he doesn't turn the ball over a lot - Ast/TO ratio 2.5. Another minor data point in his favor - he had a +- of +5.8 against the team average of -9.2 and he only played during peak tanking times. (Our rotation players were all -9 or worse except for Len at -8.8, which is why we were so successful tanking, of course.) Still Shaquille needs to get his 3pt shot up in the neighborhood of 33% over the next couple of years.

 

[JCSunsfan]

That is a very good point. If the Suns trade for Dragic, I think they are out of the 2019 market. The question is whether or not they believe in the young point guards they have- if they think Okobo, Harrison, Melton could be the long-term answer, it's not a big deal. If they don't, well, then Dragic doesn't make sense.

A trade for for Dragic has to include Warren just for keeping some capnroom for next summer. We are only $4 million in the hole then.

 

[Phrazbit]

Miami won't want to take back guaranteed money beyond next year, they're in this for picks or young players. Dragic is a bad fit with Booker, he is ball dominant, not a facilitator and a bad defender and he's declining.

And even if we ignored all that, I'd be really really surprised if McD or Sarver want anything to do with him after he shanked them.

 

[slinslin]

Goran Dragic makes zero sense!

His contract kills our capspace in 2019 where we could be the young attractive team for someone like Kevin Durant, Kawhi Leonard or Kyrie Irving to join. Especially after the things Durant said about Phoenix and Booker recently.

Not only that Dragic had his worst year in recent years and barely averages more assists than Booker. Why would you want to put the ball into Dragic hands when you have Booker? And why did Dragic create drama here? Because he did not want to play off the ball.

 

[leclerc]

As I said good call about which owner, but I can say that you are wrong about what an owner is privy to.

This is the good old boys club and they all know everything. They didn’t get invited to become owners because they had money, these guys take care of their own and know they can work together.

Doesn’t make them experts of course not, but it does make them the boss and the boss is always right.

Also if you think the GM just gets to make decisions, nothing could be further from the truth.

All knowing bosses are always right about the team not appearing in the playoffs, year in, year out.

 

[Mainstreet]

Frank Urbina of Hoops Hype does an entertaining article posted at azcentral about five potential trade targets for the Suns. It was a fun article until he proposed trading Josh Jackson and Mikal Bridges for an expiring contract in Kemba Walker.

Now I like Walker as do others but no way do I offer this much in trade. I'd rather go after Walker when he hits free agency if he can not be had for a more reasonable trade. Jackson and Bridges were the 4th and 10th picks in recent drafts.

The other four players mentioned are better targets if the price is that high for Walker. A temporary patch for the Suns might be a better option.


Here is an excerpt:

"As far as what a Hornets/Suns deal for Walker could look like, a package involving Josh Jackson and Mikal Bridges could make some sense. It may seem expensive at first glance, but at the end of the day, the Suns would be landing a borderline All-NBA caliber floor general, one who still has years of his prime left and one who would be a great fit with the future of their franchise at 2-guard; Walker and Booker would immediately form one of the NBA’s most entertaining and productive backcourts. Additionally, from a more macro sense, a starting five of Walker, Booker, Ariza, Anderson and Deandre Ayton would be pretty potent. It may not get Phoenix into the playoffs right off the bat in 2018-19, but it would put them on the right path."

https://www.azcentral.com/story/spo...zier-patrick-beverley-george-hill/1184965002/

 

[overseascardfan]

These may be the best PG's available but they are all flawed IMO. Rozier is a combo guard more so than a PG and he disappeared in the conference finals under the pressure. Beverly also is not a true PG but more of a 3 & D guard. Kemba Walker has always been a terrible shooter but he gets his points with volume shot attempts and if the cost is either Jackson or Bridges that is pretty steep for a guy that is an UFA after this year. I like Dinwiddie, he is the truest PG of these options. He needs to improve his shooting but he is still young enough to improve. Hopefully, PHX can get him for just draft picks, not sure if I would want to give up on Bender yet.

 

[SirStefan32]

Long-term I like Dinwiddie. In the short-term, George Hill. He is a very good defender, good facilitator, and an excellent shooter. Hill/Booker/Jackson (or Bridges)/ Ariza/ Ayton is one hell of a lineup, in my opinion.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Suns have until September 5th to sign Melton otherwise he becomes a free agent.

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They need to sign him or trade his rights to a team that wants his rights very soon.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The Suns have until September 5th to sign Melton otherwise he becomes a free agent.

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They need to sign him or trade his rights to a team that wants his rights very soon.

This would be a disaster of epic proportions if they lost him for zilch. Not becasue he’s so good but because then we made a trade with zero upside.

 

[Mainstreet]

This would be a disaster of epic proportions if they lost him for zilch. Not becasue he’s so good but because then we made a trade with zero upside.

Agree. It would certainly be nice to get a young player in return. I hope the Suns do not lose Melton's rights to free agency without anything to show for it.

 

[Carolinacacti]

I'm done speculating about what this team is going to do. I would hope they keep the three young point guards and run with them. I think you guys are right about Booker having the ball in his hands most of the time.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Frank Urbina of Hoops Hype does an entertaining article posted at azcentral about five potential trade targets for the Suns. It was a fun article until he proposed trading Josh Jackson and Mikal Bridges for an expiring contract in Kemba Walker.

Now I like Walker as do others but no way do I offer this much in trade. I'd rather go after Walker when he hits free agency if he can not be had for a more reasonable trade. Jackson and Bridges were the 4th and 10th picks in recent drafts.

The other four players mentioned are better targets if the price is that high for Walker. A temporary patch for the Suns might be a better option.


Here is an excerpt:

"As far as what a Hornets/Suns deal for Walker could look like, a package involving Josh Jackson and Mikal Bridges could make some sense. It may seem expensive at first glance, but at the end of the day, the Suns would be landing a borderline All-NBA caliber floor general, one who still has years of his prime left and one who would be a great fit with the future of their franchise at 2-guard; Walker and Booker would immediately form one of the NBA’s most entertaining and productive backcourts. Additionally, from a more macro sense, a starting five of Walker, Booker, Ariza, Anderson and Deandre Ayton would be pretty potent. It may not get Phoenix into the playoffs right off the bat in 2018-19, but it would put them on the right path."

https://www.azcentral.com/story/spo...zier-patrick-beverley-george-hill/1184965002/

I'm on the Kemba Walker bandwagon for sure, but that trade idea is a big fat no from me.

 

[BC867]

I'm done speculating about what this team is going to do. I would hope they keep the three young point guards and run with them. I think you guys are right about Booker having the ball in his hands most of the time.

I am a big fan of the Phoenix Mercury, in quest of their 4th championship. For the last few games of the season and through the playoffs, Diana Taurasi (the WNBA's all-time greatest player) has taken on the chore of full-time Point Guard as well as Shooting Guard. The ball has been in her hands most of the time.

She is running on fumes, has become the 3rd most key player on the team and, as our Shooting Guard, is missing shots she's always made, whether long range or driving to the basket. And it has changed the dynamics of the offense at the worst possible time. On the road in Seattle (where we lost the first two games by close scores after big comebacks) in the elimination game.


Which is why any talk of the Suns equivalent to Diana Taurasi, DBook, doing the same thing -- whether as we get close to the playoffs next season or, especially, all season long -- worries me.

My point is that if having the ball in his hands most of the time means just that, especially all season long, I believe the Suns will waste the acquisition of Ayton and lose whatever momentum they build near the end of the season.

There is a difference between that and having Devin as our primary player on offense and having the ball in his hands a little more during crunch time. Devin (just as with the Mercury with a strong Center) does not have a DeWanna Bonner who is just as clutch as Taurasi (at Forward or Wing -- and the team's best rebounder).

I hope we don't see it happen with the Suns. Having the ball in DBook's hands most of the time, especially all season long, is going to burn him out, even with his being younger than Taurasi. It is a long season! With more physical contact in the NBA than in women's basketball.

This is not conjecture on my part. I am watching it happen with the Mercury. I hope the Suns do not take the lazy way out and count on Devin to be our backcourt all season long. It is a formula that is bound to fail. Whether he becomes less efficient or injured, which are real possibilities. We need to protect our greatest asset, not run him into the ground!

Your thoughts?