Amare to opt out if suns dont give MAX

[Skratchy_Seal]

Can somebody link me to a good place to look up salary history for players? I could've sworn MJ only made low to mid 7 digit figures throughout his first stint with the Bulls.

 

[SactownSunsFan]

Can somebody link me to a good place to look up salary history for players? I could've sworn MJ only made low to mid 7 digit figures throughout his first stint with the Bulls.

Basketball-reference.com

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html

Season Team Lg Salary
1985-86 Chicago Bulls NBA $630,000
1987-88 Chicago Bulls NBA $845,000
1988-89 Chicago Bulls NBA $2,000,000
1990-91 Chicago Bulls NBA $2,500,000
1991-92 Chicago Bulls NBA $3,250,000
1992-93 Chicago Bulls NBA $4,000,000
1993-94 Chicago Bulls NBA $4,000,000
1994-95 Chicago Bulls NBA $3,850,000
1995-96 Chicago Bulls NBA $3,850,000
1996-97 Chicago Bulls NBA $30,140,000
1997-98 Chicago Bulls NBA $33,140,000
2001-02 Washington Wizards NBA $1,000,000
2002-03 Washington Wizards NBA $1,030,000

Career (may be incomplete) $90,235,000

 

[dreamcastrocks]

So you don't see the difference between Steve Nash and say Kobe Bryant and Lebron James?

Difference in what exactly. Ability, absolutely. Worth to the team, not as much.

You put LeBron or Kobe on the Suns and I don't think they are any more successful that they were this year.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ok, so to be clear, you have a hard time understand comparisons. Again, I'm talking about SALARY ONLY.

Would it help you to go back to the Rashard Lewis comparison?

dcr, what you're apparently not understanding is that when talking about "crippling" a team you can't look at salary in a vacuum. as cheese said, you have consider (a) cost and (b) return. the bulls and heat weren't crippled because they got value for what they paid, thus they didn't require additional cap room to acquire better players around jordan and shaq, b/c their individual talent was so enormous that lesser talents could be elevated around them, thus not needing bigger contract players to win titles. amare's return will NEVER equate to what jordan and shaq returned on their contracts, thus the need for better players around amare to win a championship and better players will necessitate bigger contracts, something the suns wouldn't be able to give if amare is maxed out. hence crippling the organization.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

dcr, what you're apparently not understanding is that when talking about "crippling" a team you can't look at salary in a vacuum. as cheese said, you have consider (a) cost and (b) return. the bulls and heat weren't crippled because they got value for what they paid, thus they didn't require additional cap room to acquire better players around jordan and shaq, b/c their individual talent was so enormous that lesser talents could be elevated around them, thus not needing bigger contract players to win titles. amare's return will NEVER equate to what jordan and shaq returned on their contracts, thus the need for better players around amare to win a championship and better players will necessitate bigger contracts, something the suns wouldn't be able to give if amare is maxed out. hence crippling the organization.

I just quite simply disagree with the 'crippling.' This team is not that far away.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Difference in what exactly. Ability, absolutely. Worth to the team, not as much.

You put LeBron or Kobe on the Suns and I don't think they are any more successful that they were this year.

okay folks, this debate is finished. i think dcr's comments above tell us everything we need to know. we're all playing with a different deck of cards than dcr. no offense dcr.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

okay folks, this debate is finished. i think dcr's comments above tell us everything we need to know. we're all playing with a different deck of cards than dcr. no offense dcr.

None taken. Although I'd like to see how you think this team would be better with Kobe or LeBron. If Amare is the problem with this team, then those same problems would be there if you replaced Nash with Kobe/LeBron.

 

[Cheesebeef]

For me, it will be a sad day if we're forced to let Amare walk. Signing him to a max length/max dollars contract would be apocalyptic. I'd have to find something else to invest my free time in because Phoenix basketball would soon die an ugly death. Oh well, I always wanted to take up duplicate bridge.

Steve

I think the Suns are in a no-win situation right now.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Difference in what exactly. Ability, absolutely. Worth to the team, not as much.

You put LeBron or Kobe on the Suns and I don't think they are any more successful that they were this year.

uh... what? Yeah, it's pointless to have this debate if you believe this to be true.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I think the Suns are in a no-win situation right now.

It seems like the best situation is a S&T. Their next best is to keep him, and finally to let him go. JMVHO.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It seems like the best situation is a S&T.

agreed, but we ain't gonna get much back.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

uh... what? Yeah, it's pointless to have this debate if you believe this to be true.

I have no doubt that they are superior players. Kobe is the best player in the league.

If you put Lebron on this current Suns team, I don't think they they would have beat the Lakers for example.

 

[mojorizen7]

The Suns really don't have a centerpiece to build around anymore. The thinking that Nash & Amare are worthy pieces to continue to build around at this point in time is foolish IMO.

S & T or let him walk. Our strengths lie in the young role players here,not the Nash's,Amare's or Hill's anymore.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

agreed, but we ain't gonna get much back.

Beasley.... lol

 

[Cheesebeef]

I have no doubt that they are superior players. Kobe is the best player in the league.

If you put Lebron on this current Suns team, I don't think they they would have beat the Lakers for example.

I think you're wrong... unless Amare's Mom slept with Lebron's Mom. Then maybe he'd quit on us too.

 

[AzStevenCal]

unless Amare's Mom slept with Lebron's Mom.

Thanks a lot. Even without video evidence it's gonna take me a lifetime or two to get that picture out of my mind. Hair everywhere!

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

Beasley.... lol

Actually, Beasley plus an unprotected pick would work for me. It wouldn't be fair value but it's as close as we could hope for. If someone could reattach Beasley's head he might still turn out okay.

Steve

 

[Cheesebeef]

Actually, Beasley plus an unprotected pick would work for me. It wouldn't be fair value but it's as close as we could hope for. If someone could reattach Beasley's head he might still turn out okay.

Steve

i know it's only his second year, but that kid's got bust-o-la written all over him. 'Sides, he's a tweener. I don't think he'll ever amount to much in the league even if he did get his head on straight.

 

[Superbone]

Hopefully they can work out some kind of a sign and trade so they get something in return, but I really hope they don't give him the max. $60M over 4 years is as much as I'd offer him.

What do you care how long it is if it's a sign and trade?

 

[Superbone]

Like?

Lee is going to command more than 9 per year for example.

Tell me who might be available that could help our team with 9M per year.

Luis Scola maybe?

 

[ASUCHRIS]

i know it's only his second year, but that kid's got bust-o-la written all over him. 'Sides, he's a tweener. I don't think he'll ever amount to much in the league even if he did get his head on straight.

Sadly, I don't think we'll get a better offer than that. Factor in the chemistry talk from last year, and Riley's distaste for Amare, and I don't think it'll be something we'll have to worry about anyway.

Amare isn't worth 20 million per, but it'll be hell trying to replace him. Unfortunately, the Suns are in a no win situation.

 

[dodie53]

sign and trade time

 

[AzStevenCal]

i know it's only his second year, but that kid's got bust-o-la written all over him. 'Sides, he's a tweener. I don't think he'll ever amount to much in the league even if he did get his head on straight.

Yeah, he's definitely a bust. I'm not suggesting we get the Beasley that was drafted as a superstar-in-the-making. At best, he gets his head on straight and becomes a serviceable player with value in the Caron Butler range. With the draft pick and a number 3 type guy we'd at least have something to show for the loss of Amare.

Steve

 

[jandaman]

We hear that same song and dance, but prove how the Suns will be crippled. We're the Bulls crippled when they signed Jordan to 20+ per year? Were the Heat crippled when the signed Shaq to the 4 year 100M deal? Nope, they won titles.

Ridiculous.
Amare goggles.


If Stoudemire is what Tim Duncan was 3 years ago... I'd MAX him...

If Stoudemire is Kobe Bryant.... I'd extend him till he retires here at MAX.




But no... Stoudemire is a 20/8 Big man with knee issues and a high risk of regressing in a couple of years.


Think about what you are willing to do to the franchise by... again... JUSTIFYING a ridiculous contract for a player that is not worth it.

Lol at the Jordan and O'Neal comparison... O'Neal was MVP contender back when they signed him.... Jordan is the GOAT and was playing 90% of his prime when he got that 30 Million a year contract... not to mention Jordan brought thrice that amount of money to Chicago on a yearly basis... and about 10x that to the NBA..... Amare is not even in the top 10 NBA players currently.

And Stoudemire is not the key for a championship... sad but true... its Nash and his ability to use his team mates in the offensive side effectively. And as of late, effort, chemistry and heart has gotten the Suns to WCF. Stoudemire is replaceable.... bottomline.

If Stoudemire posted up 30/10... this wouldnt be an ISSUE... every suns fan will be on your side... but not the case....

get over it.

 

[asudevil83]

Ridiculous.
Amare goggles.


If Stoudemire is what Tim Duncan was 3 years ago... I'd MAX him...

If Stoudemire is Kobe Bryant.... I'd extend him till he retires here at MAX.




But no... Stoudemire is a 20/8 Big man with knee issues and a high risk of regressing in a couple of years.


Think about what you are willing to do to the franchise by... again... JUSTIFYING a ridiculous contract for a player that is not worth it.

Lol at the Jordan and O'Neal comparison... O'Neal was MVP contender back when they signed him.... Jordan is the GOAT and was playing 90% of his prime when he got that 30 Million a year contract... not to mention Jordan brought thrice that amount of money to Chicago on a yearly basis... and about 10x that to the NBA..... Amare is not even in the top 10 NBA players currently.

And Stoudemire is not the key for a championship... sad but true... its Nash and his ability to use his team mates in the offensive side effectively. And as of late, effort, chemistry and heart has gotten the Suns to WCF. Stoudemire is replaceable.... bottomline.

If Stoudemire posted up 30/10... this wouldnt be an ISSUE... every suns fan will be on your side... but not the case....

get over it.

agreed.

Amare for the max for the next 5 years will hurt the team more than help.

and what he brings to the table does not offset what he potential takes away from the team by eating all our cap space.

Additionally IMO we are not a championship team with Amare. Are we a good team? yes....but we arent good enough. He lacks the leadership and commitment to push a team to the next level ala Kobe/Garnett/Duncan ect.....who at one time or another were all worth the ridiculous money they made.

in order of preference:
1. S&T for a decent pick/talent
2. resign for 4 years/$75-$80mil
3. let him walk
4. Max him out

What Amare is banking on is that the GM and Ownership are too afraid to take a step back until nash retires. so he's banking on getting as much as he can out of the franchise now by backing them into a corner.