Amare to opt out if suns dont give MAX

[dreamcastrocks]

Luis Scola maybe?

Scola will get more than 9M per year too.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Ridiculous.
Amare goggles.

Ouch. I don't have Amare goggles, I just think that losing him for nothing is much worse for this franchise short and long term than resigning him at max would be.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I think you're wrong... unless Amare's Mom slept with Lebron's Mom. Then maybe he'd quit on us too.

He quit so he could have the attention this offseason, just like he would if he were here.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

Re-signing Amare at the max would be worse than the Penny Hardaway situation or the Googs situation turned out to be....

 

[Cheesebeef]

He quit so he could have the attention this offseason, just like he would if he were here.

I don't buy this for A SECOND. He was up 2-1 in the series, just coming off a MONSTROUS game 3 where the Cavs seemingly took complete control of the series... and then never showed up again. If anything, quitting took attention away from him because there were other things to talk about. Sure some people are still talking about his impending FA, but EVERYONE would have been talking about his chase for a title AND impending FA if he was still playing. You don't drop out of the playoffs to get attention dreamcast.

Something REAL awful happened in that town. I have friends in Cleveland, all of which say from everything they heard and saw, there was a lot of validity to the rumors. There was a siesmic shift from LeBron in how he mingled with his own players from Game 4 on in that series.

 

[Chaplin]

Maybe. The product on the floor tells us that he is a max player though.

What? No it does not. Where in the world could you derive that?

 

[Covert Rain]

Re-signing Amare at the max would be worse than the Penny Hardaway situation or the Googs situation turned out to be....

Let's not get carried away. Penny was done and Googs got injured. Amare would be the same inconsistent Amare. Some nights...brilliant and dominant and other nights unfocused and lost. That's a far cry from Penny or Googs. Not even close to the same thing. At least we know with Amare we can get to the WCF.

Forget what we as the fans want. It doesn't matter. Are the Suns going to make another run with Nash? If so, the Suns have to resign Amare or work out a sign and trade. That is what the Suns must do. There is no other choice.

If the Suns plan on blowing it up, then I could see letting Amare walk but that is still stupid IMO. Having said that you let Amare walk, then trade Nash, trade JRich start building for the future. That is what I would prefer.

However, the Suns have basically said they are making another run. So, there is no other choice but to sign Amare to a max deal since a sign and trade or blowing it up are not on the Suns radar.

Personally, I also don't think it's all gloom and doom if Amare get's the max. You could trade him later. There is some team every single year that thinks they can do better then you could with some player. There is some GM or Coach with an ego that big.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Let's not get carried away. Penny was done and Googs got injured.

If we sign Amare to a max contract and he once again gets injured it will be much like Penny and Googs. And Penny was not done, except perhaps in retrospect. He was showing signs of being the old Penny in the last 50 games he played with Orlando and he had a pretty solid first year with the Suns. He didn't have much after that first year but when we went after him, history already showed he was a great player with a huge injury risk - not too different than Amare.

At least we know with Amare we can get to the WCF.

Honestly, I'm not trying to nitpick here but we don't know this. We know only that we have been to the WCF with Amare, not that we can get there again with him.

However, the Suns have basically said they are making another run. So, there is no other choice but to sign Amare to a max deal since a sign and trade or blowing it up are not on the Suns radar.

I want the Suns to s&t the guy but, I think you're right. They'll sign him to the max and pray that he stays healthy until Nash runs out of gas (personally, I think we're already there). Once Nash is clearly used up they'll ship Amare out and start the rebuild process. Amare pretty much has to go along with this plan because his poor playoff performance has to have limited his options somewhat. Hopefully, the CBA won't blow us out of the water though by making his contract unmovable even if he remains healthy.

Steve

 

[Covert Rain]

If we sign Amare to a max contract and he once again gets injured it will be much like Penny and Googs. And Penny was not done, except perhaps in retrospect. He was showing signs of being the old Penny in the last 50 games he played with Orlando and he had a pretty solid first year with the Suns. He didn't have much after that first year but when we went after him, history already showed he was a great player with a huge injury risk - not too different than Amare.

First off Amare getting hurt again is not a certainty. He has surpassed the estimates and like Jason Kidd who also went through a newer version have shown no signs of re-injury. Nobody knows if it will ever be a problem again anytime soon. It's just wild speculation at this point.

Also, I don't agree on Penny. You would see a flash every now and then but his days of 20+ PPG scorer were already gone. He played below the rim by the time we got him.

Honestly, I'm not trying to nitpick here but we don't know this. We know only that we have been to the WCF with Amare, not that we can get there again with him.

We don't know that we can't either. What we do know is that we have been there with him.

I want the Suns to s&t the guy but, I think you're right. They'll sign him to the max and pray that he stays healthy until Nash runs out of gas (personally, I think we're already there). Once Nash is clearly used up they'll ship Amare out and start the rebuild process. Amare pretty much has to go along with this plan because his poor playoff performance has to have limited his options somewhat. Hopefully, the CBA won't blow us out of the water though by making his contract unmovable even if he remains healthy.

Steve

One thing the Suns have proven is they can figure out a way to move a contract if they don't want it. It might cost us a few picks and another player but all is not lost IMO. I am not sure that going in that direction would hurt this franchise anymore then letting him walk and signing some cheapo PF, failing to make any kind of run and then starting over anyway after realizing that won't help either.

 

[jandaman]

There's a tweet from ESPN saying Suns shouldnt MAX Stoudemire.

You don't sign a player to a MAX for what he has done... but what HE WILL DO.

And Stoudemire is downhill from now on, around 20/8 for the next 2 seasons and regressed a lot from then on.

And thats assuming he doesnt "opt" for a knee surgery after he gets "inked".

Stoudemire is either going to SCREW a franchise (hopefully not the Suns)... or he SCREW himself by asking for too much in his condition and his abilities.

 

[AzStevenCal]

First off Amare getting hurt again is not a certainty. He has surpassed the estimates and like Jason Kidd who also went through a newer version have shown no signs of re-injury. Nobody knows if it will ever be a problem again anytime soon. It's just wild speculation at this point.

Also, I don't agree on Penny. You would see a flash every now and then but his days of 20+ PPG scorer were already gone. He played below the rim by the time we got him.

I have no idea if Amare will get injured again, but like Penny, his history suggests that it is a strong possibility. And again, like Penny, injuries have also robbed Amare of his incredible athleticism. Penny's scoring average was down a few points but he put up good numbers across the board that first year and only the games missed column made it anything other than a quality year for him, IMO.[/QUOTE]

Steve

 

[Cheesebeef]

I have no idea if Amare will get injured again, but like Penny, his history suggests that it is a strong possibility. And again, like Penny, injuries have also robbed Amare of his incredible athleticism. Penny's scoring average was down a few points but he put up good numbers across the board that first year and only the games missed column made it anything other than a quality year for him, IMO.

Steve[/QUOTE]

I think people forget that Penny was REALLY rounding back into form in his first year with us. In fact, can anyone tell me how he hurt his knee again? He hurt it DUNKING on a still very spry David Robinson. That was the beginning of the end for him. He averaged 20 ppg, 5 boards and 5 assists on 46% shooting in 42 mpg in leading us to the 2nd round of the playoffs that year (without Googs and Kidd for most of the first round).

 

[mojorizen7]

What Amare is banking on is that the GM and Ownership are too afraid to take a step back until nash retires. so he's banking on getting as much as he can out of the franchise now by backing them into a corner.

Bingo!
Will letting Amare walk away without compensation set us back for at least one season? Chances are 99% yes.
Will taking a step back for one season or two cripple our chances at fielding a competitive team again in a few years? IMO...no.
There's good young talent here, and as long as our scouting dept can continue to draft well and we keep our picks(starting next season sans Amare) we'll be ok sooner rather than later.
Its not like we'd be rebuilding from square one.

We just need to play the game of the draft & FA like everyone else for a couple yrs and IMO it'll payoff ....

 

[82CardsGrad]

There's a tweet from ESPN saying Suns shouldnt MAX Stoudemire.

You don't sign a player to a MAX for what he has done... but what HE WILL DO.

And Stoudemire is downhill from now on, around 20/8 for the next 2 seasons and regressed a lot from then on.

And thats assuming he doesnt "opt" for a knee surgery after he gets "inked".

Stoudemire is either going to SCREW a franchise (hopefully not the Suns)... or he SCREW himself by asking for too much in his condition and his abilities.

First, I would LOVE to see Amare remain with the Suns. The thought of him putting up 25 & 10 wearing some other colors kills me.
And I don't think Amare's performance will be "all downhill from now on"... I think the potential is there that he will remain at or slightly above what we saw from him the last half of the regular season - sans injury of course.

All that said, IMHO Amare is simply not a MAX player guy. Is he a top tier guy? Absolutely...

I don't really know what the Suns are willing to pay Amare. I have heard that one of the big stumbling blocks is the length of the deal, not necessarily the actual money. Which tells me that in terms of $$, there is probably not a bigtime delta there. Amare wants MAX years and the Suns might not want to pony up for that. I also heard today on Gambo & Ash that the Suns can't get the 5th year of the deal insured due to Amare's knee injury...

 

[jandaman]

^
I too am inclined to give him around 18-20 Million a year... but for 2 YEARS MAX.

You dont want a 30 Year old, slowed down Stoudemire getting 20 Million with a slowed down Nash thats if he hasnt retired then.

He will not just cripple the Suns, but he will prevent the Suns from getting some young star studs to build upon in the future.


There's about a 50% chance he will get surgery on his knees once he is inked.
Also he knows that the new CBA is around the corner.

If he really does care for winning then he will sacrifice... I mean you cannot demand a MAX from your team if you arent even a top 10 player.... 20/8.... thats his most likely numbers next season.....

seriously... as I said, it might be okay to take the risk and sign him up for 20 Million... but for 2 years MAX.... nothing longer.

 

[pokerface]

Amare is about due for another mircofracture...thats a fact. Its not WILD speculation either...That procedure only lasts 6-8 years..Then when he needs it done again he's out another 18 months. Let some other team deal with it.

 

[SunsFanVegas]

I just truly feel that if he is given a MAX contract with the Suns, that he will continue to slack off and only play when he "feels" like it after getting his huge payday. I just don't see him playing to his potential after getting his money. Maybe I'm way off base here...but my gut doesn't think so.

 

[cly2tw]

Management will make the best decision here. If they believe the team with one year more maturation and a little roster twist regarding the bench, I predict they'd do whatever to keep Amare. Otherwise, just start rebuilding by sending off Nash. At least, jRich has gotten some very good trade value in between.

 

[WuRaider]

I don't think Amare is worth the max and he's my favorite player. The reason why he's asking for it is because of the team's "success".

I think Kerr will bite the bullet and give him the max because of Steve Nash. Dude's time is running out and considering all the factors, Amare is our best chance at contending. David Lee? Luis Scola? Not gonna cut it.

I know its going to kill us down the road, but don't you want to see this team get another shot at it? Dudley, Rolo, and Dragic are all going to get even better. Jrich was good all year except for that stretch where he was recovering from the hand injury.

I just really want to see Grant and Steve get their rings.

 

[pokerface]

I know its going to kill us down the road, but don't you want to see this team get another shot at it? Dudley, Rolo, and Dragic are all going to get even better. Jrich was good all year except for that stretch where he was recovering from the hand injury.

We've been giving this team "another year" for like the last five years already. Now we're supposed to sign Amare to some long stupid contract because we're "so close" and all. Well, I dont think we're that close. WCF isn't the finals...and making the finals and losing isnt getting a ring either. The Suns were two steps away from getting rings...two very BIG steps away. Yeah it was a fun ride but unless the Suns get a major upgrade in talent we're just killing time with Amare. He melted away from the limelight...now he wants max payment. We cant have a powerforward that cant defend, slacks on the boards, and passes the ball like he has his eyes shut. He had three stinking assists for the entire Lakers series. Then he got the ball stuffed in his face so many times I thought he shrunk a foot in height. I only want the Suns investing in him if its a REASONABLE contract....but you know and I know thats not going to happen. Some team will throw stupid money at him...unfortunately.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

What? No it does not. Where in the world could you derive that?

Because many, MANY more people that you think should be, are considered max players in the NBA. It's just a fact.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I don't buy this for A SECOND. He was up 2-1 in the series, just coming off a MONSTROUS game 3 where the Cavs seemingly took complete control of the series... and then never showed up again. If anything, quitting took attention away from him because there were other things to talk about. Sure some people are still talking about his impending FA, but EVERYONE would have been talking about his chase for a title AND impending FA if he was still playing. You don't drop out of the playoffs to get attention dreamcast.

Something REAL awful happened in that town. I have friends in Cleveland, all of which say from everything they heard and saw, there was a lot of validity to the rumors. There was a siesmic shift from LeBron in how he mingled with his own players from Game 4 on in that series.

That's exactly what I am saying. He looked he he had checked out; like he didn't want to be there anymore.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

None taken. Although I'd like to see how you think this team would be better with Kobe or LeBron. If Amare is the problem with this team, then those same problems would be there if you replaced Nash with Kobe/LeBron.

it would be much different. one of the differences would be that kobe/lebron would (a) draw many more fouls than does nash, (b) require doubleteams MORE than amare, which would free up amare for even BETTER looks, and (c) are much more dominant scorers who can get their own shots AT WILL (though admittedly this is kobe more than nash, though with lebron you would get a boon on the boards, a weak point with the suns). i don't understand how you could think this team WOULDN'T be better with them over nash. particularly going forward.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think the Suns are in a no-win situation right now.

no, that's not true. they win if they get amare for a reasonable amount of dollars and years. unfortunately that's like a 0.0000000001% chance of happening . . . . but i'm saying there's a chance!






















yeah, no-win.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

One thing the Suns have proven is they can figure out a way to move a contract if they don't want it. It might cost us a few picks and another player but all is not lost IMO. I am not sure that going in that direction would hurt this franchise anymore then letting him walk and signing some cheapo PF, failing to make any kind of run and then starting over anyway after realizing that won't help either.

but that's just it, everytime we have to shed a contract it sets us back. if we didn't have to shed contracts in previous years we would have an iguodala or rondo, etc. no more friggin setbacks due to shortsightedness!