AYTON TRADED!

[Phrazbit]

He had enough value we got Nurkic, Allen, and Little for him and Camara. That's his value. His value wasn't going up, he didn't want to be here and honestly it doesn't seem like he wants to play competitive basketball either. We're lucky we got what we did for him. His value was higher before this past off-season but I don't believe we ever could have received what you and others still upset about the trade believed we could get. We know the Nets wanted nothing to do with him, going back to the 2022 off-season when Durant requested a trade. We should have traded him after the finals run, when his value was highest but I don't think anyone was pushing for it at that point. There were rumors we almost traded him during the 2021-22 season for Sabonis but Ayton's value wasn't high enough then to get a deal done.

This idea we were going to get a more consistent Center for him as well as another starting caliber player, and valuable draft picks or young players was always foolish. Why would any other team downgrade at Center to help us upgrade? It's illogical. We did the best we could, which has been pretty good. We got a Center who is producing within 10% of Ayton across the board, who is making less than half what Ayton did, and we added Allen who has been a lot more than an 8th man.

You're usually logical and I agree with your views and opinions but you're so far off here I don't understand why you believe Ayton had the value of an All-Star or All-NBA player. He was a #1 pick but ever since that selection was made, the value of that pick has gone. We could have received much more if we traded that pick that became Ayton than we ever could have for Ayton and Ayton's value continued to shrink as more people saw him phone it in.

At no point did I say Ayton had all nba or all star value.

We are miles apart on our view of Nurkic.

 

[Hoop Head]

At no point did I say Ayton had all nba or all star value.

We are miles apart on our view of Nurkic.

Name an ideal package for Ayton, please. I know you didn't say that he was All NBA or All-Star caliber but it genuinely seems like you expected that sort of package for him based on what you seem to imply we should have received. We weren't getting a Gobert deal or a Sabonis type deal, both of which were All-Stars/All-NBA so I'm asking what we should have held out for.

 

[Vacard]

Nothing better was available.

Should’ve went for Myles Turner

 

[Mainstreet]

Should’ve went for Myles Turner

The Suns would have jumped on this trade if it were on the table when Ayton was traded. It might have been in years past but the Pacers organization has gotten smarter.

 

[Vacard]

I also want to see what Metu can do (bars).

 

[BirdGangThing]

All (Ayton) things considered it was a great trade - between Allen and Nurk we got waaaaaaayyyy more production than we did with Ayton on both offense and defense - I would've traded Ayton straight up for Nurk - because I like mentally stable players who can get along with their teammates and coaches and who don't blame the fanbase for their vanishing acts and underwhelming mediocrity

Ayton was that bad - there was no chance of a title with Ayton in Phx - we were lucky to get rid of that pornstar banging jackwagon

 

[AzStevenCal]

All (Ayton) things considered it was a great trade - between Allen and Nurk we got waaaaaaayyyy more production than we did with Ayton on both offense and defense - I would've traded Ayton straight up for Nurk - because I like mentally stable players who can get along with their teammates and coaches and who don't blame the fanbase for their vanishing acts and underwhelming mediocrity

Ayton was that bad - there was no chance of a title with Ayton in Phx - we were lucky to get rid of that pornstar banging jackwagon

I disagree. I think we won the trade but it was far from a great trade. DA, huge disappointment though he's been, is simply a better player than Nurkic. We won this by the narrow margin of whatever Allen brings to the table above what you could expect from an average middle-of-the-bench player. And, perhaps, in the longterm, we win this even more if the salary savings ever factors into the equation.

 

[Chaplin]

I disagree. I think we won the trade but it was far from a great trade. DA, huge disappointment though he's been, is simply a better player than Nurkic. We won this by the narrow margin of whatever Allen brings to the table above what you could expect from an average middle-of-the-bench player. And, perhaps, in the longterm, we win this even more if the salary savings ever factors into the equation.

In theory Ayton is a better player, but he has yet to show that he is.

 

[95pro]

I disagree. I think we won the trade but it was far from a great trade. DA, huge disappointment though he's been, is simply a better player than Nurkic. We won this by the narrow margin of whatever Allen brings to the table above what you could expect from an average middle-of-the-bench player. And, perhaps, in the longterm, we win this even more if the salary savings ever factors into the equation.

We just shifted stats around due to the different skills each player has. Nurk leads to more free throws and assists, but provides less defense which negates the offense Nurk created. Meanwhile Ayton is more mobile. Ayton never filled up the FT stats, but is way more efficient at putting the ball in the hoop.

Their net impact and contributions are the same.

We won by getting Allen and Little. There's the slight hope Little can be a piece for trade along with Bol Bol. A bit off topic, but I feel D Lee, Bol Bol and Little are taking up some usable rosters spots.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I disagree. I think we won the trade but it was far from a great trade. DA, huge disappointment though he's been, is simply a better player than Nurkic. We won this by the narrow margin of whatever Allen brings to the table above what you could expect from an average middle-of-the-bench player. And, perhaps, in the longterm, we win this even more if the salary savings ever factors into the equation.

This is fair.

 

[Muggz]

The few teams that wanted DA didn't want to pay. IMO anything we could do to get rid of him that wasn't cash considerations was fine by me.
We did the best we could with the crap we had to offer.
Beyond his lack of heart or motivation his low motor or Tesla battery his video games or whatever, he was a simpleton.
An easily butthurt, Antonio McDyess level of simpleton. Good riddance.
F that guy.

 

[Covert Rain]

Not ignoring the assists... don't care. He sucks under the hoop, he sucks from 3, he can't defend anyone. I don't give a crap if he can pass a bit (while also having some brutal turnovers). The negatives far out weight the positives... if there are positives... rebounding... every other game?

Ayton's defense last year was disapointing, but there is no way to claim it was "woeful", he was still an above average defensive big, he wasn't what he was in '21, that is true, and the drop off was frustrating. However, Nurkic is ass on defense, HE is the guy teams target and torch over and over.

As for Allen... he's averaging 12 points a game in 31 minutes. Woo hoo. His punchable face as a decent 8th man does little to make up for a disaster of a front court and a team that can do nothing on the interior.

Ayton is a clown... he quit... twice... I know. He still had value, as annoying as he was his good still outweighed the bad. We should have tried to rehab his value and traded him for a better deal.

We settled for scraps.

Yep. Disappointing but not non-existent or woeful. The defensive numbers don't lie with Ayton in verses out of the lineup. If this team becomes a complete sift on defense? It will be a crappy trade which I feared. I was all for trading Ayton but would have waited for something better or wait until the trade deadline. Maybe a better deal materializes and maybe it doesn't. We will never know. I don't agree with you on Allen. He is going to be a way better addition than most of what we had riding the bench last year. I hope to see better stuff when the lineup is completely healthy.

I disagree. I think we won the trade but it was far from a great trade. DA, huge disappointment though he's been, is simply a better player than Nurkic. We won this by the narrow margin of whatever Allen brings to the table above what you could expect from an average middle-of-the-bench player. And, perhaps, in the longterm, we win this even more if the salary savings ever factors into the equation.

I think the jury is still out on winning the trade but possibly in the long term it will be a net positive. To win the trade this team needs to be better than it was.

 

[Yuma]

Hold out for better… hope Ayton under a new staff can up his value.

I don’t see the offers getting worse.

Problem is, we needed a center. Look around the league, there's not much to pick from. Thus, Nurkic.

 

[Dan H]

Grayson’s contributions should be considered as well, IMO, when weighing the trade.

 

[Covert Rain]

Grayson’s contributions should be considered as well, IMO, when weighing the trade.

Agreed. However, a direct Nurkic to Ayton comparison is fair as well.

 

[Mainstreet]

Agreed. However, a direct Nurkic to Ayton comparison is fair as well.

If you want to only compare players, that is fair, but the Ayton trade has to be evaluated in its entirety.

As far as players go, Nutkic is less than Ayton which isn't saying much. Nurkic' athletic ability has been sapped. His salary does save the Suns some money.

 

[Covert Rain]

If you want to only compare players, that is fair, but the Ayton trade has to be evaluated in its entirety.

As far as players go, Nutkic is less than Ayton which isn't saying much. Nurkic' athletic ability has been sapped. His salary does save the Suns some money.

I believe that's what I said as well. In terms of Nurkic being "less" than Ayton that is hardly the point. The idea of trading Ayton was to get a legit piece in return so that drafting him wasn't a complete waste.

 

[Mainstreet]

I believe that's what I said as well. In terms of Nurkic being "less" than Ayton that is hardly the point. The idea of trading Ayton was to get a legit piece in return so that drafting him wasn't a complete waste.

Yeah, there are really two different issues in play that get interwoven.

The player comparison between Ayton versus Nurkic and the entirety of the trade. Admittedly, they are hard to separate.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

What I am seeing is that Grace Allen is more valuable to this team than Ayton. Anything Nurkic provides is gravy on stuffing

 

[Mainstreet]

What I am seeing is that Grace Allen is more valuable to this team than Ayton. Anything Nurkic provides is gravy on stuffing

You are making me hungry. I want gravy on almost all my Thanksgiving food.

 

[95pro]

You are making me hungry. I want gravy on almost all my Thanksgiving food.

Is the centerpiece of your Thanksgiving meal the turkey or ham?

 

[Mainstreet]

Is the centerpiece of your Thanksgiving meal the turkey or ham?

I like both but we are going with turkey for Thanksgiving and ham for Christmas.

 

[Hoop Head]

If you want to only compare players, that is fair, but the Ayton trade has to be evaluated in its entirety.

As far as players go, Nutkic is less than Ayton which isn't saying much. Nurkic' athletic ability has been sapped. His salary does save the Suns some money.

Why are you comparing Draymond Green to Ayton?

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Is the centerpiece of your Thanksgiving meal the turkey or ham?

Got to be turkey.

 

[Bufalay]

Ayton has attempted 5 free throws in 11 games this season.