Ayton's Development at the Quarter Mark of 2018-2019 Season

[1Sun]

Didn’t look like he was working anything today except maybe getting sized for a dress.

This above all else is why Kokoskov needs to be gone sooner rather than later (or barring that, why the Suns need to bring in a big man coach to work with Ayton who can have enough power to check Kokoskov's tendencies with him). You can see more and more clearly that Kokoskov is trying to turn Ayton into a Rudy Gobert or other finesse European style center, rather than the center Ayton needs to be. It is eroding Ayton's game and development drastically, especially on the offensive end.

 

[BC867]

Is there any doubt that Ayton is pissed that he was drafted by the Suns?

But there is every reason for him to play his butt off and make a name for himself.

No one likes a stat padder, but that is all the Suns have, especially with our two top scorers in and out with injuries.

But then, he can't do it by himself, with Book and Warren out. If the two of them were healthy, Book could call his own plays.

 

[1Sun]

Is there any doubt that Ayton is pissed that he was drafted by the Suns?

But there is every reason for him to play his butt off and make a name for himself.

No one likes a stat padder, but that is all the Suns have, especially with our two top scorers in and out with injuries.

But then, he can't do it by himself, with Book and Warren out. If the two of them were healthy, Book could call his own plays.

I don't think it is being drafted by the Suns so much as it is being forced to play without a point guard or power forward and for a coach who does not command respect.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Is there any doubt that Ayton is pissed that he was drafted by the Suns?

But there is every reason for him to play his butt off and make a name for himself.

No one likes a stat padder, but that is all the Suns have, especially with our two top scorers in and out with injuries.

Ayton is angry he got drafted by the Suns? When did he say that?

 

[Carolinacacti]

This above all else is why Kokoskov needs to be gone sooner rather than later (or barring that, why the Suns need to bring in a big man coach to work with Ayton who can have enough power to check Kokoskov's tendencies with him). You can see more and more clearly that Kokoskov is trying to turn Ayton into a Rudy Gobert or other finesse European style center, rather than the center Ayton needs to be. It is eroding Ayton's game and development drastically, especially on the offensive end.

I guess Kokoskov gives Holmes a different talk then Ayton. KoKo is not the problem.

 

[Mainstreet]

Ayton is angry he got drafted by the Suns? When did he say that?

The same here. I thought Ayton and his mother were thrilled the Suns drafted him.

 

[Superbone]

Ayton is angry he got drafted by the Suns? When did he say that?

Obviously, you can't read minds like BC can.

 

[1Sun]

I guess Kokoskov gives Holmes a different talk then Ayton. KoKo is not the problem.

Actually, Holmes is starting to play softer as well...and in any event he hasn't been here as long as Ayton, so he hasn't been corrupted as much by Kokoskov's Euro approach yet.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It wasn't until 9 minutes left in the third, already down 25 that Ayton actually got the ball in the post. That... that just can't be. Especially in a game where there's no Warren and Booker goes out at half. It's horrific use of his skills.

That said, he played like a passive, clueless puss again tonight and now even looks like he's rushing his jumper.

It's pissing me off. I think he's victim of really terrible coaching on offense. I don't know what the hell problem on defense is or how it can be fixed. hopefully experience. but offense? Kok can't say he wants Ayton to get 10 dunks while marooning him at the top of the freaking circle of the key the entire game.

 

[1Sun]

It wasn't until 9 minutes left in the third, already down 25 that Ayton actually got the ball in the post. That... that just can't be. Especially in a game where there's no Warren and Booker goes out at half. It's horrific use of his skills.

That said, he played like a passive, clueless puss again tonight and now even looks like he's rushing his jumper.

It's pissing me off. I think he's victim of really terrible coaching on offense. I don't know what the hell problem on defense is or how it can be fixed. hopefully experience. but offense? Kok can't say he wants Ayton to get 10 dunks while marooning him at the top of the freaking circle of the key the entire game.

Bingo. Again, knowing this, can the Suns really afford to keep Kokoskov for the entire season, all but assuring that this will continue over the course of another 60 games?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Bingo. Again, knowing this, can the Suns really afford to keep Kokoskov for the entire season, all but assuring that this will continue over the course of another 60 games?

I'll be honest... they have to. they already look like SUCH A JOKE, that they have to suck this up for the rest of the year. They can save some kind of face ONLY if at some point they go out and make a BIG GM move and then that GM can say he wants his guy, fire Koko and move forward. if Sarver makes the move, we just keep making the team look like a clown-car driving on the wrong side of the freeway. They need someone credible to make that kind of yank. Question is... why would ANYONE credible as a GM come here? I don't know the answer... or probably just don't want to admit I do know but won't say.

One awful season won't kill Ayton forever, but Koko's complete and utterly atrocious offense, which takes advantage of NONE of Ayton's obvious strengths either has to change drastically, or his ass needs to be shown the door when the new GM comes in.

If James Jones is named permanent, I might as well burn my Nash jersey and get hypnotized into being a Clippers fan because we will be completely hopeless. At least with the Clips, they have an owner who wants to win and it would be a team I could root for in my adopted home.

This ish sucks.

 

[Yuma]

I always liked Jerry West as a GM.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I always liked Jerry West as a GM.

they need a name/mind like that as SOME part of the FO if anyone is ever going to take them even somewhat serious again.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't mean this as a disrespect to Ayton. I agree with everything above. I rate him 5 out of 10 because I think his upside is higher and he's only halfway to his true potential.

Do I think the Suns selected the best player for us at our pick? Hell yes! With all due respect to Alvan Adams, we always as a franchise seemed to be looking for that "franchise center." I believe Ayton is going to grow into that. It's like we are watching Booker in his first year, and are wondering if he can make the jump to one of the top players at his position. Now we see Booker years later and forget he just didn't jump out of the gate to how he is playing now. I think Ayton will be one of the top centers in the league. Ayton already has seen he needs more power, strength, ability to low post better, better defense, etc., from all his comments to fans and reporters. Ayton already looks like he is working on that during the season already. Give him a couple off seasons to work on his body, and watch out!

I think this is a very good point. No one here has said anything about Ayton that he hasn't said about himself, in a way. He knows his weaknesses and has addressed them. It would be great if he was more of a finished product right now but I have very little doubt that he will become one of the best Centers in the league within the next 3-4 years, before his rookie contract is finished.

I would grade him at like an A- for the year so far, he's been a solid A on offense and has been able to do things I didn't expect to see so soon from him. It would be great if he was more aggressive with our opponents and more demanding from his teammates but that's just not who he is right now. He is a 20 year old rookie who just entered the league. Unlike Embiid he doesn't make a joke of everything and cares about how he's perceived by his peers. He's not a joke or a clown, he's a guy who is finding his place and with time I think we'll see him step into more of a leadership role but I don't think he wants to step on anyone's toes as a rookie and I can respect that. I wish he had a "screw you" sort of mentality because he was the #1 overall pick in what looks to be one of the best draft classes in years but that's just not who he is and I'd rather have a player who shows respect to his peers at this point than someone with an attitude problem like the Morrii.

He needs to work on the defensive end but he's looked better lately, like the last 4-5 games. He's been improving all year and while his defense has been a little disappointing, I blame Kokoskov for that more than Ayton. Igor shouldn't have talked up Ayton as our "defensive coordinator" prior to this season starting. That's too much to put on a rookie big whose defense wasn't anything great in college and wasn't why he was drafted #1. I hope to see him get his blocks up to 1 a game before the year is done. That will show growth on his part since he's sucked at blocking shots so far. A starting center in the NBA needs to average no less than 1 block a game, IMO. If he's not giving you rim protection then he needs to make up for it elsewhere, and I believe Ayton can do that. FWIW Tyson Chandler never averaged 1 or more blocks per game in Phoenix and I don't recall anyone calling him out for that. I know there are different expectations but that's another reason I'm glad Chandler is gone and no longer Ayton's "mentor" like some people hoped he would be.

 

[Carolinacacti]

The problem is the Suns have no PF. Anderson sucks, JJ has no beef and Ariza can't compete down low with the big boys. Hell the best low post defender is Warren. This team needs Warren more then Booker that's for sure.
I think Aytons going to be a stud. Makes everything look so easy, wait tell he gets a big brother down low to help him.

 

[Yuma]

Looking at Ayton's mentality. He is not a banger like Shaq. He's a skilled center. We were able to bring Kareem in to help our centers in the past. Maybe he needs a mentor more like that, than a mean banger like Corliss Williamson.

 

[Carolinacacti]

Did you see the foul they called on him when James shot the three. Never touched him and got called for a foul.

 

[Yuma]

The problem is the Suns have no PF. Anderson sucks, JJ has no beef and Ariza can't compete down low with the big boys. Hell the best low post defender is Warren. This team needs Warren more then Booker that's for sure.
I think Aytons going to be a stud. Makes everything look so easy, wait tell he gets a big brother down low to help him.

The Suns do have a PF. His name is Holmes! LOL. Like to see Igor try it a couple times.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The problem is the Suns have no PF. Anderson sucks, JJ has no beef and Ariza can't compete down low with the big boys. Hell the best low post defender is Warren. This team needs Warren more then Booker that's for sure.
I think Aytons going to be a stud. Makes everything look so easy, wait tell he gets a big brother down low to help him.

Nah, Warren is a solid player but he's nothing special. Booker is, or at least is when he's fully healthy. But it's time someone takes a look at his diet and exercise regimen and some grownup needs to say "never again" - you don't play in a game until you're fully healthy and in shape from this moment on. Some players can still help their team when they are at less than full strength, he's not one of them.

 

[Yuma]

Nah, Warren is a solid player but he's nothing special. Booker is, or at least is when he's fully healthy. But it's time someone takes a look at his diet and exercise regimen and some grownup needs to say "never again" - you don't play in a game until you're fully healthy and in shape from this moment on. Some players can still help their team when they are at less than full strength, he's not one of them.

I think our training staff is great at healing guys. I think we need better strength and conditioning to start with. Some teams you see their guys get jacked!

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ayton is angry he got drafted by the Suns? When did he say that?

Never. Just crazy talk.

 

[Western Font]

He’s got to WANT to dominate on the block. He really does nothing to fight for position or demand the ball and rarely goes up strong to the rim. I think Igor is in over his head but a coach can’t brainwash a player into something he’s not.

Just for clarification, I meant the trading block. But at the time I also thought the four-letter-word being implied was "bust" and not "soft."

 

[BC867]

Obviously, you can't read minds like BC can.

I don't think it is being drafted by the Suns so much as it is being forced to play without a point guard or power forward and for a coach who does not command respect.

I think we mean the same thing. Ayton, as we fans, expected that the Suns would put a (I'll use my word again -- balanced) roster around him and Book. But it didn't get better, it got worse. Sure, Ayton had high hopes when the Suns drafted him as their first and only #1 pick. Do he or we have high hopes now?

And the word "tank" has already started appearing in posts. Here we go again. I'll betcha DeAndre wouldn't want to hear that.

 

[BC867]

Just for clarification, I meant the trading block. But at the time I also thought the four-letter-word being implied was "bust" and not "soft."

I thought the four-letter word was a different one beginning with "s".

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

I'll be honest... they have to. they already look like SUCH A JOKE, that they have to suck this up for the rest of the year. They can save some kind of face ONLY if at some point they go out and make a BIG GM move and then that GM can say he wants his guy, fire Koko and move forward. if Sarver makes the move, we just keep making the team look like a clown-car driving on the wrong side of the freeway. They need someone credible to make that kind of yank. Question is... why would ANYONE credible as a GM come here? I don't know the answer... or probably just don't want to admit I do know but won't say.

One awful season won't kill Ayton forever, but Koko's complete and utterly atrocious offense, which takes advantage of NONE of Ayton's obvious strengths either has to change drastically, or his ass needs to be shown the door when the new GM comes in.

If James Jones is named permanent, I might as well burn my Nash jersey and get hypnotized into being a Clippers fan because we will be completely hopeless. At least with the Clips, they have an owner who wants to win and it would be a team I could root for in my adopted home.

This ish sucks.

Most are complaining about Aytons passive nature. Yet here you say it is the coach's fault for not exploiting his "obvious strengths". Which are? Compete lack of desire to establish himself in the post? Lack of lower body strength to keep solid post position if he were to get there? As I said in the game thread, Igor may be the wrong guy. But the scheme is not to blame. Ayton has so many individual opportunities that he does not take or capitalize on that I find it disingenuous to place the blame first on someone else. Perhaps a more experienced coach wouldn't be playing him much at all...