Bad Bad Levi Brown...

[WisconsinCard]

Why? Because we reached for need? Had Long and Baker declared, we would have been far happier with either of them, but we were stuck with Brown.

Heck, we could have retained Big for a season, been better, and then gotten one of those two guys next season. We didn't do well because we let need dictate above talent.

So because we drafted for need, we should have tagged LD and then drafted for need next year???? Now that funny. And you know those guys will be better next year because??? OH yea you said so!!!!!!!!

 

[RugbyMuffin]

No, for a couple reasons.

1) Because I think right now this is a 3-13 team and already headed for the #1 overall pick. Top 5 would be an improvement.

2) If we really wanted to get rid of Davis, we could franchise him again and then trade our first and two seconds to move up to get Long and/or Baker. But since I would have predicted greater improvements for Davis under Grimm/Whis than many forsee for Brown, I think that we wouldn't be looking for a new LT, anyway, and we'd be happy paying $50 million for a guy that made his first Pro Bowl.

You got a point there.

I agree. We should have franchised BIG. AND that would have opened up the draft to anyone we wanted to pick. But I still think we would have passed on Adrian Peterson. It is FACT no one was going to trade up so with the fifth pick in the draft we would pick...........who? Patrick Willis, LaRon Landry ? I think those would be as much as a "reach" as Levi Brown.

Personally I would have liked to see Leonard Davis AND Levi Brown on our line.

As for next year ? Teams didn't want to trade for Davis this year, and A. I don't think Davis is pro bowl bound IF he is on the Cardinals, B. I don't think we could have traded him next year.

As for 3-13. That might be a bit much but I am still in the belief that our offensive line is STILL a huge question mark. Levi is only a rookie, and the rest of the core is either known to be horrible, or have yet to prove their collective worth.

I can personally see where K9's thoughts are. And even though they temper the enthusiam on the board right now he does make his points.

This club is still a bit away from being a anual playoff team. They COULD make the playoffs this year if things fall into place, but just as likely they could also lose 10 games.

Looking at the situation from a personal view and not a logical view. I am happy to see Davis gone, he was embarrassing. I like the Alan Branch pick and the Levi Brown pick.

Looking at the team right now our needs are:

LT
TE
OLB

which is the least amount of holes on this team since..........since I can remember.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

That might be a bit much but I am still in the belief that our offensive line is STILL a huge question mark. Levi is only a rookie, and the rest of the core is either known to be horrible, or have yet to prove their collective worth.

Very well put .. and I agree .. we have added some talent to the mix but I'm not sure we have enough for Grimm to work with .. only time will tell .. but another year of a terrible Oline and I'm going to really hot ...

Is Grimm a magician .. ?? can he make an apple out of an orange with Ross .. ?? Wells at guard .. ?? these are real legitimate questions ...

 

[Denny Green Fan]

if Jake Long had come out the Bucs probably would have picked him

 

[kerouac9]

So because we drafted for need, we should have tagged LD and then drafted for need next year???? Now that funny. And you know those guys will be better next year because??? OH yea you said so!!!!!!!!

Everyone agrees that Long and Baker are better prospects than Brown. If you don't believe that, you probably didn't watch the Rose Bowl, where they both played.

If Levi Brown was on the board and the BPA, we could have drafted him. Whis is all about depth and competition, right? Well, what's better depth and competition: Brown v. Davis at LT, or Brown v. Gandy? Gandy is a guard playing tackle. Davis is an infinitely better guard playing tackle. And we still would have been able to make the same moves in the draft and free agency as we have to this point.

Then extend that logic: what's a better tackle tandem: Brown and Davis, or Brown and Ross/Gandy? Which would be the better run-blocking group?

I still don't understand why people think that Levi is an upgrade over consecutive Pro Bowl alternate LT Leonard Davis. They're scouting reports are virutally the same, except everyone agrees that Davis is more talented. If people think that Grimm can coach Levi Brown into Marvel Smith, why don't they think that he could have coached Leonard Davis into Orlando Pace?

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Everyone agrees that Long and Baker are better prospects than Brown. If you don't believe that, you probably didn't watch the Rose Bowl, where they both played.

If Levi Brown was on the board and the BPA, we could have drafted him. Whis is all about depth and competition, right? Well, what's better depth and competition: Brown v. Davis at LT, or Brown v. Gandy? Gandy is a guard playing tackle. Davis is an infinitely better guard playing tackle. And we still would have been able to make the same moves in the draft and free agency as we have to this point.

I still don't understand why people think that Levi is an upgrade over consecutive Pro Bowl alternate LT Leonard Davis. They're scouting reports are virutally the same, except everyone agrees that Davis is more talented. If people think that Grimm can coach Levi Brown into Marvel Smith, why don't they think that he could have coached Leonard Davis into Orlando Pace?

Good points, and I agree with you. (Except for the fact that Davis is infinitely better at Guard than Tackle) He was a probowl alternate at LG. To be infinitely better, he would have to be an consensus all pro.

I am forced to like the Levi pick, eventhough I like Staley better. He just has McNeil written all over him. (not necessarily in similar styles, but in talent)

 

[Gambit]

Dang, caught red-handed. Make stuff up, repeat over and over until until people begin to believe it. First thing they teach you at politician school. Also important in message board posting.

Your ideas intrigue me and I would like to suscribe to your newsletter. /Simpsons before it got horrible

 

[BigDavis75]

Good points, and I agree with you. (Except for the fact that Davis is infinitely better at Guard than Tackle) He was a probowl alternate at LG. To be infinitely better, he would have to be an consensus all pro.

I am forced to like the Levi pick, eventhough I like Staley better. He just has McNeil written all over him. (not necessarily in similar styles, but in talent)

He never played LG, he was slated to start there but got put at LT a few years back. Also, I am going to have to agree with K9 here. Brown may turn out to be a good player but I would feel more comfortable with LD and someone like Landry or Patrick Willis on the Defense and then go into next years draft looking at either Baker, Gaither or Jake Long.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

He never played LG, he was slated to start there but got put at LT a few years back. Also, I am going to have to agree with K9 here. Brown may turn out to be a good player but I would feel more comfortable with LD and someone like Landry or Patrick Willis on the Defense and then go into next years draft looking at either Baker, Gaither or Jake Long.

That was a typo. I mean to say LT.

 

[Dback Jon]

WE didn't franchise Big. That was the smartest thing to do. Anyone that doesn't agree is an idiot that knows absolutely nothing about football. his fat ass is not worth $50 million.


End of story. Move on with your life. Analyze the current Cardinals. Big is a frickin Cowpuke now, so he is absolute scum.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

WE didn't franchise Big. That was the smartest thing to do. Anyone that doesn't agree is an idiot that knows absolutely nothing about football. his fat ass is not worth $50 million.


End of story. Move on with your life. Analyze the current Cardinals. Big is a frickin Cowpuke now, so he is absolute scum.

Uh oh. A franchise tag is not worth 50 million. It is worth the average of the top 5 played players at the players position that year. This year would have been about $12 million.

You can also remove the tag whenever you want. If you can trade him, remove the tag and cut him.

 

[Linderbee]

WE didn't franchise Big. That was the smartest thing to do. Anyone that doesn't agree is an idiot that knows absolutely nothing about football. his fat ass is not worth $50 million.


End of story. Move on with your life. Analyze the current Cardinals. Big is a frickin Cowpuke now, so he is absolute scum.

Wow, Jon. Tell us how you really feel on the subject. Damn.

 

[Dback Jon]

Uh oh. A franchise tag is not worth 50 million. It is worth the average of the top 5 played players at the players position that year. This year would have been about $12 million.

You can also remove the tag whenever you want. If you can trade him, remove the tag and cut him.

That is what Big signed for. And Big is not worth $12 million either. Letting Big walk was ABSOLUTELY the right thing to do. Our O-Line will be much improved this year, just wait and see.

 

[Dback Jon]

Wow, Jon. Tell us how you really feel on the subject. Damn.

Ok - next time I will not tone it down any

 

[40yearfan]

WE didn't franchise Big. That was the smartest thing to do. Anyone that doesn't agree is an idiot that knows absolutely nothing about football. his fat ass is not worth $50 million.


End of story. Move on with your life. Analyze the current Cardinals. Big is a frickin Cowpuke now, so he is absolute scum.

:notworthy

 

[Heucrazy]

No, for a couple reasons.

1) Because I think right now this is a 3-13 team and already headed for the #1 overall pick. Top 5 would be an improvement.

2) If we really wanted to get rid of Davis, we could franchise him again and then trade our first and two seconds to move up to get Long and/or Baker. But since I would have predicted greater improvements for Davis under Grimm/Whis than many forsee for Brown, I think that we wouldn't be looking for a new LT, anyway, and we'd be happy paying $50 million for a guy that made his first Pro Bowl.

But if we had kept LD we wouldn't be a 3-13 team in your opinion? That doesn't make any sense.

The problem with this team has been the oline and the coaches not using the massive amounts of talent we have in the skill positions correctly. Guess what LD was a huge part of that ******* oline. It's addition by subtraction. Now if Whis can figure out how to use Fitz, Q, Edge, and Matt correctly then watch out.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

That is what Big signed for. And Big is not worth $12 million either. Letting Big walk was ABSOLUTELY the right thing to do. Our O-Line will be much improved this year, just wait and see.

Sorry, but I will disagree with you on this one until the grave. Was Big worth 12 million, probably not. Was big worth SOMETHING? Absolutely. You tag him, and try to trade him before the draft. If you can't trade him. you remove the tag. It is as simple as that.

Even if you trade him for the 4th rounder that we used to trade up for Watson, it is better than nothing.

 

[BigRedArk]

Sorry, but I will disagree with you on this one until the grave. Was Big worth 12 million, probably not. Was big worth SOMETHING? Absolutely. You tag him, and try to trade him before the draft. If you can't trade him. you remove the tag. It is as simple as that.

Even if you trade him for the 4th rounder that we used to trade up for Watson, it is better than nothing.

Well said. It was a seller's market this year in FA. The demand for OT talent far outstripped the supply. Dallas and Washington both were interested in LD. Graves could have made a deal with one of them for him and at least gotten something in return.

Also the Big detractors all seem to believe that Grimm can coach up Ross to be our starting LT but he couldn't coach up LD. Heck at this point what is another new OL coach to LD? He only had 4 during his time as a Card. Or was it 5? Maybe 6? I lost count.

 

[Duckjake]

He never played LG, he was slated to start there but got put at LT a few years back. Also, I am going to have to agree with K9 here. Brown may turn out to be a good player but I would feel more comfortable with LD and someone like Landry or Patrick Willis on the Defense and then go into next years draft looking at either Baker, Gaither or Jake Long.

LD played RG in 2001, RT in 2002, moved back to RG in 2003 and Left Tackle in 2004-06.

 

[Heucrazy]

Well said. It was a seller's market this year in FA. The demand for OT talent far outstripped the supply. Dallas and Washington both were interested in LD. Graves could have made a deal with one of them for him and at least gotten something in return.

Also the Big detractors all seem to believe that Grimm can coach up Ross to be our starting LT but he couldn't coach up LD. Heck at this point what is another new OL coach to LD? He only had 4 during his time as a Card. Or was it 5? Maybe 6? I lost count.

I have yet to see one person happy with Ross starting at LT.

 

[Mulli]

DCR, your typo has derailed a thread.

 

[kerouac9]

I have yet to see one person happy with Ross starting at LT.

Well, he's still the starting LT. Wouldn't everyone be happy(er) with Davis as starting LT and Brown as starting RT? Wouldn't this team be better (especially at running the ball) with them on the outside? Wouldn't that be worth the cost?

The question isn't whether this year's line will be better than last year's. It's whether this year's line would have been better with LD being coached by Russ Grimm and a renewed committment to running the ball than this year's line with Oliver Ross as starting LT.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

DCR, your typo has derailed a thread.

It happens all the time. I don't proofread well.

 

[vinnymac]

Well, he's still the starting LT. Wouldn't everyone be happy(er) with Davis as starting LT and Brown as starting RT? Wouldn't this team be better (especially at running the ball) with them on the outside? Wouldn't that be worth the cost?

The question isn't whether this year's line will be better than last year's. It's whether this year's line would have been better with LD being coached by Russ Grimm and a renewed committment to running the ball than this year's line with Oliver Ross as starting LT.

No. It is all about the players that the cardinals have. It is about if this year o-line is better than last year o-line. Davis is with the cowpies. So he has no effect on the cardinals offensive line any longer.

It is time to let go with your fancination with lenard davis or convert into a Dallas Cowboy fan.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

No. It is all about the players that the cardinals have. It is about if this year o-line is better than last year o-line. Davis is with the cowpies. So he has no effect on the cardinals offensive line any longer.

It is time to let go with your fancination with lenard davis or convert into a Dallas Cowboy fan.

How can you say it is time to let go, when Josh McCown still gets discussion here?

People's hatred of this guy runs deep. It is hilarious.