Early morning thoughts

[ajcardfan]

The way the game plays out proves that going for two did not affect our ability to win the game, because we were able to score a touchdown.

The way the game plays out after the fact has no bearing on the decision at the moment because as good as BA is, he can't see into the future. Being a good head coach, he calculated the odds of scoring another TD combined with stopping the Chargers from scoring, and decided to open up his potential options, knowing that a TD alone could be the difference regardless.

Yeah, we could've converted the two and still lost. Kicked the point and still lost, made either and still won, etc, etc The only thing that really matters is we won.

It just was not a no-brainer call with that much time left. I don't know how many head coaches in the NFL would've gone for 2 there, but I would bet your house it would not be 100%.

 

[D-Dogg]

Yeah, we could've converted the two and still lost. Kicked the point and still lost, made either and still won, etc, etc The only thing that really matters is we won.

It just was not a no-brainer call with that much time left. I don't know how many head coaches in the NFL would've gone for 2 there, but I would bet your house it would not be 100%.

No, because a lot of them are bad coaches.

 

[Reddog]

No I watched on tv where about 15 seconds after the first replay they showed another angle and it was obvious not a pick.

I don't think he had any major reason to rush but I don't know but it was really clear on tv we were going to lose that I was quite surprised he challenged but then maybe he didn't get the angle he needed fast enough.

Yea totally different experience at the game. We all agreed with the challenge based on the views provided but eventually they showed that alternative view and it was clear we were screwed and my entire section knew it. I was surprised when so any booed the outcome but I guess they were not watching the replay.

 

[Russ Smith]

Yep, exactly. NO difference in 4 or 5 points when TDs are in rare supply.

By going for two, suceeding and being down three gives you more opportunity to win or tie the game in your next two or three drives than kicking and being down 4 or failing and being down 5.

K9 puts it best in that it creates more opportunity for you to win in the end because your options become stronger.

Sometimes people what if to death on these things "what if we did kick it, and are down 4, and then we score and are up 3. then we can only be tied" Well, what if is an all day long game. What if we don't get another TD? What if our last gasp dies out at the 25 yard line and it's 4th and 10? Go for it? What if our defense doesn't hold them and they kick that FG and win it? What if we miss the xp, and still score the TD to take the lead? One of those what if scenarios happened, and it happened even with one of the worst plays run for a faild 2 pt conversion that I've seen. It wasn't a "near miss." It was a calculated risk that gave us more options to win when we attempted it.

What if we don't get the 2 and then have to go for 2 again on the next TD and don't get that and instead of a 3 point lead we have a one point lead?

Different scenario but there's a football analytics site that says if were down 14 not 11 there that the right play is go for 2, not 1. Their argument is that if you get it, you're only down 6 so 2 FG's ties it, or a TD and XP wins it.

they then state the reason most coaches don't do it is statistically if you are down 14 and score 2 TD's and kick the XP both times, you have a 2% chance of losing in regulation, if you go for 2 on the first TD you have a 27% chance of losing. But their argument is that by going for 2 you increase the odds of WINNING in regulation.

At home I don't see the point in taking that risk. But again that's a different scenario it's 14 not 11.

 

[Chopper0080]

All LBs on our roster suck other than Shaughnessy and Foote, who are just athletically challenged.

Minter looked like dog crap.

Acho looked like dog crap.

Kaiser looked better than both of them, but not great. (not expected though)

Ugh...they suck. The fact that Kaiser gets on the field after being on the roster for like two weeks and Deone Bucannon had to learn LB so he could start there, says it all.

This position needs to be blown up next year.
Happy for the win. Chargers are a good team. Our pass rush will be a constant issue this season.

 

[Japes]

All LBs on our roster suck other than Shaughnessy and Foote, who are just athletically challenged.

Minter looked like dog crap.

Acho looked like dog crap.

Kaiser looked better than both of them, but not great. (not expected though)

Ugh...they suck. The fact that Kaiser gets on the field after being on the roster for like two weeks and Deone Bucannon had to learn LB so he could start there, says it all.

This position needs to be blown up next year.
Happy for the win. Chargers are a good team. Our pass rush will be a constant issue this season.

Agreed about our LB play. It also really sucked to see Attaochu balling out last night cause he was a guy I know we would have loved to take in the 2nd if he fell to us.

 

[Osbern61]

I didn't want to start a new thread, so I thought I'd append this great bit from Bruce on this one. (From Josh Weinfuss of ESPN)

Arians said winning on the night former Cardinals quarterback Kurt Warner was inducted into the team’s Ring of Honor was important. “You don’t want to lose those games. Those are special, special nights. I know history says that we lose those games. We’re not about history here anymore.”

 

[kerouac9]

All LBs on our roster suck other than Shaughnessy and Foote, who are just athletically challenged.

Minter looked like dog crap.

Acho looked like dog crap.

Kaiser looked better than both of them, but not great. (not expected though)

Ugh...they suck. The fact that Kaiser gets on the field after being on the roster for like two weeks and Deone Bucannon had to learn LB so he could start there, says it all.

This position needs to be blown up next year.
Happy for the win. Chargers are a good team. Our pass rush will be a constant issue this season.

Acho's career arc should be similar to Lorenzo Alexander's. I think that Acho is a fine 40th man on the roster, but I shouldn't be noticing him unless he's getting a coverage sack.

Minter only looks bad for his draft position. We basically used a very high 2nd round pick on Jasper Brinkley. It's not a disaster, but it's pretty bad. No reason to put him on the field.

I think that all of the Larry Foote praise is based on low initial expectations and Ronald McKinnon Syndrome. Foote wasn't forced to cover RBs or TEs Monday night, and basically just cleaned up a lot of stuff from the defensive line (which played very well).

 

[D-Dogg]

What if we don't get the 2 and then have to go for 2 again on the next TD and don't get that and instead of a 3 point lead we have a one point lead?

Then we still win and Chargers idiots can use the "only won by 1" excuse.

Seriously though, that's the point. You have the lead and that's what the risk/reward you are considering is about. That's the worst case outline from your scoring approach (you can't even start worrying about them scoring or not, because one score by them kills everything - you just count your own eggs).

 

[Totally_Red]

All LBs on our roster suck other than Shaughnessy and Foote, who are just athletically challenged.

Minter looked like dog crap.

Acho looked like dog crap.

Kaiser looked better than both of them, but not great. (not expected though)

Ugh...they suck. The fact that Kaiser gets on the field after being on the roster for like two weeks and Deone Bucannon had to learn LB so he could start there, says it all.

This position needs to be blown up next year.
Happy for the win. Chargers are a good team. Our pass rush will be a constant issue this season.

Right now, it appears that inside and outside linebacker have to be at the top of the Cardinals 2015 off-season shopping list. Even if Okeafor plays decently once he gets healthy I don't see as being anything more than average.

 

[Russ Smith]

Acho's career arc should be similar to Lorenzo Alexander's. I think that Acho is a fine 40th man on the roster, but I shouldn't be noticing him unless he's getting a coverage sack.

Minter only looks bad for his draft position. We basically used a very high 2nd round pick on Jasper Brinkley. It's not a disaster, but it's pretty bad. No reason to put him on the field.

I think that all of the Larry Foote praise is based on low initial expectations and Ronald McKinnon Syndrome. Foote wasn't forced to cover RBs or TEs Monday night, and basically just cleaned up a lot of stuff from the defensive line (which played very well).

Hard to say Minter missed much of the preseason wtih the injury and didn't play last year so we have no idea how good he'll eventually be. He certainly didn't look like a starting ILB Mon night but again he's likely pretty rusty.

The question on him has always been speed, he can tackle and hit but is he fast enough.

Foote did his job but yes we were playing extra safeties, I don't know if that was because our LB's suck, or because we feared Gates and their other TE so much we decided to play an extra safety and sometimes 2 extra.

 

[crisper57]

Darren Urban @Cardschatter · Sep 9
BA mentioned Cards offense had some issues hearing with home crowd noise. Crowd need to quiet then? "Yeah. And keep their tickets."

 

[Chopper0080]

Acho's career arc should be similar to Lorenzo Alexander's. I think that Acho is a fine 40th man on the roster, but I shouldn't be noticing him unless he's getting a coverage sack.

Minter only looks bad for his draft position. We basically used a very high 2nd round pick on Jasper Brinkley. It's not a disaster, but it's pretty bad. No reason to put him on the field.

I think that all of the Larry Foote praise is based on low initial expectations and Ronald McKinnon Syndrome. Foote wasn't forced to cover RBs or TEs Monday night, and basically just cleaned up a lot of stuff from the defensive line (which played very well).

To your point, Acho shouldn't be starting, and that is a talent issue.

Minter has underachieved per his draft position, and needs to be upgraded upon unless he improves over the course of the season.

Alexander is/should be strictly special teams.

Okafor...unknown, but seems to be a Shaughnessy clone.

Benard...yuck.

Kaiser, might be the best rusher on the roster at LB.

Hopefully the 2014 draft taught Keim a lesson that you can't be complacent in acquiring edge rushers. There just aren't many options available, and you don't want to be the guy standing without a chair.

 

[crisper57]

To your point, Acho shouldn't be starting, and that is a talent issue.

Minter has underachieved per his draft position, and needs to be upgraded upon unless he improves over the course of the season.

Alexander is/should be strictly special teams.

Okafor...unknown, but seems to be a Shaughnessy clone.

Benard...yuck.

Kaiser, might be the best rusher on the roster at LB.

Hopefully the 2014 draft taught Keim a lesson that you can't be complacent in acquiring edge rushers. There just aren't many options available, and you don't want to be the guy standing without a chair.

I only have an issue with the highlighted part. It wasn't like he was going to displace Dansby or Washington last year the way they were playing. And he played well in Preseason Week 1 until he was injured. So I don't think he's had a chance to show us anything yet.

 

[ajcardfan]

I only have an issue with the highlighted part. It wasn't like he was going to displace Dansby or Washington last year the way they were playing. And he played well in Preseason Week 1 until he was injured. So I don't think he's had a chance to show us anything yet.

But, if he had been playing anywhere near the level of either he would've gotten a lot more snaps than ONE on defense. Just to help with the wear and tear on the legs of the other two. We did actually blow some teams out last year, why didn't he play in those games?

"Johnny Rutledge Syndrome": It's always bad when a first or second round pick LB cannot make it onto the field his rookie season.

 

[crisper57]

Chris Mortensen ‏@mortreport Sep 8
Heard many opposing coaches & players say Cardinals' home crowd at Univ of Phoenix Stadium one of most underrated advantages in NFL

Wow!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Wow!

doesn't surprise me. when that place is on, it is ON. One of my friends is an Eagle fan and went to the NFC Title Game and the 27-6 pasting we gave them in 2012 and was talking all kinds of smack to me and some other Cardinals friends via text when the Cards were losing Monday. Then, when they came back and won, knowing he has to go see the Eagles there again this year, his only response to our celebration was:

"I hate playing in that stadium".

It's a legit homefield. Pretty awesome after all those years.

 

[crisper57]

Upon further review, the NFL is going to award the win to the Chargers.

Just look at these penalties on the game-winning TD.

You must be registered for see images

That is a blatant block in the back (or a hold) and a tripping penalty that went uncalled!

The NFL apologizes for the late ruling, but they just saw this image for the first time this morning.

http://www.azcardinals.com/news-and...End-Zone/9d69f01c-0d31-4780-bcae-5d18e43adf0f

 

[Chopper0080]

I only have an issue with the highlighted part. It wasn't like he was going to displace Dansby or Washington last year the way they were playing. And he played well in Preseason Week 1 until he was injured. So I don't think he's had a chance to show us anything yet.

Being unable to beat out your competition, and then being unavailble to play once you are given a spot is almost a death sentence for an NFL career. I get what you are saying, but NFL stands for "Not For Long" and if you don't capitalize on your chances when they come up, you aren't going to be around too long to get more.

Facts are that Carson has shown more than Minter to this point, and Minter would have likely been cut if he wasn't a 2nd round pick. His draft status is pretty much the only reason he is on the roster at this point. Unless he flashes something this year, I am finding a replacement next offseason via free agency or the draft.