Fire Green -- NOW!!

[conraddobler]

For all those that want to continue with this repetitive nonsense, something to think about. You call for the coaches head but any gameplan that was scripted was blown up with the first Seattle drive( That the players gave up big plays and stupid penalties on) and the subsequent fumble by JJ on the kickoff after Seattle scored. Then Warner fumbles a bad snap.The Coaches now had to scrap there play calling and try and play catch up which DG alluded to in his press conference is not an easy task to do. The Defense and Special teams put them in an early hole on the road to the defending NFC champs....I think that would have been a tall order to overcome for any coaching staff. The Defense righted itself and the team kept the game reachable. Having not expected a win in Seattle I think there was some things that the team did ok, and there are some things that need to be worked out. I just can't understand the doom and gloom by some that want to continue to bash the Coaches after a game that was out of hand out of the gate and then kept close enough to steal it later. They( the coaches) never got the opportunity to run there game plan because of the hole they were put in from the word go.

I'm sorry but good lord as if the coaches have nothing to do with constantly allowing the other team to score on it's first freakin drive.

We have to lead the league in that category, newsflash, suprise us, develop an effective plan to stop the other team once to start the game, it's a neat concept.

 

[D-Dogg]

and the subsequent fumble by JJ on the kickoff after Seattle scored....

snip

The Defense and Special teams put them in an early hole on the road to the defending NFC champs....

That fumble was called back and on the rekick, JJ took the ball to midfield. The offense couldn't do anything with prime real estate and put a TD on the board. That's a problem. So you can forget about the fumble, because its as if it never happened and instead we had the ball at midfield.

Can't blame special teams at all on this game. Returns and coverage on kicks were really good.

 

[Rats]

I'm sorry but good lord as if the coaches have nothing to do with constantly allowing the other team to score on it's first freakin drive.

We have to lead the league in that category, newsflash, suprise us, develop an effective plan to stop the other team once to start the game, it's a neat concept.

Neat concept hell Conrad, they had them in a 3rd and 12 on both drives and couldn't cover Jackson. Big plays killed early on defense. Getting the Seahawks in a long yardage on 3rd down is what the coaches wanted, that is not a high percentage conversion, but they converted both times. Stop that 3rd and 12 both times and it is a different ball game. Coaches coach, players are paid to make plays. They didn't in the first 8 minutes, it put the team in the hole. The coaches always talk about matching the other teams intensity out of the gate. The D did not do that and It put the O in a catch up situation.

 

[Russ Smith]

For all those that want to continue with this repetitive nonsense, something to think about. You call for the coaches head but any gameplan that was scripted was blown up with the first Seattle drive( That the players gave up big plays and stupid penalties on) and the subsequent fumble by JJ on the kickoff after Seattle scored. Then Warner fumbles a bad snap.The Coaches now had to scrap there play calling and try and play catch up which DG alluded to in his press conference is not an easy task to do. The Defense and Special teams put them in an early hole on the road to the defending NFC champs....I think that would have been a tall order to overcome for any coaching staff. The Defense righted itself and the team kept the game reachable. Having not expected a win in Seattle I think there was some things that the team did ok, and there are some things that need to be worked out. I just can't understand the doom and gloom by some that want to continue to bash the Coaches after a game that was out of hand out of the gate and then kept close enough to steal it later. They( the coaches) never got the opportunity to run there game plan because of the hole they were put in from the word go.

JJ's fumble didn't count though so it had no impact on the gameplan. IN fact we had the ball out around the 47 because of his subsequent return. At that point we ran on first and second down which is precisely what Green said he wanted to do, run. Warner then fumbled on 3rd down, Step recovered and we punted. So we had great field position and did exactly what the game plan called for and still went 3 and out.

Seattle then marches right downfield and hits a 49 yard td pass and the game is 14-0. We get the ball back with nearly 50 minutes left in the game and we really HAD to abandon the entire gameplan that early? We didn't we even ran 4 times in the next drive before the FG hit the upright.

at some point sure being down 14-0 changes what you can do but it sure didn't change it that early we just couldn't stop their scripted plays while they stopped ours even with great field position on one drive.

Maybe we should try and win a coin toss so we get the ball first one of these games?

 

[Rats]

That fumble was called back and on the rekick, JJ took the ball to midfield. The offense couldn't do anything with prime real estate and put a TD on the board. That's a problem. So you can forget about the fumble, because its as if it never happened and instead we had the ball at midfield.

Can't blame special teams at all on this game. Returns and coverage on kicks were really good.

Yes, but it was part of what set the tempo in the early minutes and then the O had a fumble on a bad snap that added to the "bad tempo" set early by the team. Look there professionals and should be able to get up for a big in division road game out of the gate. They didn't. Sorry

 

[ajcardfan]

Neat concept hell Conrad, they had them in a 3rd and 12 on both drives and couldn't cover Jackson. Big plays killed early on defense. Getting the Seahawks in a long yardage on 3rd down is what the coaches wanted, that is not a high percentage conversion, but they converted both times. Stop that 3rd and 12 both times and it is a different ball game. Coaches coach, players are paid to make plays. They didn't in the first 8 minutes, it put the team in the hole. The coaches always talk about matching the other teams intensity out of the gate. The D did not do that and It put the O in a catch up situation.

I agree that players need to make plays, BUT....

On both of those third downs we did not blitz and played zone. On one, we rushed four and the other rushed three. When you have a guy like Walter Jones that can handle Berry one-on-one, we are not going to get much of a rush straight up. At least call a stunt. I thought we had played vanilla against the Niners so we could unleash the dogs on Seattle?

Those two plays are still the ones that bother me the most from yesterday.

 

[D-Dogg]

Yes, but it was part of what set the tempo in the early minutes and then the O had a fumble on a bad snap that added to the "bad tempo" set early by the team. Look there professionals and should be able to get up for a big in division road game out of the gate. They didn't. Sorry

Bad tempo? What about fumbling but getting it called back and then ripping off a huge return to midfield means bad tempo? It means you got a second chance and did something great with it...which should create GOOD tempo.

Again, one of the bright spots was the kick coverage and return game.

 

[D-Dogg]

At that point we ran on first and second down which is precisely what Green said he wanted to do, run. Warner then fumbled on 3rd down, Step recovered and we punted. So we had great field position and did exactly what the game plan called for and still went 3 and out.

The game plan called for a 3rd down fumble?

 

[Russ Smith]

Bad tempo? What about fumbling but getting it called back and then ripping off a huge return to midfield means bad tempo. It means you got a second chance and did something great with it...which should create GOOD tempo.

Again, one of the bright spots was the kick coverage and return game.

We think alike to me that was a huge momentum swing from oh crap to wow short field.

Their scripted plays produced 14 points, ours produced one 3 and out and one missed FG from 51. That was why we fell behind.

 

[Russ Smith]

The game plan called for a 3rd down fumble?

Well the 2 runs didn't work and that created a bad tempo that led to the fumble.

 

[D-Dogg]

Well the 2 runs didn't work and that created a bad tempo that led to the fumble.

Just clowning. Heck, with the way we played in the late 4th quarter maybe the fumble WAS scripted.


(I have to find a way to smile after this loss, and us scripting a fumble does the trick.)

 

[Rats]

JJ's fumble didn't count though so it had no impact on the gameplan. IN fact we had the ball out around the 47 because of his subsequent return. At that point we ran on first and second down which is precisely what Green said he wanted to do, run. Warner then fumbled on 3rd down, Step recovered and we punted. So we had great field position and did exactly what the game plan called for and still went 3 and out.

Seattle then marches right downfield and hits a 49 yard td pass and the game is 14-0. We get the ball back with nearly 50 minutes left in the game and we really HAD to abandon the entire gameplan that early? We didn't we even ran 4 times in the next drive before the FG hit the upright.

at some point sure being down 14-0 changes what you can do but it sure didn't change it that early we just couldn't stop their scripted plays while they stopped ours even with great field position on one drive.

Maybe we should try and win a coin toss so we get the ball first one of these games?

I agree on the coin toss, after the Seahawks had a 14 point lead they ran a straight defense with 3 and 4 rushers. That is why we ran. Not that it was scripted that way. Had they had people in the box we would have looked to pass. We did want to give carries to Edge early but on that series we ran on 1st down and passed on 2nd down for a 1st down. Then we tried a screen pass that didn't work on 1st down and we run and get a penalty. BAD TEMPO from the get go....never matched Seattles intensity in the 1st qaurter and had to scrap the gameplan early. Had we came out and established the run right off the bat then we might have been able to gain some momentum. We didn't, the players didn't match the Hawks ....hardly the coaches the only ones to blame.

 

[Russ Smith]

Just clowning. Heck, with the way we played in the late 4th quarter maybe the fumble WAS scripted.


(I have to find a way to smile after this loss, and us scripting a fumble does the trick.)

Me too just messing with rats.

I think to Green's credit, under Mac any win was unexpected, so we're all waiting for the unexpected wins under Green. But these losses hurt more because we actually think we CAN win some games?

 

[Rats]

Bad tempo? What about fumbling but getting it called back and then ripping off a huge return to midfield means bad tempo? It means you got a second chance and did something great with it...which should create GOOD tempo.

Again, one of the bright spots was the kick coverage and return game.

As you said that play was nullified but had the effect of here we go again, and already down by 7 the offense never stepped up to match the Seattle tempo, hence we ended up down 14 points. No amount of scripted plays would have changed that we could not get out of 2nd gear.

 

[devilfan02]

Wait till the end of the season and evaluate. Jeff Fisher might be available, would love to have him over Green

 

[Rats]

I agree that players need to make plays, BUT....

On both of those third downs we did not blitz and played zone. On one, we rushed four and the other rushed three. When you have a guy like Walter Jones that can handle Berry one-on-one, we are not going to get much of a rush straight up. At least call a stunt. I thought we had played vanilla against the Niners so we could unleash the dogs on Seattle?

Those two plays are still the ones that bother me the most from yesterday.

I agree, we did not step up and those plays after getting them in long yardage situations should have been stopped but the guys got burned instead. They were the crux of our early struggles. They didn't make the plays.

 

[Rats]

Wait till the end of the season and evaluate. Jeff Fisher might be available, would love to have him over Green

I would rather win this season and make the playoffs, and then extend Green. Sounds like a better plan to me.

 

[conraddobler]

I would rather win this season and make the playoffs, and then extend Green. Sounds like a better plan to me.

If he makes the playoffs, he'll get it, if he dosen't then who knows.

 

[Rats]

If he makes the playoffs, he'll get it, if he dosen't then who knows.

If there is not significant strides and at least an 8-8, 9-7 season, then some will get there wish, and rightfully so. I just do not wish for it just so we can have another head coach. But thats just me.

 

[Big Red Line]

But these losses hurt more because we actually think we CAN win some games?

Man, Russ, you are very articulate re: the Cardinals. I agree with this assessment. Also, I'm old now and running out of "next years." Accordingly, I'm not as patient, though I think that much of the criticism leveled against Green is knee jerk and unfair.

 

[ARZCardinals]

redheat you are sick

the Seacocks just lost the freaking superbowl last year and the Cards were still in it till Adam's fumble....

take some time off and let this go

15-1 is ok.

 

[JeffGollin]

The Giants were behind 24 to 7 Sunday and were badly beaten up thru the start of the 4Q. But somehow they found a way to win against a very good division rival.

When we are able to do something like that, we will have arrived.

As of Game #2, we're not there yet.

 

[Duckjake]

This is the best thread of the 2006 football season. Heck its the best thread since the one that announced we'd signed Edge.

As for Green, 12-22 and 0-3 against the teams with the #1 pick in the NFL draft the following April speaks for itself.

 

[Duckjake]

Moves that need to be made, Big to left gaurd, Rolle to safety.

Ross and Wells at the tackles and Tate and Ware at the Corners?!?

 

[Russ Smith]

Man, Russ, you are very articulate re: the Cardinals. I agree with this assessment. Also, I'm old now and running out of "next years." Accordingly, I'm not as patient, though I think that much of the criticism leveled against Green is knee jerk and unfair.

I'm not getting younger myself. I don't have the energy to look it up but I'm really also wondering what is Green's record against teams that finish over
.500, seems to me I remember a win over Seattle and the Rams in year 1 and I think that's it?

IIRC that says in 2 years and 2 games we've one 1-2 games against teams that finished with a winning record, which is why it seems like it's been so long since we beat a good team.