For you Contract Wizards - Hopkins & Conner

[Crimson Warrior]

Conner is not that guy. Conner is a receiving and goal line back who will get injured if you're giving him 12+ touches a game for long. In some ways he's the RB version of Colt McCoy -- great if you can sprinkle him in, but the more you lean on him the less you're going to get back.

This was so painfully obvious last year when Conner immediately got dinged up and was less effective when he started a few games for Edmonds.

It was a terrible, terrible contract and plan for the RB room. Another scathing indictment of Steve freaking Keim.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Conner is not that guy. Conner is a receiving and goal line back who will get injured if you're giving him 12+ touches a game for long. In some ways he's the RB version of Colt McCoy -- great if you can sprinkle him in, but the more you lean on him the less you're going to get back.

It spoke volumes that we were starting David Blough and Trace McSorely and couldn't lean on Conner.

I don't know. He has averaged 4.9 Yards per carry the last 5 games with nobody QBs and a makeshift OL.

 

[kerouac9]

I don't know. He has averaged 4.9 Yards per carry the last 5 games with nobody QBs and a makeshift OL.

Yes, but he did so against a pretty sad group of rush defenses:

LAC (4.8 YPC) - 28th-ranked rush DVOA
NE (5.67 YPC) - 8th
DEN (3.94 YPC) - 22nd
TB (5.27 YPC) - 12th
ATL (4.94 YPC) - 25th

Then he got injured.

 

[Stout]

I suppose I am alone, for I like Conner, thought we needed him, and, excluding the injuries, thought he was a good 2 year player to have in your team.

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[Cheesebeef]

I don't know. He has averaged 4.9 Yards per carry the last 5 games with nobody QBs and a makeshift OL.

and got injured and is out again to end the season, missing his 4th game of the year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yes, but he did so against a pretty sad group of rush defenses:

LAC (4.8 YPC) - 28th-ranked rush DVOA
NE (5.67 YPC) - 8th
DEN (3.94 YPC) - 22nd
TB (5.27 YPC) - 12th
ATL (4.94 YPC) - 25th

Then he got injured.

I think that contract is a joke, but this is kind of a weak argument. most running backs prob boost their stats against bad defenses and he ran very well against the best two defenses he faced at 8th and 12th.

 

[BritCard]

I'd be surprised if there were 15 names within your filter (1100+ Scrimmage yards, 10+ TDs, FA year). Even if there were 50, and all of them got $25 million, the point remains that just because other teams are making stupid spending decisions doesn't mean that we need to or should.

If someone wanted to pay James Conner a big contract, you thank them very much and collect the comp pick the next year.

If everyone is making the same decisions it's not stupid, it's normal. And it's your definition of stupid that's wrong.

I mean, seriously? Not a single NFL GM is doing what you suggest but you're right and all of them are stupid? Jeez.

Let's have a look at some recent examples.

Kenyan Drake in '21 coming off 1092 scrimmage yards and 10 TD's got 5.5m a year vs a $182.5m cap so 3%.

Melvin Gordon '20 coming off 908 yards and 9 TD's (over 12 games) got $8m a year vs a $198.2m cap so 4%.

Tevin Coleman in '19 coming off 1076 yards and 9 TD's got $5m a year vs a $188.2m cap or 2.65% of the cap but had shared a backfield his whole career and was signed to do the same.

Dion Lewis in 2018 coming off a 1110 yard 9 TD season got a 4 year $19.8m deal of which he played 2 years and earned $10.3m. The 2018 cap was $177.2m so $5m was 2.82%. And Lewis was really just a 3rd down back.

Lamar Miller in 2016 coming off 1269 yards and 10 TD's signed for $6.5m per year vs a $155.3 cap or 4.2%.

I could go on and on and I will never find a RB getting paid what you suggest following a season like any of these guys.

For the record Conner is getting 3.36% of the cap this year which is bang in line with history and for that he will give us 1150 yards from scrimmage, which I think is fair. At a higher YPA than last year despite playing behind about 10 different IOL.

 

[BritCard]

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Really?

Conner played 15 games last year and will play 14 this year. Show me a running back that doesn't miss a couple of games a year on average?

 

[Stout]

Really?

Conner played 15 games last year and will play 14 this year. Show me a running back that doesn't miss a couple of games a year on average?

And when was he hurt last season? Right when we needed him the most, right? That is his curse, and our burden, which we took on with the bad contract.

So glad you aren't going to be our GM. Let's hope our next one doesn't share your philosophies.

 

[DVontel]

I really wish another team paid James Connor that contract, but I won’t harp on him about missing games cause of injuries. I don’t expect any RB to play 17+ straight games without getting majorly dinged up. I honestly think that’s unfair to hold that against them.

 

[Stout]

I really wish another team paid James Connor that contract, but I won’t harp on him about missing games cause of injuries. I don’t expect any RB to play 17+ straight games without getting majorly dinged up. I honestly think that’s unfair to hold that against them.

Against RBs normally, I would concur. Problem was, this was a specific problem and history with this specific player.

 

[kerouac9]

If everyone is making the same decisions it's not stupid, it's normal. And it's your definition of stupid that's wrong.

I mean, seriously? Not a single NFL GM is doing what you suggest but you're right and all of them are stupid? Jeez.

Let's have a look at some recent examples.

Kenyan Drake in '21 coming off 1092 scrimmage yards and 10 TD's got 5.5m a year vs a $182.5m cap so 3%.

Melvin Gordon '20 coming off 908 yards and 9 TD's (over 12 games) got $8m a year vs a $198.2m cap so 4%.

Tevin Coleman in '19 coming off 1076 yards and 9 TD's got $5m a year vs a $188.2m cap or 2.65% of the cap but had shared a backfield his whole career and was signed to do the same.

Dion Lewis in 2018 coming off a 1110 yard 9 TD season got a 4 year $19.8m deal of which he played 2 years and earned $10.3m. The 2018 cap was $177.2m so $5m was 2.82%. And Lewis was really just a 3rd down back.

Lamar Miller in 2016 coming off 1269 yards and 10 TD's signed for $6.5m per year vs a $155.3 cap or 4.2%.

I could go on and on and I will never find a RB getting paid what you suggest following a season like any of these guys.

For the record Conner is getting 3.36% of the cap this year which is bang in line with history and for that he will give us 1150 yards from scrimmage, which I think is fair. At a higher YPA than last year despite playing behind about 10 different IOL.

Dude, if your argument is "look at all these bad contracts that these guys got that their teams almost immediately regretted", maybe reconsider your foundations.

No one looks at the percentage of the cap. If someone wanted to pay Conner a dumb contract, then you let them do so. LOL Dion Lewis. C'mon bro.

 

[BritCard]

And when was he hurt last season? Right when we needed him the most, right? That is his curse, and our burden, which we took on with the bad contract.

So glad you aren't going to be our GM. Let's hope our next one doesn't share your philosophies.

lol, what a crock.

He missed games 15 and 16, one of which we won. The other of which we should have won against Indy. He played in week 17 and the playoffs.

There is some weird anti Conner BS on this board.

 

[BritCard]

Dude, if your argument is "look at all these bad contracts that these guys got that their teams almost immediately regretted", maybe reconsider your foundations.

No one looks at the percentage of the cap. If someone wanted to pay Conner a dumb contract, then you let them do so. LOL Dion Lewis. C'mon bro.

This is some weak sauce.

You come up with some fantasy number that equates to 1.4% of cap (I'm using % because obvious the cap changes annually) and when challenged on it your come back is "Well all those GM's a dumb and I'm right".

So this argument has gone from "Keim sucks. He gave Conner a bad deal" to "All GM's suck for overpaying on second contracts".

The actual facts are,

Conners contract is exactly in line with 2nd deals for none premium ball carriers pretty much throughout the history of the league and in the salary table for this season everyone obviously better is paid more and everyone obviously worse who isn't a rookie is paid less outside of Ekeler.

Thus proving he's exactly where he should be both currently and compared to history. And your just wrong.

 

[Stout]

I think we can let the JC contract go; the factions aren't going to agree

 

[kerouac9]

I think we can let the JC contract go; the factions aren't going to agree

I think if we just have a few more votes.