Free Agency 2018

[JCSunsfan]

I don't think you understand the value and need of a PG for this team. He is in essence the QB for this team, Ayton is a big, who needs to be fed, teamed up with a bunch of catch and shoot guys, a bunch of youngsters at that. Suns didn't need Ariza they have 5000 forwards. This team has 2 PGs one who is garbage coming off missing the season and a 2nd Rd pick, that is a recipe for disaster.


Why Ariza over Vanvleet? I thought this was a signing with another move lined up. Ariza, Jackson, Bridges, Warren, Dudley, Chriss, Bender, King there all Forwards hahahahha now you have Ayton Chandler and Knight and Odoko and this team is created by a crazy person. The last thing this team needed was Ariza to eat the cap space

Because we would have had to overpay big time to get VanVleet.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

What is so difficult here?? Van Fleet would be nearly as much per year AND would be over multiple years, otherwise Toronto would have matched. That's pretty much common sense.

And AGAIN (and again, and again), the Suns said after the draft that they had 2 needs, PG and stretch 4. Whether you think he is a stretch 4 or not, it's clear the Suns think he can man that spot, and he will be better at that position, even at his size, over all the other possibilities. Ariza was never mentioned by the Suns before because nobody thought he'd only take a one-year deal.

But now we gotta depend on this guy, Knight is garbage

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[DevonCardsFan]

Because we would have had to overpay big time to get VanVleet.

That doesn't change the fact this team still doesnt have a PG

 

[Chaplin]

Bit now we gotta depend on this guy, Knight is garbage

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The offseason just started dude. You know we're like 4 months from opening day, right?

But kudos for the deflection.

 

[Chaplin]

That doesn't change the fact this team still doesnt have a PG

And? Contrary to your belief, signing Ariza doesn't prevent us from getting a PG worth a damn.

 

[Phrazbit]

The same here. Payton was better than any PG the Suns have now. Okobo may be good someday but we really don't know yet.

Hmm... maybe purely based on traditional stats, points, assists, rebounds, but based on impact, he was not only the worst point guard on the roster last year, but among the worst players in the NBA.

We preformed worse on offense across the board, and on defense he surrendered a PER of 25 to opposing point guards, basically making any guard he played against put up MVP level stats. With Payton off the court we were outscored by 7 points per 100 possessions (yeah, we were bad) with him ON the court that figured exploded to 20 points.

He is a terrible shooter, a complete disaster as a defender and the best thing that could be said about his passing was that he didn't turn the ball over much.

And, what Poop Head said is 100% correct. We could not have signed him for 2.5 mil, we would have had to keep him via the QO. Last seasons trade of a 2nd round pick and this contract from the Pelicans are strong indications that the entire league views Payton as a really bad player.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I just don't want to get too much in a hurry here. McD's problem with pg's in the past was we just had too many marginal players. I don't want to do that again. I would prefer to get a look at what we have in Okobo and Knight (and Harrison too for that matter), and then go get another player if we need to. We just do not really know what we actually have yet. Okobo looks like he has real potential and fairly quickly. But who know for sure.

What we really needed was high-quality vets THAT ACTUALLY GET PLAYING TIME. Dudley and Chandler are bench players now--way end of the bench. The wings we have can play the 2-4 positions so there will be lots of opportunity for minutes.

We have three point guards right now. Knight, Okobo, and Harrison. If we get another one, he has to displace one of those players. I am not sure I would want to dump Okobo for VanVleet, and I think Harrison has shown some real defensive promise and athleticism.

Its a process.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Bit now we gotta depend on this guy, Knight is garbage

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I hate this. You could do lowlights on every player in the league. We just had the greatest draft in Suns history and all people want to do is moan and groan.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

And? Contrary to your belief, signing Ariza doesn't prevent us from getting a PG worth a damn.

First off there was no deflection,

Second off the Ariza signing does greatly limit the ability to add a PG, kills the cap room to facilitate the trade for one or to sign one. Ariza isn't really a stretch 4 he is a wing playing the stretch 4 in today NBA. This team should have focused on landing a PG it's a glaring missing piece as opposed to having 8 Forwards on the team

 

[DevonCardsFan]

I hate this. You could do lowlights on every player in the league. We just had the greatest draft in Suns history and all people want to do is moan and groan.

It was tongue in Cheek.

But what isn't is Knight sucks, not only does he just suck, he actually makes the players around him worse he is that bad. He is a blackhole with the Ball, who only thinks of scoring, and to have Ayton who needs a PG to feed him the ball leaving him with a PG who isn't going to get the best out of him, is a crime. Sac had to move Tyreke and Thomas because score first PGs were hurting Cousins game, now the Suns are about to do the same thing to Ayton, to land Ariza for 1 season at 15 mil. You take care of Ayton and get him a facilitator, to help immediately start developing himz that should have been job # 1 not adding the 16th forward to the team. Now if you understood basketball from a Big Man's perspective your PG can make or break you. Knight is going to hinder Ayton, and your being very shortsited to not see that coming.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

It was tongue in Cheek.

But what isn't is Knight sucks, not only does he just suck, he actually makes the players around him worse he is that bad. He is a blackhole with the Ball, who only thinks of scoring, and to have Ayton who needs a PG to feed him the ball leaving him with a PG who isn't going to get the best out of him, is a crime. Sac had to move Tyreke and Thomas because score first PGs were hurting Cousins game, now the Suns are about to do the same thing to Ayton, to land Ariza for 1 season at 15 mil. You take care of Ayton and get him a facilitator, to help immediately start developing himz that should have been job # 1 not adding the 16th forward to the team. Now if you understood basketball from a Big Man's perspective your PG can make or break you. Knight is going to hinder Ayton, and your being very shortsited to not see that coming.

You've been peddling this for a while now and I just don't buy what you're selling. Knight is certainly not a good NBA player, but he absolutely is not terrible. Without a doubt he is no worse than an average player that is unfortunately getting paid like a good one.

 

[Chaplin]

And now, as fodder for the next 20 pages...

Devin Booker and Marqueese Chriss just started following Damian Lillard on Twitter. Discuss.

 

[Finito]

It was tongue in Cheek.

But what isn't is Knight sucks, not only does he just suck, he actually makes the players around him worse he is that bad. He is a blackhole with the Ball, who only thinks of scoring, and to have Ayton who needs a PG to feed him the ball leaving him with a PG who isn't going to get the best out of him, is a crime. Sac had to move Tyreke and Thomas because score first PGs were hurting Cousins game, now the Suns are about to do the same thing to Ayton, to land Ariza for 1 season at 15 mil. You take care of Ayton and get him a facilitator, to help immediately start developing himz that should have been job # 1 not adding the 16th forward to the team. Now if you understood basketball from a Big Man's perspective your PG can make or break you. Knight is going to hinder Ayton, and your being very shortsited to not see that coming.

This isn't 1985 basketball isn't really played by the numbers anymore. Who's Anthony Davis PG? what about KAT? neither of those guys play with all star caliber who are pass first guys. Nobody was hurting Cousins game he was dominate from day 1.

 

[Finito]

And now, as fodder for the next 20 pages...

Devin Booker and Marqueese Chriss just started following Damian Lillard on Twitter. Discuss.

Whaaaaaaaat!!!!!!

 

[Phrazbit]

It was tongue in Cheek.

But what isn't is Knight sucks, not only does he just suck, he actually makes the players around him worse he is that bad. He is a blackhole with the Ball, who only thinks of scoring, and to have Ayton who needs a PG to feed him the ball leaving him with a PG who isn't going to get the best out of him, is a crime. Sac had to move Tyreke and Thomas because score first PGs were hurting Cousins game, now the Suns are about to do the same thing to Ayton, to land Ariza for 1 season at 15 mil. You take care of Ayton and get him a facilitator, to help immediately start developing himz that should have been job # 1 not adding the 16th forward to the team. Now if you understood basketball from a Big Man's perspective your PG can make or break you. Knight is going to hinder Ayton, and your being very shortsited to not see that coming.

You're complaining about losing Payton when he made the team dramatically worse on both ends.

And the no one was holding back Cousins on the Kings. They got worse after losing those players and the Pelicans got worse after Cousins got hurt. Cousins is an empty stats selfish, stupid, headcase.

 

[AzStevenCal]

And now, as fodder for the next 20 pages...

Devin Booker and Marqueese Chriss just started following Damian Lillard on Twitter. Discuss.

So, clearly a multi team deal where the highlights involve Deng and Chriss to Denver, Booker to LA and the Suns get Ball?

 

[DevonCardsFan]

You've been peddling this for a while now and I just don't buy what you're selling. Knight is certainly not a good NBA player, but he absolutely is not terrible. Without a doubt he is no worse than an average player that is unfortunately getting paid like a good one.

Well maybe if you read this stuff, you would see normal avg players don't have sites disecting just how awful they are:

https://94feetreport.com/the-demise-of-brandon-knight-8d8878b2379a


https://www.slcdunk.com/2017/6/15/1...lwaukee-bucks-phoenix-suns-utah-jazz-kentucky

https://www.fanragsports.com/nba/brandon-knight-experiment-may-failure/


Avg players don't have books written about how much they suck, over and over

 

[AzStevenCal]

You're complaining about losing Peyton when he made the team dramatically worse on both ends.

And the no one was holding back Cousins on the Kings. They got worse after losing those players and the Pelicans got worse after Cousins got hurt. Cousins is an empty stats selfish, stupid, headcase.

I know I read that he'd been inconsistent in Orlando but that's not exactly what I thought happened here. It seemed to me he played well for a short while and then played poorly from then on. Consistently poorly.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

And now, as fodder for the next 20 pages...

Devin Booker and Marqueese Chriss just started following Damian Lillard on Twitter. Discuss.

Get some trade checker trades out there

 

[Hoop Head]

This isn't 1985 basketball isn't really played by the numbers anymore. Who's Anthony Davis PG? what about KAT? neither of those guys play with all star caliber who are pass first guys. Nobody was hurting Cousins game he was dominate from day 1.

I get your point but you picked 2 bad examples. Davis had Rondo and Jrue Holiday feeding him. Holiday is an All-Star level player and Rondo is a pass first PG who is quite good. KAT has Jeff Teague, Tyus Jones, and Derrick Rose. Teague is an All-Star PG, Rose is a former MVP (albeit broken, he's the backup now), and Jones is a highly regarded backup on a rookie contract that many have mentioned as a potential target for the Suns.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Well maybe if you read this stuff, you would see normal avg players don't have sites disecting just how awful they are:

https://94feetreport.com/the-demise-of-brandon-knight-8d8878b2379a


https://www.slcdunk.com/2017/6/15/1...lwaukee-bucks-phoenix-suns-utah-jazz-kentucky

https://www.fanragsports.com/nba/brandon-knight-experiment-may-failure/


Avg players don't have books written about how much they suck, over and over

If Brandon Knight was available on the open market, no way do we sign him knowing now what we've learned the hard way. But we're stuck with him for awhile so it makes sense to see if he's salvageable. It's a long-shot but he's a sunk cost and if he hasn't turned over a new leaf, we'll know soon enough. But I still think we have a trade on the horizon and that will likely be for a point guard.

 

[Phrazbit]

I know I read that he'd been inconsistent in Orlando but that's not exactly what I thought happened here. It seemed to me he played well for a short while and then played poorly from then on. Consistently poorly.

The margin by which he was worse than everyone else was alarming. I didn't realize quite how terrible his impact was until you and I were kicking around contract figures a few weeks ago. I'm sure teams have access to waaay more info than we do. We knew he was a bad shooter and a pretty clueless defender, but I didn't realize how bad his deficiencies in those areas effected the entire team.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

And now, as fodder for the next 20 pages...

Devin Booker and Marqueese Chriss just started following Damian Lillard on Twitter. Discuss.

Just for fun grabbed some random players, JJ, Warren and Chandler work for Lilliard

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm well aware that it tends to be a negative connotation that means that said player is a ballhog (which I specifically stated I don't believe he is), but that ultimately doesn't mean that he doesn't need the ball in his hands.

I can't think of a situation in the entire league where Ball could be effective off the ball. Unless he vastly improves as a spot-up shooter and slasher he is useless without the ball in his hands.

It doesn’t mean he’s a ball hog. It means to be most effective he has to have the ball in his hands the majority of the offense. You don’t know what it means so I’m calling this argument moot.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Well maybe if you read this stuff, you would see normal avg players don't have sites disecting just how awful they are:

https://94feetreport.com/the-demise-of-brandon-knight-8d8878b2379a


https://www.slcdunk.com/2017/6/15/1...lwaukee-bucks-phoenix-suns-utah-jazz-kentucky

https://www.fanragsports.com/nba/brandon-knight-experiment-may-failure/


Avg players don't have books written about how much they suck, over and over

I did not have high hopes for BK but now I really hope he does well just to shut up the continual yappers.