Gambo Said this today about Doncic .........

[Cheesebeef]

But if you did throw them all into the same category, you would be right most of the time.

There are issues with Doncic, none of them are that he is a Euro. 1. His athleticism is average, 2. his shooting percentages from three are below average and getting worse, 3. IMO his best position is SG so he is a questionable fit with the Suns.

He might end up being a good player, but in a draft with potential superstars those are real drawbacks for a 6-7 player.

Yup. All of which have been my concerns.

But it’s much easier to paint our arguments with a broad brush rather than acknowledge the above.

 

[Raindog]

I'm not a Doncic believer either... but if the Suns end up picking 3 or lower and he's still on the board, I won't have a problem taking him. At the very least, it will add some significant intrigue to next season to see if he actually is the real deal or another overrated Euro flop.

And in spite of not being a believer at this point, I would be excited if he proved me wrong and really turned out to be something great. Really my only grumble would be if we passed on Bagley and/or Ayton (especially) for him and they turn out to be generational players, while Doncic is just another footnote ten years from now - a flash in the pan Euro whose game didn't translate to the NBA.

 

[Mr. Boldin]

I dont have my scouting report written up, but if Bud becomes coach, I expect Ayton to top his draft list and Doncic to be 1B, or 2.

He would be a great fit for what Bud wants to do offensively. He slots in next to booker quite well, as the two of them are capable of initiating, with Doncic being the ace PNR threat, as he is as good as any player I have seen in years (coming into the draft) at running high ball screen action. His vision is elite, he has great passing skills, he has the size to create passing angles and lanes.

He will need to continue to work on his jumper, but he projects quite well playing off the ball. He should be able to play the 3 and 4, and would be a welcome fit next to Josh Jackson. He will struggle to create against more athletic players, especially 1v1 with the defense keyed on him. That is why developing early alongside someone like Booker is really important.

Defensively, he has a solid IQ, understands how to move, where and when to help, and will give effort there. That said, he isnt overly athletic or quick, but a bit better than average. He needs to keep working on his body and conditioning, and definitely will need time off this summer (he played Eurobasket last summer sandwiched between two really long seasons).

I would love to see what Bud does with Doncic's development, and how he utilizes him in his system.

 

[BC867]

I'm not a Doncic believer either... but if the Suns end up picking 3 or lower and he's still on the board, I won't have a problem taking him. At the very least, it will add some significant intrigue to next season to see if he actually is the real deal or another overrated Euro flop...

The Suns have lulled (some of) its fans into passivity. Let's invest our top pick to see if he is actually the real deal? There is nothing proactive about that approach.

How about...let's see our General Manager use his expertise based on his research and experience to choose the best candidate(s) to fill our needs. And if he hasn't developed that expertise, replace him with one who has.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Interesting how perspectives are vastly different on different boards. The other Suns board I read regularly has a poll up asking who fans would take if they had the #1 pick.

Doncic is up on Ayton by nearly a 2:1 margin.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

For those who wish to follow along, Real Madrid is currently playing Game 2 of a 5-game playoff series.

http://www.euroleague.net/main/results/showgame?gamecode=246&seasoncode=E2017#!boxscore

Doncic has only put up one shot, but his team is up by 7 with one quarter to go.

 

[sunsfan88]

For those who wish to follow along, Real Madrid is currently playing Game 2 of a 5-game playoff series.

http://www.euroleague.net/main/results/showgame?gamecode=246&seasoncode=E2017#!boxscore

Doncic has only put up one shot, but his team is up by 7 with one quarter to go.

He’s playing awful for the 2nd game in a row. So many mistakes defensively too.

I think he’ll drop in the draft if nba teams put emphasized value on playoff games.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

He’s playing awful for the 2nd game in a row. So many mistakes defensively too.

I think he’ll drop in the draft if nba teams put emphasized value on playoff games.

He hasn't had much of an impact this game, but following the box score it shows he had key assists down the stretch and he may have just put the game away with a steal (from Mike James) and two free throws with a minute to go.

How do you know about defensive mistakes? Are you watching a feed?

 

[Cheesebeef]

He shot... once? In a playoff game?

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

PIR is supposed to be the important stat in Euroleague.

For what it's worth, Luka ended up with the second best PIR on the winning team. Definitely not a standout game, but it doesn't seem like he played awful, at least judging by statistics.

Of course, statistics can be misleading and 8 points is underwhelming. Surely headed in the right direction though after the game 1 disaster. And they won.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

He shot... once? In a playoff game?

Three times. Also had the biggest 5 free throws down the stretch.

Maybe he was trying to prove he is worthy of the #1 pick by doing his best KAT impression.

 

[Cheesebeef]

PIR is supposed to be the important stat in Euroleague.

For what it's worth, Luka ended up with the second best PIR on the winning team. Definitely not a standout game, but it doesn't seem like he played awful, at least judging by statistics.

Of course, statistics can be misleading and 8 points is underwhelming. Surely headed in the right direction though after the game 1 disaster. And they won.

Wait... in game 1 he was WORSE than 0/1, 8 pts, 5 reb and 4 asstd?

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

He shot... once? In a playoff game?

It's also a different style of game entirely.

To put things in perspective, Real Madrid attempted 58 shots today.

Yesterday, the Rockets shot 96 times.

 

[sunsfan88]

He hasn't had much of an impact this game, but following the box score it shows he had key assists down the stretch and he may have just put the game away with a steal (from Mike James) and two free throws with a minute to go.

How do you know about defensive mistakes? Are you watching a feed?

I was, yes. He gave up two wide open 3s then had a chance at a steal but terribly mistimed his gamble.

I was a Doncic guy but I’m leaning back towards Ayton now after seeing how Doncic performs in high pressure situations like Euro playoff games.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Wait... in game 1 he was WORSE than 0/1, 8 pts, 5 reb and 4 asstd?

The whole team got destroyed in Game 1. It was never really even a game. Hard to take too much away from looking at statistics, but I try to glean as much info as I can.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I was, yes. He gave up two wide open 3s then had a chance at a steal but terribly mistimed his gamble.

I was a Doncic guy but I’m leaning back towards Ayton now after seeing how Doncic performs in high pressure situations like Euro playoff games.

Thanks for the insight. It will be interesting to see how the rest of the playoffs play out.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Three times. Also had the biggest 5 free throws down the stretch.

Maybe he was trying to prove he is worthy of the #1 pick by doing his best KAT impression.

Lol... what Tibs is doing to that kid in Minnesota is a major head scratcher.

 

[Mainstreet]

But if you did throw them all into the same category, you would be right most of the time.

There are issues with Doncic, none of them are that he is a Euro. 1. His athleticism is average, 2. his shooting percentages from three are below average and getting worse, 3. IMO his best position is SG so he is a questionable fit with the Suns.

He might end up being a good player, but in a draft with potential superstars those are real drawbacks for a 6-7 player.

I'd like for the Suns to draft Ayton but to throw all the European players into the same category and say Doncic is going to fail because others have failed is the wrong approach.

Personally, I do not want the Suns to draft Doncic but I am not going to grade him on the past failures of other European players.

My measure is he is the best PG available in the draft... if the Suns intend to draft a PG with their first pick.

If not, then let's move onto another player like Young.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'd like for the Suns to draft Ayton but to throw all the European players into the same category and say Doncic is going to fail because others have failed is the wrong approach.

Well, NO ONE is saying that is going to fail because he's a Euro. For the UMPTEENTH TIME, the concerns about Doncic are lack of athleticism, 3 point range, and being a tweener for a team that already has two very good swingmen.

Y'all continue to create false narratives to combat that don't exist no matter how many times the people you're arguing with clearly state their reasons for questioning Doncic.

 

[Mainstreet]

Well, NO ONE is saying that is going to fail because he's a Euro. For the UMPTEENTH TIME, the concerns about Doncic are lack of athleticism, 3 point range, and being a tweener for a team that already has two very good swingmen.

Y'all continue to create false narratives to combat that don't exist no matter how many times the people you're arguing with clearly state their reasons for questioning Doncic.

I was answering JC's take on Europeans.

As I said earlier, I would not draft Doncic as a PG and that would be the only reason I would consider him.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I was answering JC's take on Europeans.

As I said earlier, I would not draft Doncic as a PG and that would be the only reason I would consider him.

That was a bit tongue in cheek. The second paragraph was the substance.

 

[Mainstreet]

That was a bit tongue in cheek. The second paragraph was the substance.

I think we are in agreement. The Suns shouldn't draft Doncic if they are looking for the best PG in the draft.

 

[Mr. Boldin]

Well, NO ONE is saying that is going to fail because he's a Euro. For the UMPTEENTH TIME, the concerns about Doncic are lack of athleticism, 3 point range, and being a tweener for a team that already has two very good swingmen.

Y'all continue to create false narratives to combat that don't exist no matter how many times the people you're arguing with clearly state their reasons for questioning Doncic.

I dont think he will have any issue with range on his jumper. While I guess you can call him a tweener due to his athleticism (which is just solid/good/ok), the more swingmen you have on your roster the better. This is especially true in Bud's system.

I point to the Warriors, 76ers, Celtics. You need a plethora of interchangeable parts, guys who can shoot and pass, play and defend multiple positions. Thats where the league is right now. Doncic fits based on his skill level and size.

All that said, I would take Ayton and feel amazing about it. Hes been #1 on my board since November.

 

[pokerface]

I'm not thinking this board ascribes to positionless or BPA much...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm not thinking this board ascribes to positionless or BPA much...

I think you’re right. And as a result we are behind the trend. That said I personally struggle with letting go of the pg-sg-sf-pf-c paradigm myself so I can’t cast blame.