Game of Thrones (HBO)

[crisper57]

In the books, after you've picked up the book that you've tossed across the room, you can read on and see the fallout from the Red Wedding.

On TV, we get an hour of viewing and then have to wait 9 months to see how the rest of the book unfolds! Ugh! I have a feeling that the wait between seasons 3 and 4 will feel much longer than the wait from Season 1 to Season 2. And that felt like a freaking eternity too!

 

[D-Dogg]

I Even so, I reacted the way many of the people in the videos did. Stunned, I had to put the book down for a good 2 or 3 days. I didnt hate George RR Martin, if anything that turn clinched this as my fav book series I've ever read, I just needed a few days to gather myself. Poor Starks.

I turned off my Kindle, breathed out and thought, "I really can't read any of this right now." Totally shell-shocked. BTW, great point about Greywind.

Totally agree! It ain't all rainbows and sunshine in the land of Westeros. I love the fact that no one is safe in Martin's books. Makes me hold my breath with every turn of the page.

He is a dastardly old curmudgeon, that's for sure. But man, he builds wonderful tension. Coming from TV writing, his books have the episodic, cliffhanger feel..so good.

In the books, after you've picked up the book that you've tossed across the room, you can read on and see the fallout from the Red Wedding.

True! That book is so great, start to finish. One of the best books I've ever read. But readers get their own wait, while the Glacier writes the next 200000 words.

 

[BACH]

Even so, I reacted the way many of the people in the videos did. Stunned, I had to put the book down for a good 2 or 3 days. I didnt hate George RR Martin, if anything that turn clinched this as my fav book series I've ever read, I just needed a few days to gather myself. Poor Starks.

4 days here.

 

[Covert Rain]

I agree with many of the takes. Everyone I know that had no clue this was coming were completely stunned. As I stated, I must have said WTF at least 5 times. LOL.

There has only been one other show for me that has truly given me WTF moments and that was LOST. There are some of my other shows that provide twists but not shocking ones.

Game of Thrones has had 2 for me so far. Ned Stark's beheading was shocking. I had not read the book so I was shocked a main character was killed and a popular one at that. Nothing that had really happened after that came as a shock because that sort of set the stage.......until now.

Again, I should not have been shocked after Ned's beheading but I completely was. I think in part because it was one of the most brutal scenes if not the most brutal scene I have ever seen on TV towards characters I loved. The other part I think Cheese said it best. I am more vested in the Stark family versus any of the other families. I want some damn revenge. LOL.

P.S. If you have read the books, please don't spoil it. By the way if there are more shocking events coming....not sure the people in that video can handle it. LOL.

 

[TJ]

Just caught up to Episode 9 last night. Motored through the entire series in about 2 1/2 weeks (down time is great).

Red Wedding scene was intense.

Spoiler

never seen so many main characters wiped out in one scene of any series that wasn't the season finale. Like many, I liked the Starks and was saddened to see them taken out of the series. Then again, there are so many other plots going on that it should still be epic moving forward

 

[Cheesebeef]

Totally agree! It ain't all rainbows and sunshine in the land of Westeros. I love the fact that no one is safe in Martin's books. Makes me hold my breath with every turn of the page.

the funny thing about this show is that the only people who really end up safe are the absolute scum of the earth!

 

[crisper57]

the funny thing about this show is that the only people who really end up safe are the absolute scum of the earth!

The scum tend to lock themselves up in towers and limit their exposure. When they actually do venture out, bad things happen (see: Theon). The good guys, on the other hand, tend to put themselves in harm's way a lot more. In fact, they may alienate loyal followers by being so "hands on".

So maybe the moral of the Game of Thrones saga is to keep your butt at home, safely inside your castle, and let the lower-born houses do your dirty work. It doesn't guarantee that you will survive, but you'll probably live longer than the lords that don't follow that advice.

EDIT: As I read what I typed, I realized that Dany is the exception to my rule. She is the only player going on the offensive that continues to build her base of power. What's up with that?

 

[MadCardDisease]

The scum tend to lock themselves up in towers and limit their exposure. When they actually do venture out, bad things happen (see: Theon). The good guys, on the other hand, tend to put themselves in harm's way a lot more. In fact, they may alienate loyal followers by being so "hands on".

So maybe the moral of the Game of Thrones saga is to keep your butt at home, safely inside your castle, and let the lower-born houses do your dirty work. It doesn't guarantee that you will survive, but you'll probably live longer than the lords that don't follow that advice.

EDIT: As I read what I typed, I realized that Dany is the exception to my rule. She is the only player going on the offensive that continues to build her base of power. What's up with that?

I think your rule has so many holes it's like Swiss Cheese.

 

[MadCardDisease]

So maybe the moral of the Game of Thrones saga is to keep your butt at home, safely inside your castle, and let the lower-born houses do your dirty work. It doesn't guarantee that you will survive, but you'll probably live longer than the lords that don't follow that advice.

The moral of the saga is be good at the Game of Thrones or risk your life.

The Starks are terrible at the Game of Thrones. Ned Stark was too honest to win at the Game of Thrones. Rob Stark wasn't very good at it either. His mistake was using the wrong head when it came to his wife which ultimately cost him his life.

The Greyjoy's also suck at playing the Game of Thrones. Theon's dad started the story as a loser from back in the day, hence why Theon was sent to the Starks as a young boy. Then Theon himself with deluisions of grandure ended up failing at the game of thrones as well when he tried to take Wintefell by himself.

The Lannisters and Tyrells are very good a playing the Game of Thrones. They understand how the game is played. At least the heads of the families do. Margery was slated to marry Lord Renly until he was killed. Then the Tyrells quickly made a deal to marry Margery with Joffery to give thier Family an improved position in the Game of Thrones. Obviously the Lannisters were able to win over the Freys which helped them to eliminate Rob Stark and improve their position. Not to mention that Cersei was originally married to King Robert making the Lannisters very powerful. Then throw in Tyrion being forced to marrying Sansa to give the Lannisters a claim to Winterfell.

It's all about how good you are at playing the Game of Thrones.

 

[jf-08]

Nice, Mike.

I agree 100%.

 

[BACH]

The moral of the saga is be good at the Game of Thrones or risk your life.

The Starks are terrible at the Game of Thrones. Ned Stark was too honest to win at the Game of Thrones. Rob Stark wasn't very good at it either. His mistake was using the wrong head when it came to his wife which ultimately cost him his life.

The Greyjoy's also suck at playing the Game of Thrones. Theon's dad started the story as a loser from back in the day, hence why Theon was sent to the Starks as a young boy. Then Theon himself with deluisions of grandure ended up failing at the game of thrones as well when he tried to take Wintefell by himself.

The Lannisters and Tyrells are very good a playing the Game of Thrones. They understand how the game is played. At least the heads of the families do. Margery was slated to marry Lord Renly until he was killed. Then the Tyrells quickly made a deal to marry Margery with Joffery to give thier Family an improved position in the Game of Thrones. Obviously the Lannisters were able to win over the Freys which helped them to eliminate Rob Stark and improve their position. Not to mention that Cersei was originally married to King Robert making the Lannisters very powerful. Then throw in Tyrion being forced to marrying Sansa to give the Lannisters a claim to Winterfell.

It's all about how good you are at playing the Game of Thrones.

Great post!

I don't agree your rule 100%, however. The game is the game of thrones, and each house comes with their own rules, morals and standards to play that game. Each house's play both has good and bad hands.

(I would like to elaborate more, but it would be too much of a spoiler to give examples)

 

[Stout]

MCD, that's a great summation, and almost totally spot on. The central theme of the saga, however, is that honor is an empty concept. When the saga begins, it is a central theme--even characters with none of it claimed honor. Characters with honor found it to be a hollow shield.

Spoiler

This was represented perfectly in the Red Wedding, more so in the book than in the show. In the book, Caetlyn insisted Robb get Walder Frey to offer salt and bread, because honor dictates that no one dare betray someone they offered food and shelter to. This is a ritual with enormous historical honor, and it meant less than nothing in the end.

In fact, the character in the whole series with the most honor is actually the Hound, in a way. He knows what kind of a monster he is and refuses knighthood because of the hypocrisy. He knows that honor is nothing, that he has none of it, and in being honest about what he is, shows more honor than most.

 

[D-Dogg]

MCD, that's a great summation, and almost totally spot on. The central theme of the saga, however, is that honor is an empty concept. When the saga begins, it is a central theme--even characters with none of it claimed honor. Characters with honor found it to be a hollow shield.

Spoiler

This was represented perfectly in the Red Wedding, more so in the book than in the show. In the book, Caetlyn insisted Robb get Walder Frey to offer salt and bread, because honor dictates that no one dare betray someone they offered food and shelter to. This is a ritual with enormous historical honor, and it meant less than nothing in the end.

In fact, the character in the whole series with the most honor is actually the Hound, in a way. He knows what kind of a monster he is and refuses knighthood because of the hypocrisy. He knows that honor is nothing, that he has none of it, and in being honest about what he is, shows more honor than most.

Nicely done. However, in your spoiler I was disappointed you said "less than nothing" instead of "little and less"

 

[crisper57]

I think your rule has so many holes it's like Swiss Cheese.

I know why you think that, but let me offer my rebuttal for the sake of a fun argument. Rule Number One for playing the Game of Thrones: Stay Home!

-POSSIBLE SPOILERS FOR TV FANS NOT CAUGHT UP-

Spoiler

Bad things happen when you leave your castle:

King Robert: Leaves castle to go hunting, gets gored and dies as the result of his wife's plotting.
Ned: Leaves Winterfell to become Hand of the King, offered the kingdom by dying friend, gets beheaded by his kid.
Theon: Leaves the Iron Islands, goes on offensive against the North, gets captured and tortured.
Tyrion: Goes outside of Kings Landing twice. First he gets captured by Katelyn's crazy sister; then outside the walls at Blackwater, he is almost assassinated by his own man.
Jamie: Leaves for war, captured, loses hand
Robb: Wins every battle, loses the war. RIP
Stannis:Goes to war, gets whooped at Blackwater
Renly:Goes to war, gets assassinated


Good things happen when you stay home:

Walder Frey: Does not commit his troops, gets to make a deal
Tywin: Writes letters from various towers, wins the war against the North
Joffery/Cerci:Hide during Blackwater, end up getting saved. The only time Joffery ventures out into city streets, he almost causes a riot

Possible Exceptions So Far:
Dany: When she is moving around, she is conquering. When she sits still, her damn dragons get stolen.
Bran and Rickon:Stayed at Winterfell and had to escape its siege.
Jon Snow:Leaves Winterfell, but he isn't really playing the Game.

Part of playing the Game of Thrones is knowing when to strike and when to sit back and let your enemies kill each other. So far, the "scum" have played defense, to devastating effect. Tywin Lannister has proven to be the master of this so far. Once they have secured their victory over the North, it will be interesting to see if they fall into complacency or overplay their hands (and pay the price).

As we've seen, GRRM is not afraid to turn his rules on their ear. I do expect those Swiss Cheese holes to appear very shortly.

 

[MadCardDisease]

As we've seen, GRRM is not afraid to turn his rules on their ear. I do expect those Swiss Cheese holes to appear very shortly.

Ha! They are GRRMs rules now? I don't think GRRM has any rules.

 

[D-Dogg]

How about readers put this:

Book Spoiler:

Spoiler

stuff that is awesome, because the books ARE effing awesome

I'm guessing that will save some stress and drama, and some panties as well, plus reader-watchers can co-mingle with only watchers without spoiling some of the twists and turns.

BTW, one of the cool sites about the books has a scope feature where you put in what books you have completed and what seasons you have watched, and it filters out spoiler stuff from the other books/seasons. Pretty clever. Great site, too: http://towerofthehand.com

 

[MadCardDisease]

Kind of an anti-climatic season ending after the Red Wedding episode. Still freaking awesome. Man it's going to be a long wait for Season 4 to come out!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Kind of an anti-climatic season ending after the Red Wedding episode. Still freaking awesome. Man it's going to be a long wait for Season 4 to come out!

agreed. seems like this is how the show operates...they blow the roof of in the penultimate episode every season and the final works to mop up the aftermath and then the second half is pretty much all set up for what's to come next season.

truth be told, if I never saw another Theon scene, I'd be happy. Are we supposed to be all excited for Theon's sister to go rescue him? I really couldn't give two craps about any part of that storyline moving forward.

The final shot with Dany was pretty good, as usual all the scenes with the Lannisters were out of this world...and all the scenes with all men Stark were just meh. The only Stark who's journey is interesting is Arya and the Hound. Me thinks she may be the first Stark to really understand what it takes to win the Game Of Thrones.

 

[crisper57]

agreed. seems like this is how the show operates...they blow the roof of in the penultimate episode every season and the final works to mop up the aftermath and then the second half is pretty much all set up for what's to come next season.

truth be told, if I never saw another Theon scene, I'd be happy. Are we supposed to be all excited for Theon's sister to go rescue him? I really couldn't give two craps about any part of that storyline moving forward.

The final shot with Dany was pretty good, as usual all the scenes with the Lannisters were out of this world...and all the scenes with all men Stark were just meh. The only Stark who's journey is interesting is Arya and the Hound. Me thinks she may be the first Stark to really understand what it takes to win the Game Of Thrones.

So true. It was really necessary this season, with so many story lines abruptly ending last week, to reset the game board. They needed to position the pieces for the events to come next year.

Plus, don't forget that this season was only the first half of the third book, so their job at creating a climactic finale was even harder than previous seasons. The source material was only halfway finished.

The wait until next season is going to suuuuuuuuuuuuck. I am glad they are taking their time so they can give each big moment its due, but damn, waiting almost a year to see the story continue blows.

 

[MadCardDisease]

truth be told, if I never saw another Theon scene, I'd be happy. Are we supposed to be all excited for Theon's sister to go rescue him? I really couldn't give two craps about any part of that storyline moving forward.

Come on. Ramsay eating a sausage was pretty damn funny. Twisted but funny. He is one sick Bastard.

 

[crisper57]

Looking around the Internet today, lots of reviews are calling this season the best so far. I dunno about that. Can one scene make an entire season? Because let's face it, without the Red Wedding, wouldn't Season 3 feel more like Season 2?

I still think Ned's season was the best so far, mostly because it had not yet exploded into 10,000 character arcs and we had time to get to know the main players of that season. I think Season 3 was incredible, and the Red Wedding was the single greatest/horrible thing I've ever seen on TV, but there were parts that dragged.

I think Season 4 has the potential to be the best because it has the right mix of big moments and character development. Instead of lots of walking/talking and then one big moment in the 9th episode, we may get 4 or 5 big moments sprinkled throughout the season, depending on how they choose to adapt certain elements.


Also, can JJ Abrams just cast the actor who plays Tywin to be the big bad Sith Lord in the new Star Wars (presuming there is one)? Or he cold be a perfect Admiral Thrawn! He is a friggin bad ass!

 

[TJ]

I liked the end of Season 2 better, but it seemed like the sole motivation for last night's episode was to prepare you for Season 4. Tywin begins to challenge Joffery, Dany continues to grow a large army, Stannis and co. going to the Wall, Jamie and Cersei are reunited, etc. etc. etc.

The timing of the Red Wedding was genius. Kill off several revered prominant characters (much to the chagrin of Stark supporters) in the second to last episode and spend one more episode cleaning the mess and showing you why you need to continue watching or go read the books.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Looking around the Internet today, lots of reviews are calling this season the best so far. I dunno about that. Can one scene make an entire season? Because let's face it, without the Red Wedding, wouldn't Season 3 feel more like Season 2?

I still think Ned's season was the best so far, mostly because it had not yet exploded into 10,000 character arcs and we had time to get to know the main players of that season. I think Season 3 was incredible, and the Red Wedding was the single greatest/horrible thing I've ever seen on TV, but there were parts that dragged.

I think Season 4 has the potential to be the best because it has the right mix of big moments and character development. Instead of lots of walking/talking and then one big moment in the 9th episode, we may get 4 or 5 big moments sprinkled throughout the season, depending on how they choose to adapt certain elements.


Also, can JJ Abrams just cast the actor who plays Tywin to be the big bad Sith Lord in the new Star Wars (presuming there is one)? Or he cold be a perfect Admiral Thrawn! He is a friggin bad ass!

Yeah... I still don't think this season holds a candle to season 1. Seemed that being said, it was pretty damn good TV and flat out riveting during evbry moment with at Kings landing, the Lannisters, Arya and the Hound.

 

[D-Dogg]

Cheese, have you read the books?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cheese, have you read the books?

nope.