Henry for Shelton trade agreed in principle.

[Pariah]

How can anyone not like this trade?

For the simple reason that good linemen are much harder to come by this offseason than RBs. I feel like we could have gotten a decent back to combine with Shipp for a 1-2 punch that would have worked fine.

(not that we'll need a ground attack next season with Frye throwing all those TDs...)

But again, it's not that I dislike the trade, rather it's that I wouldn't really want to trade Shelton at all. The trade is pretty good if he was going to be dealt.

 

[CardinalLaw]

I remember Green saying that he liked Clarett somewhere in the second day (rounds 4-7)

I believe he said if he doesn't go in the first day he is a steal in day 2.

 

[arthurracoon]

I believe he said if he doesn't go in the first day he is a steal in day 2.

ahh

 

[Zeno]

You're ready to give Shipp his walking papers? I'd sooner get rid of Hambrick than Shipp...much sooner.

I meant Hambrick/Shipp...somehow left him out, if he comes back healthy I see no reason why he can't be a big part of the running game and provide quality depth.

 

[jstadvl]

This was not

about LJ playing LT but about playing time period. He was out of shape because of the rehab of his leg. Ever tried to workout the rest of your body when your legs have been worked on ? At 300+lbs.? Didn't think so.
They requested a chance to see if there was interest in him. Who wouldn't? Maybe if there was it would open up Greens stubborn blind eye!
Is the trade a good one? We'll see. It is for all the "we need a great RB" suppoters. Those of us that know LJ was the best offensive lineman we've had in a long time might not think so.
But my point, is Lj is being made to e malcontent ,to a degree, and when I saw him at the scrimmage he schooled Berry, took his seasonal demotion like a man, took Greeen's back handed insults like a man and did evrything he could to help us win.
LJ was not looking for a way out of AZ. Players, many times do what their agents tell them is in their own best Interest. I ha ven't heard squat come out of LJ's mouth. Anyone else?
If not then don't put words in his mouth because you can "read between the lines".
As I said, LJ isn't the only one who's agent has him making sure ALL of his options are covered with Green at the helm.

 

[Scott MS]

Cards may be in a position for quite a battle during training camp at the RB position if this trade comes off. Further, I think they will still take a RB in the draft if a value presents itself.

We may see all the following in camp:

1. Henry
2. Shipp
3. Hambrick
4. Draft Choice
5. Scobey
6. Croom

I think it's safe to say that Anderson is done.

 

[Redsz]

about LJ playing LT but about playing time period. He was out of shape because of the rehab of his leg. Ever tried to workout the rest of your body when your legs have been worked on ? At 300+lbs.? Didn't think so.
They requested a chance to see if there was interest in him. Who wouldn't? Maybe if there was it would open up Greens stubborn blind eye!
Is the trade a good one? We'll see. It is for all the "we need a great RB" suppoters. Those of us that know LJ was the best offensive lineman we've had in a long time might not think so.
But my point, is Lj is being made to e malcontent ,to a degree, and when I saw him at the scrimmage he schooled Berry, took his seasonal demotion like a man, took Greeen's back handed insults like a man and did evrything he could to help us win.
LJ was not looking for a way out of AZ. Players, many times do what their agents tell them is in their own best Interest. I ha ven't heard squat come out of LJ's mouth. Anyone else?
If not then don't put words in his mouth because you can "read between the lines".
As I said, LJ isn't the only one who's agent has him making sure ALL of his options are covered with Green at the helm.

He was out of shape! It was an entirley different coaching staff and you don't just expect to be given a starting postion in that situation. What kind of message would that have sent to the rest of the players for LJ to just be handed the postion after coming in WAY over weight?

If it isn't about playing LT and 'he just wants to play'. Then why is he asking to be traded? Why isn't he happy starting at RT in Arizona? It is painfully obvious that he wants to be a starting LT on another team and I have no problem with that what so ever.

NO ONE is painting the picture that Shelton is a melcontent. I think it's pretty much universal that Shelton is a good guy and good teamate.

But when you seek permission to look for a trade it is obvious that you want out. There is no other way of looking at it.

 

[Redsz]

Just an update. On NFL Network they are reporting the same thing I was told in regards to the trade. Looking like it is going to go down.

 

[CardinalLaw]

Been trying to study up on our newest RB. Here is a fantasy mock draft that has him ranked at #9 after 2003. Not bad I must say. http://www.geocities.com/kac1999/rbacks03.html

Travis Henry (BUF) – Huge second year bustout with 1,438 rushing yards along with a nice 4.4 average and 14 scores. Will be working for a huge contract with another outfit this year after team drafted Willis McGahee in the first round. The injured McGahee will be a situational player at best this year, so don’t lower Henry’s status by much.

I truly don't think a huge contract is instore for him. maybe a midrange RB, but stats like that dont' lie. The guy can play, if anybody disagrees with giving up L.J. for a R.B. that had 1438 yards and 14 t.d.'s must be insane.
He is before plenty of big talent. Taylor, Barber, Green, Lewis, Dillon, Martin, and about 17 places infront of Shipp.

 

[green machine]

I remember Green saying that he liked Clarett somewhere in the second day (rounds 4-7)

I don't recall every saying that. How dare you misquote me!

Oh

 

[black]

Travis Henry is a workhorse and a great all around back. If this is true kudos to the front office. Henry is a great receiver too.

 

[CaptTurbo]

Don't worry, a good RT and a better RG will be coming.

This is a huge addition. HUGE. Ya'll will be stunned the Bills let him go for So Cheap!

OMG WildBB we agree 100%. This "draft a RB" is crap. Roll a 100 sided die and pray it lands on 1-10 thats about the same odds as drafting a back like henry. Why risk it.

This is great. Now we can draft/aquire a solid RG (not all 5 spots have to be filled by #1 picks) then Id be happy with Clement with a great RG next to him.

But w ewill finally have a back!!!!!

I can tell by the posts 99% here have never seen him play. He is very good.

 

[az jam]

I believe the trade last year of Champ Bailey for Clinton Portis was contingent on contract signings for both. IMO if this trade is to take place the Cards will want to be able to extend Henry's contract. I think they could actually start that process now with everything being official as of March 2 when trades and free agency begin.

 

[Russ Smith]

For the simple reason that good linemen are much harder to come by this offseason than RBs. I feel like we could have gotten a decent back to combine with Shipp for a 1-2 punch that would have worked fine.

(not that we'll need a ground attack next season with Frye throwing all those TDs...)

But again, it's not that I dislike the trade, rather it's that I wouldn't really want to trade Shelton at all. The trade is pretty good if he was going to be dealt.

That's my feeling and also I'm just not a huge Travis Henry fan. I'll feel alot better if he agrees to an extension but we'll probably overpay him. I would much preferred getting Jordan and using LJ to get a draft pick or a different player. I've just never been a big fan of Henry, I realize he's had great years but he fumbles too much and he's not a big breakaway threat, he's about as likely as Shipp is to bust off a 20+ run(8 in Marcel's career, 17 in Henry's in just over double the attempts).

He's a good RB but if the market for Shelton was as good as we all are hearing, I'm not sure we got the best value for him.

For those saying now we don't have to draft a RB, unless Henry extends that doesn't change at all, we'll still probably take a RB because we're unsure of Shipp's health, and Henry will be in the last year of his contract.

He's a good player I just thought we'd get a better deal for LJ than Henry.

 

[Russ Smith]

Travis Henry is a workhorse and a great all around back. If this is true kudos to the front office. Henry is a great receiver too.

Admittedly I don't follow buffalo closely but the last 2 years Henry has averaged 5.6 and 4.5 yards per catch! That's not exactly what I would call a great receiver, 38 catches over that period.

My main concern with him right now is the fumbling and blitz pickups, if we start Josh or Navarre blitz pickups will be a huge deal because we'll get blitzed a ton.

 

[arthurracoon]

My main concern with him right now is the fumbling and blitz pickups, if we start Josh or Navarre blitz pickups will be a huge deal because we'll get blitzed a ton.

Supposedly he's a good blocker and good at blitz pickup.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I'm in the frame of mind that anything we got for Shelton was gravy because he would have likely been cut anyways. A second rounder would have been better I also am not a huge Henry fan (if him and McCown are our starting backfield they may combine to fumble around eighty times), but the guy is a proven runner at only 26 years old. And can someone explain to me how if RBs are so easy to obtain, how come we haven't a good one since Garrison Hearst left?

 

[Russ Smith]

Supposedly he's a good blocker and good at blitz pickup.

Nope that was actually the biggest reason they went to starting McGahee, if you look at the numbers Bledsoe got sacked like twice as often with Henry in there as with McGahee. I posted that a while back and a Buffalo fan who was on our board at the time said that indeed one of the biggest reasons for the switch was blitz pickups.

I looked it up before but it was something like 19 sacks in the 5 games Henry started and 18 in the games McGahee started, that's from memory don't quote me. It was quite dramatic although obviously there can be other factors such as the OL gelling, Bledsoe throwing the ball away more, who you're playing etc.

 

[arthurracoon]

Nope that was actually the biggest reason they went to starting McGahee, if you look at the numbers Bledsoe got sacked like twice as often with Henry in there as with McGahee. I posted that a while back and a Buffalo fan who was on our board at the time said that indeed one of the biggest reasons for the switch was blitz pickups.

I looked it up before but it was something like 19 sacks in the 5 games Henry started and 18 in the games McGahee started, that's from memory don't quote me. It was quite dramatic although obviously there can be other factors such as the OL gelling, Bledsoe throwing the ball away more, who you're playing etc.

hmm. interesting.

 

[joeshmo]

I would much preferred getting Jordan and using LJ to get a draft pick or a different player.

Why go into the season putting all of your eggs into one basket trying to sign the hottest commodity RB left now that Alexander will be franchised and most likely edge as well. Jordan will command big bucks now and a lot of teams will be in the bidding process for him, the likelyhood of us getting him is slim to none. So why not go for the sure thing in Henry who by the way will cost just as much as Jordan will IMO.

I've just never been a big fan of Henry, I realize he's had great years but he fumbles too much and he's not a big breakaway threat, he's about as likely as Shipp is to bust off a 20+ run(8 in Marcel's career, 17 in Henry's in just over double the attempts).

Henry doesnt have a fumbling problem anymore, see the What scares me about Henry thread.

As for breakaway threat, I think it is a slightly overrated item that people bring up far to often is it nice yeah but it isnt on the top of my list. Edge has just as many 20+ yard runs per attempt as Henry does, just get me 4+ yards a carry, TD's when we get in the red zone, and first downs.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Well I'll believe it when I see it. However I must say that I like this trade if it does go through. I think Shelton is a average tackle. This team hasn't had any success on the offensive line with it's current makeup and drastically needs a change. I believe that this trade works in both teams interests. I really believed that Green was going to just release Shelton last season. I'm so glad that we might actually get something real for him.

Sure Henry isn't a home run threat. But he will get you more than 3 yards per carry. I'm tired of second and eight! It's about time we have a RB that can get past the line of scrimmage.

If this deal goes through then we need to go after OL hard in Free Agency!

 

[Russ Smith]

Why go into the season putting all of your eggs into one basket trying to sign the hottest commodity RB left now that Alexander will be franchised and most likely edge as well. Jordan will command big bucks now and a lot of teams will be in the bidding process for him, the likelyhood of us getting him is slim to none. So why not go for the sure thing in Henry who by the way will cost just as much as Jordan will IMO.



Henry doesnt have a fumbling problem anymore, see the What scares me about Henry thread.

As for breakaway threat, I think it is a slightly overrated item that people bring up far to often is it nice yeah but it isnt on the top of my list. Edge has just as many 20+ yard runs per attempt as Henry does, just get me 4+ yards a carry, TD's when we get in the red zone, and first downs.

One year without fumbles and it's gone? What was it 2002 where every Fox game they'd tell you how Ahman Green has kicked the fumble habit, and now he's fumbled 7 times in each of the last 2 years and nobody talks about that anymore. Green is a notorious fumbler and Henry had 2 years where he fumbled more than Green ever did.

The whole point at RB this offseason I thought was to get a "speed back" who fit the mold of Robert Smith, Michael Bennett, or at least was "explosive", Henry isn't that guy. He's only been over 4 YPC twice, he's a "good" RB who we're probably going to overpay to keep around.

I do agree that Jordan's value is going up, but I don't really see the urgency on Henry. Buffalo wants to move him, we can fairly quickly find out what Jordan is looking for, if it's too much make the deal for Henry. We may have in fact already done that, I'm just assuming we haven't.

Henry is a solid RB but he has some major flaws that concern me, fumbles, injuries, blitz pickups. He just doesn't seem to me to be anything like the kind of RB Green has been successful with, not great speed, not great out of the backfield catching the ball. Jordan does everything we're supposedly looking for in a RB, and he's about twice as likely to rip off a big run as Henry.


My biggest concern with Henry is despite his age I think his best days are behind him, he's had a lot of injuries in a short timeframe from college to now.

I'm glad we got a RB I just wish it was someone who seemed to fit the scheme a bit better.

 

[jerryp]

I can tell by the posts 99% here have never seen him play. He is very good.

It also doesn't helped he got benched because the offensive line and passing game were sucking and the fans were clamoring for McGahee but ESPN et al. reports it as Henry wasn't getting the job done and the offense suddenly clicked with McGahee while completely ignoring the fact their win streak was a function of the best defense and special teams in the league.

I could go into more detail, but most people's arguments for running backs can be summarized by the following phrase;

"FOUR YARDS PER CARRY! FOUR YARDS PER CARRY! FOUR YARDS PER CARRY!"

 

[Russ Smith]

It also doesn't helped he got benched because the offensive line and passing game were sucking and the fans were clamoring for McGahee but ESPN et al. reports it as Henry wasn't getting the job done and the offense suddenly clicked with McGahee while completely ignoring the fact their win streak was a function of the best defense and special teams in the league.

I could go into more detail, but most people's arguments for running backs can be summarized by the following phrase;

"FOUR YARDS PER CARRY! FOUR YARDS PER CARRY! FOUR YARDS PER CARRY!"

Please do elaborate, I'd love to here more reasons why Henry is a great pickup.

From looking at stats I see Henry started 5 games, and Bledsoe was sacked 23 times in those 5 games. McGahee started 11 games, and Bledsoe was sacked 14 times in those games.

The 5 games Henry started were Jax, Oakland, New England, NY Jets and Baltimore, 4 very good defenses one bad one. So you would EXPECT more sacks in those games but not necessarily 3.5 times more sacks. So I'd love to hear other reasons because everything I read online says one of the biggest reasons for the RB switch was all the sacks.

 

[Pariah]

So you would EXPECT more sacks in those games but not necessarily 3.5 times more sacks. So I'd love to hear other reasons

You've probably also read a lot about the offensive line really coming together about midway through the season. That's been cited as a big reason for their turnaround, too.