How Long Before A Move Is Made?

[Superbone]

I had to read my post again to make sure I hadn't made some grand claim about the future.

You all but insured a championship.

 

[Phrazbit]

A below average player is going to make Houston a "lot stronger"? If we had traded for Brewer you'd be lamenting the fact we wasted our time on a marginal player.

Steve

No, what makes him upset is that we, at ~.500, are not making the same tanking decisions as a team with the worst record in the conference.

 

[AzStevenCal]

No, what makes him upset is that we, at ~.500, are not making the same tanking decisions as a team with the worst record in the conference.

Yeah, that too. But playing Goodwin 25 minutes a game isn't going to make him a Wiggins level prospect. I'm not even sure it will make him a Lavine, Bennett or Shabazz prospect. We have a lot more young talent than we did 2 seasons ago but it's not like we are particularly rich in that department.

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

You all but insured a championship.

And I stand by it. Now I just need to figure out for whom that championship bell will toll.

 

[Phrazbit]

Yeah, that too. But playing Goodwin 25 minutes a game isn't going to make him a Wiggins level prospect. I'm not even sure it will make him a Lavine, Bennett or Shabazz prospect. We have a lot more young talent than we did 2 seasons ago but it's not like we are particularly rich in that department.

Steve

I agree with you, I also think guys CAN develop outside of being on the court regularly in live games

The Suns spent a lot of money this off season, they need to try for more than 6-8 weeks to make things work before they blow up the entire roster and devote time to developing guys of questionable potential.

 

[Superbone]

And I stand by it. Now I just need to figure out for whom that championship bell will toll.

Bait and switch!

 

[sunsfan88]

A below average player is going to make Houston a "lot stronger"? If we had traded for Brewer you'd be lamenting the fact we wasted our time on a marginal player.

Steve

Lol I don't want Brewer on the Suns. I want us to unload vets like Minnesota is doing to pick up draft picks or assets. Or make a trade which eliminates a weakness of the team, that's what Dallas did with Rondo (Mavs needed a PG) and Houston with Brewer (They needed a good backup wing so Ariza isn't playing such heavy minutes).

Our weakness is obvious, front court.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Lol I don't want Brewer on the Suns. I want us to unload vets like Minnesota is doing to pick up draft picks or assets. Or make a trade which eliminates a weakness of the team, that's what Dallas did with Rondo (Mavs needed a PG) and Houston with Brewer (They needed a good backup wing so Ariza isn't playing such heavy minutes).

Our weakness is obvious, front court.

You made this comment though "Both Houston & Dallas get lot stronger". Dallas probably improved (and maybe by a lot), I don't see that move making much of a difference for Houston. As for Minnesota, they were always going to tank this season regardless of Flip's comments. And it makes sense for them to play their collection of young players. They have players that were drafted at 1, 1, 5, 13, 14 and 21. Contrast that with our young prospects.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

You made this comment though "Both Houston & Dallas get lot stronger". Dallas probably improved (and maybe by a lot), I don't see that move making much of a difference for Houston. As for Minnesota, they were always going to tank this season regardless of Flip's comments. And it makes sense for them to play their collection of young players. They have players that were drafted at 1, 1, 5, 13, 14 and 21. Contrast that with our young prospects.

Steve

So it only makes sense to play young players if they were drafted really high?

Again, a guy like TJ Warren who has an outstanding ability to put the ball in the hoop should be getting lot more minutes than he's had. Bad teams play their young players heavy minutes, why is it different for PHX? Heck im not even saying heavy, just like 20-25 mins a game.

 

[hcsilla]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...es-for-phoenix-suns-to-fix-point-guard-logjam

Here are some trade scenarios for IT, Dragic & Bledsoe. The proposals look interesting but not sure if HOU or UTA would actually do the trades. PHX needs to get rid of 2, Ennis needs to stay and back up the starter.

I don't like the UTA-deal at all.

I would let another team overpay Kanter next summer. He is poor man's Nikola Pekovic. Big, talented inside scorer but less of a rebounder and post defender.
Alec Burks is far away from justifying his 42 mil./4 year extension what he got from the Jazz who knows why. He is a polished slasher but I'm not sure that Archie Goodwin couldn't match his productivity rather sooner than later if he was given enough playing time.

At the same time the Jazz would be thrilled by the idea of the Bledsoe-Exum future backcourt and probably would deal their 2015 unprotected 1st rounder for Bledsoe but that would be as big step forward in their rebuilding process as big step back it would be in ours.

The Detroit-deal is just terrible for the Suns. Not only IT but also a 1st rounder for a half year rental of Monroe who we could sign outright next season anyway?
I simply don't get this.

As much as I love Dragic, I would strongly consider the Houston proposal.

Terrence Jones, a late lottery pick and a late 1st rounder is a very serious offer for the soon to be expiring Dragic.

Since the Suns obviously won't make the play-offs this season (unless one of the top West team stars gets injured ), it might be the time to face the fact that two PG's for 30 millions per year is not the proper way to build a successful team.

 

[BC867]

it might be the time to face the fact that two PG's for 30 millions per year is not the proper way to build a successful team.

It is interesting that, at the start of the game on TV, they show Bledsoe whenever they show a Point Guard matchup. He with one of the worst turnover stats in the league.

I have no doubt that the Suns tell Steve Albert and the TV crew whom to highlight where. And I have to believe that Suns management either told Dragic the same thing or left him to figure it out for himself.

So much for loyalty. And how not to attract desirable players in the future.

Even Hornacek's finding more minutes for the three lead Point Guards lately at the expense of front court players isn't going to impress free agents.

Not unless the NBA expands to seven positions on the court.

 

[sunsfan88]

It is interesting that, at the start of the game on TV, they show Bledsoe whenever they show a Point Guard matchup. He with one of the worst turnover stats in the league.

I have no doubt that the Suns tell Steve Albert and the TV crew whom to highlight where. And I have to believe that Suns management either told Dragic the same thing or left him to figure it out for himself.

So much for loyalty. And how not to attract desirable players in the future.

Even Hornacek's finding more minutes for the three lead Point Guards lately at the expense of front court players isn't going to impress free agents.

Not unless the NBA expands to seven positions on the court.

The way the Suns roster is set up, 7 may not be enough

 

[Errntknght]

I hate to say it but it makes most sense to trade Goran because of his age - I don't see us being in contention real soon and he's not likely to keep up his style of play for several more years the way Nash did at his age. Terrence Jones would be a nice piece in return and Houston could spare him - Tarik Black has been filling in for him quite well.

Things have been going well for Houston this year... so much so I figured they must have changed coaches. But no, McKale is still running the show. They just traded for Corey Brewer and depending on who they traded away they might not be willing to trade Jones. Another possible glitch is they may well want Goran re-signed since he left them once before. Or they may want nothing to do with him in any circumstances.

 

[95pro]

I'm not sure what the big deal with Brewer was, seemed like a lot of teams wanted him.

 

[sunsfan88]

I'm not sure what the big deal with Brewer was, seemed like a lot of teams wanted him.

I think it's because he scored fifty in a game once.

 

[Sci Fi]

Check out the Kelly Olynyk highlights from last night. There isn't another player at his position that can do a couple of these plays.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoP2zoepwdQ

Guy is going to be an amazing player. Definite All-NBA potential. Possibly a top 25 player as early as next year.

Bledsoe plus whatever it takes to get him except Len or Dragic. I'd start with the Lakers pick.

 

[asudevil83]

Check out the Kelly Olynyk highlights from last night. There isn't another player at his position that can do a couple of these plays.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoP2zoepwdQ

Guy is going to be an amazing player. Definite All-NBA potential. Possibly a top 25 player as early as next year.

Bledsoe plus whatever it takes to get him except Len or Dragic. I'd start with the Lakers pick.

He's good. He looks so freaking goofy though. The hair man, the hair. He looks like he's Chris Kaman's sister.

 

[JCSunsfan]

There are several ways to go about making a move that helps a team improve.

1. Wait for a superstar to become available and jump in with the best offer. (Charles Barkley, Jason Kidd).
2. Find a diamond in the rough potential star player buried on a deep roster and go get him. (Kevin Johnson).

I wanted to list "find the player you want and just go get him" but I cannot find any real examples of that that would not come under category #1.

When you are just trying to thin your roster, you usually lose.

Our roster is just too crowded right now. We are in the opposite position of #2. We have a crowded roster of good but not great players and some potentially REALLY good player gathering dust on the bench.

So, the next trade will probably be a "lose" transaction as far as what goes in and what comes out.

I am ready to give up on the playoffs and give Len, Warren, Ennis, and even Archie some burn.

 

[AzStevenCal]

There are several ways to go about making a move that helps a team improve.

1. Wait for a superstar to become available and jump in with the best offer. (Charles Barkley, Jason Kidd).
2. Find a diamond in the rough potential star player buried on a deep roster and go get him. (Kevin Johnson).

I wanted to list "find the player you want and just go get him" but I cannot find any real examples of that that would not come under category #1.

When you are just trying to thin your roster, you usually lose.

Our roster is just too crowded right now. We are in the opposite position of #2. We have a crowded roster of good but not great players and some potentially REALLY good player gathering dust on the bench.

So, the next trade will probably be a "lose" transaction as far as what goes in and what comes out.

I am ready to give up on the playoffs and give Len, Warren, Ennis, and even Archie some burn.

If you can trade the players in front of them for full value, great. But otherwise I think it's a losing strategy. It will drag the veterans down and won't help our trade options either. I think we should continue to try and win and if good trades come our way, slowly pare down this roster. I do agree we have too many rotation players. We need to find out if the young guys on the bench are just the next generation of rotation players or if one or more of them might actually have stardom in his future.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

Just saw this bit:
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24904619/trade-buzz-the-suns-goran-dragic-dilemma

 

[Superbone]

Just saw this bit:
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24904619/trade-buzz-the-suns-goran-dragic-dilemma

It's good to hear that they value Dragic the most.

 

[SirStefan32]

It's good to hear that they value Dragic the most.

I was surprised to see that in the article. If they value him the most, they sure have a funny way of showing it.

 

[Hoop Head]

According to ESPN Zoran Dragic can't be traded until December 26th and Bledsoe can't be moved until December 23rd due to when they each signed their deals in the offseason. I think if the Suns send Goran anywhere they'll wait until Zoran can be added to balance salaries some since Goran only makes 7.5 million a year but adding Zoran's 1.5 million would allow for a higher paid player to come back in return, plus opens a roster spot.

 

[Mainstreet]

I was surprised to see that in the article. If they value him the most, they sure have a funny way of showing it.

Maybe the Suns are showcasing the other PGs. I've always thought the Suns would prefer to keep Dragic unless they get an offer they can't refuse.

 

[Mainstreet]

According to ESPN Zoran Dragic can't be traded until December 26th and Bledsoe can't be moved until December 23rd due to when they each signed their deals in the offseason. I think if the Suns send Goran anywhere they'll wait until Zoran can be added to balance salaries some since Goran only makes 7.5 million a year but adding Zoran's 1.5 million would allow for a higher paid player to come back in return, plus opens a roster spot.

This is a good thought if the Suns were to part with Goran but I hope this is not their choice.