Is JJ THE MAN?

[Wally]

Originally posted by Chaplin
Was that an "official" poll?

Who cares about the thread, if you have a problem with it, start a new one or just don't post. Just stop whining about it!

I wasn't aware I was whining - Thanks for enlightening me. On the other hand, if I stopped "whining", I wouldn't be able to complain about those who whine about people who complain about people that complain about people who complin about Kobe Bryant..... Follow?
Be aware of what foot the shoe is on.

 

[elindholm]

Hmm, well since it's true that every thread ends up being about Bryant, I probably assumed that this one had too. But that could have been hasty.

 

[cly2tw]

People who now start thinking JJ was the Man, the franchise player for the Suns, apparently have short memories. Not long ago, when under pressure, JJ faltered two years in a roll. Without any pressure of winning or fighting for starting position, he have been displaying his talent lately. But he is born with that fragile psyche that's not easily going away, at least he hasn't proved the opposite yet. Ask yourselves the question, would MJ, Bryant, Carter, McGrady, Magic, Penny have failed the same way in similar situation?

 

[Chaz]

Originally posted by cly2tw
People who now start thinking JJ was the Man, the franchise player for the Suns, apparently have short memories. Not long ago, when under pressure, JJ faltered two years in a roll. Without any pressure of winning or fighting for starting position, he have been displaying his talent lately. But he is born with that fragile psyche that's not easily going away, at least he hasn't proved the opposite yet. Ask yourselves the question, would MJ, Bryant, Carter, McGrady, Magic, Penny have failed the same way in similar situation?

I seem to remember Kobe firing some airballs in the playoffs as a young player. McGrady didn't really do much before he became the man in Orlando.

What pressure was JJ under before? I would say he was more uncomfortable than under pressure.

I don't know if JJ will be a consistant franchise player or not. I always thought he had the talent to be. I don't see how his past performance proves he isn't or won't be.

 

[cly2tw]

All I'm saying is that JJ has a fragile psyche and I wouldn't already bet my franchise on him before he proves he could perform under pressure. With his talent, however, I'd have no problem if the plan is for him to take a Pippen-like role on this team, to whom JJ's talent is well comparable.

 

[Chaz]

Originally posted by cly2tw
All I'm saying is that JJ has a fragile psyche and I wouldn't already bet my franchise on him before he proves he could perform under pressure. With his talent, however, I'd have no problem if the plan is for him to take a Pippen-like role on this team, to whom JJ's talent is well comparable.

I am just curious what proof you have of his mental makeup. Is this conclusion based only on what you have seen on TV or at the game? Have you given him a psychiatric evaluation? Have you seen results of some such evaluation?
I am not trying to be a prick. I am just trying to sort fact from opinion.

I mean the guy seems pretty quiet and reserved but I haven't seen anything that would make me label him "fragile".

Of course I was never sold on Kobe coming here anyway but as a fan I would rather see the Suns go with a young player like JJ rather than hire some mercenary like Bryant for a huge potentially cap busting salary.

 

[cly2tw]

The Suns did four cap busting signing in a roll: Googs, Penny, Marion, Marbury's extension. Only Marbury's is justifiable in hindsight, since he is a durable and reliable franchise player, and thanks to which the Suns are going to be under cap first time in a long while. Kobe is a no-brainer, in that even if we want to move him later due to chemistry, we can get a lot in return!! Contrast that with Marion, who has negative trade value now, as Joe put it.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by cly2tw
All I'm saying is that JJ has a fragile psyche and I wouldn't already bet my franchise on him before he proves he could perform under pressure. With his talent, however, I'd have no problem if the plan is for him to take a Pippen-like role on this team, to whom JJ's talent is well comparable.

The theory that JJ had fragile psyche may have been over blown. Being young and immature is not the same as fragile.

An equally plausible theory is that JJ benefited from being moved to the first option rather than the third or fourth he was when Marbury was on the team. Frequently JJ was getting the ball with little time ont he clock or driving or passing off was not always an option. In this theory, JJ has taken over the role that Marbury played and making the most of it.

I am leaning more and more to this theory because he has been able to overcome bad patches. Against the Rockets, he missed five shots in a row yet finished strong and was 11 of 21 from the field.

 

[cly2tw]

George,

you make it too easy on JJ. Before the trade, he was also attacking the basket with enough time to get off his shot. But he just seemed to lack the confidence that those shots didn't go in as often. Everybody including himself said more or less that his inconsistancy was due to his lack of confidence. Marbury's dominating the ball certainly aggreviates it a bit, but the fact is he didn't perform then when we are in playoff race and when the games count. So, at least, you gotta test him under pressure like in playoff races and in playoff games before declaring him the next franchise player here.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by cly2tw
George,

you make it too easy on JJ. Before the trade, he was also attacking the basket with enough time to get off his shot. But he just seemed to lack the confidence that those shots didn't go in as often. Everybody including himself said more or less that his inconsistancy was due to his lack of confidence. Marbury's dominating the ball certainly aggreviates it a bit, but the fact is he didn't perform then when we are in playoff race and when the games count. So, at least, you gotta test him under pressure like in playoff races and in playoff games before declaring him the next franchise player here.

JJ did attack the basket some, but much of his problem came when he tried to be a catch and shoot, "spot up", shooter off Marbury's drives. Marbury may not like Van Horn, but that's the kind of player he needed.

Will JJ perform under playoff pressure? That is always a difficult test. Too often sports writers blame the pressure, when the real problem is that the refs permit a lot more contact without calling fouls, thus hurting good offensive players. At the same time, the whole point of the playoffs is that you are playing an extremely good team that will put their best defender on your best offensive player.

One example of a guy who had a bad reputation in the playoffs was Clieff Robinson. His numbers would always go way down. The problem was that Cliff was the team's best defender, so he would be asked to defend against guys like David Robinson and would invariably get into foul trouble. It wasn't the pressure that got to him (as he proved in Detroit), it was the situation.

 

[arthurracoon]

JJ IS THE MAN

 

[Chaplin]

I'm wondering if JJ this evening did anything to turn around Eric's opinion of him?

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by Chaplin
I'm wondering if JJ this evening did anything to turn around Eric's opinion of him?

Apparently being down by more than 20 points is not enough pressure.

 

[elindholm]

I'm wondering if JJ this evening did anything to turn around Eric's opinion of him?

I'm not there yet. I really wanted to see him get the call for the potential game-tying shot. If he had made it, that would have pushed me over the edge to being a believer. But for some unfathomable reason the decision was made to go to Marion, who isn't a good shooter from the top of the circle even on a good day.

So I'll have to wait, but I'm keeping an open mind.